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  #31  
Old 08-27-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowButSteady View Post
(e.g., gate valves on thru-hulls, mild steel used in structural supports, et cetera).
I know about the gate valves and the plywood in the sump that causes the Catalina smile but where is the mild steel and which models?
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  #32  
Old 08-27-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowButSteady View Post
(e.g., gate valves on thru-hulls, mild steel used in structural supports, et cetera).
I know about the gate valves and the plywood in the sump that causes the Catalina smile but where is the mild steel and which models have it?
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  #33  
Old 08-27-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

I have a 1986 Cal 22, when I bought the boat I knew little about what made a good or bad boat. Since I have been on many other boats that I do not consider as high quality as my Cal, those boast being Hunters, Catalina 22's, and Macgregors all around the same size.
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  #34  
Old 08-27-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

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Originally Posted by vtsailguy View Post
I should add that I am on my 3rd boat... and starting to become more sensitive to the question of quality.

When you are buying 20-30 year old boats, whether the manufacturer spent that extra time and effort to make those chinplates bulletproof starts becoming important
If you have already owned 3 boats, don't you kind of know already which boats are the best quality? It kind of looks like to me that this is another "lets beat up on MacGregor, Hunter, Beneteau, and Catalina" thread. If you want to push over trees, buy a Caterpillar, if you want to farm fields, buy Massy Ferguson or similar. That caterpillar is going to take a lot more abuse than the Massy Ferguson, but that doesn't make it a good match for typical farming. And buying a worn out caterpillar to get the rugged construction, and then using it for row farming is just making the situation worse.

I, for one, like those production brands that so many of you turn your noses up at. They give average people like me a reasonably good boat, completely suited for the way that average people are likely to use them. i.e., For the same money, I get a newer, larger, better equipped boat that will more than be a match for anything that I or mother nature will throw at it in the operating environment where I will be using it. My Catalina 320 that I bought new in 1999/2000 has done well, looks good in my eyes, and has never had serious maintenance problems. Of course, I could have bought a worn out caterpillar (I mean older quality boat) and knocked my self and my bank account out trying to keep it operating (oops...that is upgrading it) and still had something not worth very much, even through the brand is assumed to be better quality.
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  #35  
Old 08-27-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

Over the years I have found that perceptions fuel a lot of the opinions on what "quality" is in boats. I recall back in the early 70's the Taiwan leaky teakies - Formosa, CT, Island Trader etc. 41's were seen as the epitome of quality, largely due to all the teak and bronze bits. At the same time Columbias were seen as inferior quality because they had so much plastic - liners etc.

40 years on those perceptions have been turned on their head - we all know the failings of the Taiwan boats of that era and most of the Columbias are still sailing with their original decks and masts.

Which is not to say that there aren't actual differences in build quality in boats - a Swan IS better built than a Hunter. For 3-4-5 times the price it BETTER be.

Value is an equally important attribute unless you have an unlimited budget or intend sailing in high latitudes or other demanding circumstances.
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Old 08-28-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vtsailguy:914486
I should add that I am on my 3rd boat... and starting to become more sensitive to the question of quality.

When you are buying 20-30 year old boats, whether the manufacturer spent that extra time and effort to make those chinplates bulletproof starts becoming important
Chances are the manufacturer did not make anything bullet proof, that falls at the feet of a owner(s). Look at the joinery, look at the subframing that will indicate built quality.
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Old 08-29-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

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Originally Posted by davidpm View Post
I know about the gate valves and the plywood in the sump that causes the Catalina smile but where is the mild steel and which models have it?
I am not sure about the Catalina's but a number of boats including the Endeavour 33 used unprotected mild steel in the mast step support. Without maintenance it rusted out badly and became a very expensive repair as all the head cabinetry usually needed to be removed to fix it.

I don't think they were the only company to do use steel in the mast step, but I doubt you will see that kind of construction on a more modern boat, an experiment of the time.

Oddly the Endeavour 33 used an entire grid of fiberglass encapsulated steel throughout the sole of the boat. On the one I saw there didn't seem to be any issues with delamination and the boat was almost thirty years old. Go figure.
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Old 08-29-2012
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Re: Sailboat Quality

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Originally Posted by caberg View Post
Ended up buying through Bruce Hill Yacht Sales and they made it a very smooth, easy transaction. We closed on August 4, launched the boat that same day, and have been sailing as much as possible since.
I got my first boat through BH

What you get and where are you moored?
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  #39  
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Re: Sailboat Quality

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Originally Posted by NCC320 View Post
If you have already owned 3 boats, don't you kind of know already which boats are the best quality? It kind of looks like to me that this is another "lets beat up on MacGregor, Hunter, Beneteau, and Catalina" thread.
Its really not. I have a vague sense that for boats in 70's/80's that Cals and O'Days are good, hunters and caltalina's not so much. The others I have no clue.

When I buy a cordless screwdiver I know DeWalt will last and Craftsman will not take much use. For boats, I am still a novice.
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Re: Sailboat Quality

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When I buy a cordless screwdiver I know DeWalt will last and Craftsman will not take much use.
You should get a Craftsman from the 70's probably made from forged high carbon steel, bullet proof. Course it'll be twice as heavy as required, akward to handle and need to be rewired just like a boat from that era.
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