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  #11  
Old 10-25-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

This happened to me one time, only it was southern Florida. My boat was there for repairs. I ended up having to hire two Crane's because they sold the travel lift and my vessel was 58 tons I finally got my Boat back in the water after moving it 500 feet with a locally owned lowboy trailer.and using the same two cranes to put the boat in the water. This was exceedingly expensive and I had to pay for both the cranes and the trailer and the Semi which was specially designed to move houses........ very expensive. CaptG ps:get something in writing from the bank or the receiver......
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Old 10-25-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

Winter it elsewhere to be safe.

dave
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisncate View Post
Possession is nine tenths of the law.. I'd be worried about my boat if I were in your position, let alone what you've paid up for.
This is true...and it is possible to get titles to boats "left on your property"
Good news is travel lift operating instructions are online
Really I doubt you have to worry but it is a possibility...I would move it just to sleep better at night.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

Wow. Most of the above is guesswork and common sense, but may have no relation to the bankruptcy laws, wherever you are. Presumably NJ?

First, it will depend on what type of bankruptcy they file for. If a reorganization, they will remain open and try to have the courts reduce their unsecured debts. If liquidation, they will close and a court appointed receiver is usually appointed to maintain value in the property or business for the creditors.

If you've prepaid anything, you may be one of those unsecured creditors in the reorganization. They owe you and are asking the courts not to have to pay. Generally, however, if they are trying to remain in business, it isn't their customers they are trying to shake off.

If liquidating, its substantially more complicated. If the bank financed the property, they have zero interest in your boat or whatever deal you made with the marina. They lent on the real estate and need the collateral value from it. They didn't get into the deal as a partner in the marina business. Often marinas are more valuable as waterfront property, so keeping marina customers may be of little concern. If, however, they see selling the property to another operator as the most likely outcome, they may try to maintain the relationships. Remember, they won't have the money you paid, so anything they spend to keep staff or operate lifts is coming out of their pocket. That is going to have to make economic sense for them to do it. In most cases, I will bet it doesn't.
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  #15  
Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

You certainly have valid concerns. Sailnet member jaronson would have valuable information to contribute as a fellow Virginia-licensed attorney who has actually foreclosed on a marina.

If the owner files chapter 11, the owner is usually allowed to continue operations as the debtor in possession. If mismanagement is suspected, a trustee may be appointed to manage operations. You may be a creditor of the chapter 11 debtor who should participate in the process by filing a proof of claim and tracking the procedure. A larger debtor with numerous creditors may have a creditors committee consisting of the largest creditors with a greater say in the direction of the bankruptcy. Chapter 11s sometime end up converting to chapter 7 liquidations, in which the assets may be sold off piecemeal to pay the claims.

If the noteholder exercises its rights against collateral, which may include real and personal property, it would likely continue to operate the marina as a going concern provided it can generate cash flow, while it shops the property for a new owner. As business valuations are often based on multiples of gross revenue, the bank may have an interest in demonstrating the revenue potential of the marina when properly managed.

The travelift may have financing separate from the mortgage/deed of trust against the real property, in which case that lender may repossess the property and sell it. Given the relatively high costs of moving the travelift and its value in relaunching the boats currently on the hard, it seems unlikely, although not impossible, that someone may remove it from the marina.

Capt. Randall's experience would likely be the worst possible case. You and the other owners may have to rent equipment to remove your property. While statutory and contractual liens exist, they give the storage company/marina/bailee rights only in the event of a default in payment. Although a popular saying, in reality "possession is [not] 9/10s of the law". Legal title and rights matters more. If you decide to keep your boat on the hard, I would keep the marina/lender updated with your contact information so you can arrange for continued payment to the appropriate party.

Obviously, the safest course is to not store your boat there.

This is general information and not legal advice. I am not licensed in N.J. and am not giving any information specific to the laws of that state.

Last edited by jameswilson29; 10-26-2012 at 06:53 AM.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

I would choose to pay the extra few hundred dollars and move it to another marina just to play it safe. If the marina goes into bankruptcy, the gates will be locked with "no trespassing" signs. More than likely you will have to have a lawyer to deal with the bank to get anything accomplished. I wouldn't put anything past banks today as to what they will do. You will be little concern to them.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

Boats are titled and registered just like cars, a parking lot owner going bankrupt does NOT mean the bank now owns the cars in the lot.

The difference is car's can be driven off the lot - Gary's story of renting a crane may apply.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

First, thanks everyone and especially James for your input.

As I said the conversation yesterday set off some alarm bells for me, and you go through that "am I reading too much into this" mental excercise.

After sleeping on it I've decided to winter at a neighboring marina where I'm doing the storm haul out. I'm probably being overly cautious, but for a few dollars difference I'll sleep better this winter. And that too has a value.
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Last edited by JimMcGee; 10-26-2012 at 10:48 AM.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMcGee View Post
Here's the scenario:
  • You've paid your winter storage and your boat is hauled out and sitting on stands in the yard.
  • The marina goes bankrupt. There's no one to run the travel lift and the bank has liened everthing in sight.
  • Can you get your boat out, and how many hoops do you have to jump through to do it?

Has anyone encountered this situation?

Jim
This actually happened to a marina/boat yard in our neighborhood several years ago. We had a boat in there but fortunately were given a heads up as to what was about to go down by a marine surveyor friend who had an office in the marina yard. No one had been given any notice as to what was happening but we went down to work on the boat one weekend and the power was turned off everywhere except the main building. Then one evening my husband went by and saw a group of strange people in the office appearing to go through all the file cabinets. (It was a small father/son operation and we had never seen anyone except the two of them and their office girl in that office before.) When we noticed our friend's office had been vacated we called him and he said, get the heck out of there before they slap a lock on the gate. We were not permanent tenants. We were just hauled there to do some maintenance, so we had a regular slip elsewhere that we were able to move our boat to.

Things hadn't been "finalized" yet so we tracked down the owner (at a local crab house he and his father also owned) and got him to launch us. A couple of weeks later it was all closed up, with a lot of boats still stored inside.

Fortunately several months later a new owner had taken over, made a lot of improvements to the place and was back to business as usual. But a lot of people were stuck inside in the meantime. The part that we found so appalling was that no notice was given to people so they would have an opportunity to leave before things were locked up. So sad.

I'm not sure what would have happened or what recourse would have been if the facility had not re-opened. I'm just glad we got out.
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Last edited by oldragbaggers; 10-26-2012 at 09:26 AM.
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Old 10-26-2012
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Re: Hauled Out & Marina Closes, What Happens?

If the bank were to take the business over, or it was shuttered due to a Chapter 11 filing, there are normally reps on site within a couple of days to handle the returning of boat owner's property. As mentioned, the cost to launch may be on the owner, as it's not a lot different than an auto repair place closing overnight, where the receiver wouldn't pay to have the cars towed to another location.
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