Retractable Bowsprit DIY - Page 2 - SailNet Community
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post #11 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

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Originally Posted by Joel H. View Post
I see. Well obviously I need to do a little thinking. And probably take another sailor's suggestion...
Here is a suggestion: make life easier on yourself and buy a symmetrical spinnaker. The conventional spinnaker pole will project the spinnaker much better than any sprit you can rig.

Benefits:

You will be much faster dead down wind.

You will improve the resale value of your boat.

You will look like a sailing stud who knows what he is doing.

You will experience mucho excitement when you jibe the spinnaker in heavy air.

You will save much time not attempting to rig something your boat was never designed to carry.
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post #12 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

If a boat is not already set up for a symetric spinnaker, it is much more complicated and expensive to do than an a-kite. You will need a longer pole with ends, a mast track and car, (or at minimum a ring), a pole uphaul and downhaul, tweakers, or on a bigger boat, dedicated guys and forward leads for those guys. Symetric kites are more complicated to rig and to fly. Gybing requires someone to go forward. If you are single handing you will have to rely on an auto helm, or lock off the helm. If you are in seas with any kind of wind you can get into big trouble if a wave knocks you off course while you are gybing the pole. Sure, those of us who race and have flown spinnakers for years can pull it off, and yes we look god-like when we do! having said that, there is no way I would recommend it to a newbie.

It is true that you can sail deeper with a symetric chute, but DDW sucks! It is the slowest point of sail, and I avoid it if I can!

1979 Santana 30 Tall Rig
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post #13 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

Practical Sailor did a nice article on the proliferation of long noses on boats, both new and add on's.

Bottom line Joel - unless you SERIOUSLY reinforce the ENTIRE bow area for loads in all directions (including shear) you might wind up with an expensive bit of rhino-plasty the first time it gets all white knuckle on you.
Your bow was not designed for loads in front of the bow, and it will interfere with anchoring.

Lessons learned are opportunities earned.
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post #14 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

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...and yes we look god-like when we do!
Thanks for the comparison and for providing me with a segue to post another of my singlehanded spinnaker videos (purely for the benefit of the OP). Doesn't this look like fun, forget the sprit project:

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post #15 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

Hey,

I haven't read the PS article, but your comment seems a little too strong. There are numerous companies manufacturing and selling retractable bowsprints for older boats, including CatalinaDirect:

Catalina Direct: Cruising Spinnaker Retractable Bowsprit Kit

note that the kit is specifically recommended for the C27.

I'm not suggesting that you should fly a monster chute off a 10' homemade sprit, but the benefits of a sprit are well documented and the sprit seems to be the future of sailing, especially when used with 'code' sails.

I race on an old (1980) c&c 34. The owner is constantly updating the boat. For last season he added a code 0 sail for reaching in light air. He didn't add a sprit for this, but we do use the spin pole as makeshift sprit and it seems to work ok.

Furling the code sail is MUCH easier than dropping a chute, especially when sailing with an inexperienced crew.

Barry



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Originally Posted by chucklesR View Post
Practical Sailor did a nice article on the proliferation of long noses on boats, both new and add on's.

Bottom line Joel - unless you SERIOUSLY reinforce the ENTIRE bow area for loads in all directions (including shear) you might wind up with an expensive bit of rhino-plasty the first time it gets all white knuckle on you.
Your bow was not designed for loads in front of the bow, and it will interfere with anchoring.

Barry Lenoble
Deep Blue C, 2002 C&C 110
Mt. Sinai, NY

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post #16 of Old 01-08-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

Yeah, what Barry said....LOL

Seriously though, I'm appreciating all the feedback and have, based on the range of opinions, decided to throttle back my enthusiasm and get better educated in order to weigh all the pros and cons. I decided I need to hook up with more experienced sailors, in the spring, in hopes of getting a better idea of all the ins and outs of downwind sails.
Quote:Furling the code sail is MUCH easier than dropping a chute, especially when sailing with an inexperienced crew.
----See I like this idea, this is what is motivating me!

Lastly, in response to Chuckles: I'm not an engineer but I'm pretty sure my Catalina 27 is a little more solid than all that. But I appreciate the concern!

Last edited by Joel H.; 01-08-2013 at 05:17 PM.
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post #17 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

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Furling the code sail is MUCH easier than dropping a chute, especially when sailing with an inexperienced crew.
I've never used a Code sail with a furler. Can you compare the easy of furling it to using an asymmetrical with a sock? Both have a similar end result (pull on a line and put the whole sail into a linear form) but do it in very different ways.

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post #18 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

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I've never used a Code sail with a furler. Can you compare the easy of furling it to using an asymmetrical with a sock? Both have a similar end result (pull on a line and put the whole sail into a linear form) but do it in very different ways.
This video will give you an idea. (It's a commercial from my sailmaker)
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post #19 of Old 01-08-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

Hi Alex,

First let me state that I am not an expert. I have used the furling unit with a Code 0 and an Asymmetric sail about 5 times. My previous boat came with am asymmetric sail in a sock, and I flew that many times.

IMHO, the furling unit is easier to use.

It's easier to set up and use the furling unit than to set up and use the chute in sock.

Don't get me wrong, I found using the sock to be pretty easy, and, to be perfectly honest, I would like to buy a used chute / sock when someone moves up to a furling gennaker. But IMHO the furler is easier.

Barry

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Originally Posted by Alex W View Post
I've never used a Code sail with a furler. Can you compare the easy of furling it to using an asymmetrical with a sock? Both have a similar end result (pull on a line and put the whole sail into a linear form) but do it in very different ways.

Barry Lenoble
Deep Blue C, 2002 C&C 110
Mt. Sinai, NY

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post #20 of Old 01-09-2013
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Re: Retractable Bowsprit DIY

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Originally Posted by BarryL View Post
Hi Alex,

First let me state that I am not an expert. I have used the furling unit with a Code 0 and an Asymmetric sail about 5 times. My previous boat came with am asymmetric sail in a sock, and I flew that many times.

IMHO, the furling unit is easier to use.

It's easier to set up and use the furling unit than to set up and use the chute in sock.

Don't get me wrong, I found using the sock to be pretty easy, and, to be perfectly honest, I would like to buy a used chute / sock when someone moves up to a furling gennaker. But IMHO the furler is easier.

Barry
Might be a bit of an apples to oranges comparison we're making here...

When you say that you furled an "asymmetric sail", or "gennaker", did you do so with one of the new Top-Down furlers like those from Karver? Or an older Roll-Gen? Because those are the only way to "furl" an asymmetrical spinnaker that I'm aware of... And, those units like the Karver, are VERY expensive...

People tend to use the terms "asymmetrical", "gennaker", and "Code 0" interchangeably, but the Code 0 is a very different sail, with a straight luff of high strength that makes it possible to furl in a conventional manner... That can't be done with a spinnaker...

The top-down systems were first developed for the big superyachts, where the sheer size and weight of a sock made for difficult handling by the crew... But for the sort of boats most of us sail, I still think a sock is the way to go... The top-down furlers need to be tacked to either the stem, or a sprit, they appear to lack the versatility of being able to fly an asymmetrical spinnaker using a pole, for instance... Never having used one myself, however, I'm not certain about that... Has anyone out there used one? I'd be interested in hearing your take...

Another advantage of the sock, it's possible to actually "reef" your chute during squally conditions, etc - without having to douse it completely...

Looks stupid as hell, but it works... (grin)

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