SailNet Community banner
  • SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!

Life Raft Purchase

6K views 45 replies 17 participants last post by  hellosailor 
#1 ·
Here are the parameters:
1. You don't want to rent one just like you never lease a car, You like to keep it until you die
2. Your likely cruising areas are Northern Atlantic from Boston to Europe and from N30 to S30.
3. Self righting is important since you are likely to be alone or with just one crew.
4. You need and are willing to survive for a week in Hell before rescue. Toilet paper is not essential to you.

If you are spend the money to get a life raft now, which one will you buy? Please also share links for good reviews on Life Rafts, particular from Practical sailors. I have their subscription, but I can't recall one from them.
 
#2 ·
I have a 6-man Avon valise.

From your other posts I think you have in mind sailing on other people's boats. How will you get the raft back and forth? You can't fly with it, and ground transportation considers it hazardous. Going to ship it by sea across the Atlantic?

You may be better off buying what you can find used and selling at the other end. Could be cheaper.
 
#3 ·
I understand where you are coming from and I agree. However, since I don't have a yacht like everyone here, so I don't have a black hole in the ocean to throw the money away. In other words, I have more disposable income to buy some toys that I need which it may save lives.

I also have a few sailing buddies who have been spending lots money on their boat, but haven't have the money or desire for a life raft as yet. I thought i would buy a life raft and leave it on their boat when sailing off shore; I think it is fair. In the past two years, I offered money to cover some of their expenses, they always refused to take my money.

When I have my own boat in a few years, The raft is still there. :)
 
#20 ·
However, since I don't have a yacht like everyone here,

>>snip<<

I thought i would buy a life raft and leave it on their boat when sailing off shore;

>>snip<<

When I have my own boat in a few years, The raft is still there. :)
Rafts deteriorate and require recertification. Your plan equates to throwing money away in the the least effective manner. Buy a PLB or even an EPIRB (even though they register to boats rather than individuals it is still better than a raft) and bring them with you on OPB's. A raft without a boat is a waste of $$$ (some argue quite persuasively that a raft with a boat is still a waste).

-M
 
#4 ·
A couple of thoughts about this. Liferafts are very heavy, take this into account. When we bought our boat it had an Avon 8-person that I could not move by myself. I think that there are quality differences but the price differences are immense. We decided on a Viking 6-person offshore in a canister that seemed to be a good combination of price and quality. We got it at the New York boat show for just slightly more than $2000 which was about 40% of the price of Givens. Lesson, if you can wait for a boat show might be time to go shopping. Final thought, if you are moving your raft from boat to boat probably best to get a valise so you can store inside. Heard of more than one raft getting swept off deck when not attached really well to the deck.
 
#5 ·
Rockdawg, it has come to my attention that you, being a non-boat owner, have a certain amount of disposable income. Furthermore, I note that you have no presence out here on the Pacific. I can remedy that for you. My cruising grounds are from Victoria BC, down to Acapulco Mexico. If you wish to go to Hawaii, may I suggest the 2014 Pacific Cup. We can race this as a double hand (I will need a commitment and a deposit on expenses no later than fall, 2013). You can store your Viking RescYou Pro 4 man life raft (valise style) on my boat between sails. Let me know your interest and we will work out the details (heck, I’ll even go in half on the raft).
 
#9 ·
Rockdawg, it has come to my attention that you, being a non-boat owner, have a certain amount of disposable income. Furthermore, I note that you have no presence out here on the Pacific. I can remedy that for you. My cruising grounds are from Victoria BC, down to Acapulco Mexico. If you wish to go to Hawaii, may I suggest the 2014 Pacific Cup. We can race this as a double hand (I will need a commitment and a deposit on expenses no later than fall, 2013). You can store your Viking RescYou Pro 4 man life raft (valise style) on my boat between sails. Let me know your interest and we will work out the details (heck, I'll even go in half on the raft).
Thanks George.

From SFO to HI in a heart beat. :). I won't even mind to sail her back to Victoria, BC for you. Let me know the ballpark figure. I am with the old school, I watch every dollars I spend. :) If this is a go, I don't mind to fly to SFO to meet and sail with you to gauge our compatibility before the commitment date. I think a four-man crew in a boat is too many for off shore....LOL. Two is good. :)

Do you get bonus if you are a 2 man crew in the race?

I am easy going, funny as hell, very clean and organized. I don't need much of sleep and am a very good cook.

I will study the race websites. Let bring this off line. :)
 
#6 ·
We've looked into this on a number of occasions. Switlick seems to make good ones. One caveat with any raft - you want the right size for the number of people you expect might be in it. Two people in an 8-person raft may end up tossed around inside the raft by passing waves, resulting in broken bones. If the 8-man raft is full, people get pushed into one another by waves, but no one gets enough momentum up to really hurt themselves or others. For shipping, you should be able to detach the CO2 cannisters and send them airfreight, since finding the same cannisters to buy at your destination may be problematic due to the metric system and language issues.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Winslow in a valise. wife is 4'10". Wanted a raft she could deploy if I'm unable and I could deploy with one arm. Airplane folks know some stuff. Technology is excellent. I have dedicated raft locker at aft end of cockpit ( will store ditchbag in there as well). But on prior boat did not. Still had raft in valise that could keep under my feet in cockpit with blanket over it. When thought it necessary brought it up. With raft in valise ( Winslow will pack it to just about any shape you want) don't have to worry about theft ( in Caribbean especially), raft doesn't get overheated ( being in cannister all the time hard on the raft) and you can move it boat to boat. Only buy raft certified for open ocean use. Only have one life.IMHO
 
#8 ·
I'm not a pro on laft rafts, but these folks are : Life Raft and Survival Equipment: Life Rafts, EPIRBS, PFDs, Safety Equipment

Give them a call, they are very helpful. I understand that self-righting is a bit of a fairy tale. Easy to right is more accurate.

We own a couple of different Winslows and I like them. You can customize for your needs. If you really want a raft that you can survive in for a week, you're going to literally need a dolly to move it. 100 lbs for sure, maybe more. You'll need a double insulated floor, ramp access, upgraded sea anchors, windows so you don't too sick, etc. Most important, you can't rely on retrieving your ditchbag, so you'll need a week's supplies pre-packed inside the raft, which they will do.
 
#11 ·
Thanks for the link. I will look into later.
When I said I need to survive a week. I didn't mean I need to be fed three time a day for a week. I just need to have enough water to survive (not going into a severe dehydration state). I am sure I can live without food for a week or more, so an energy bar every other day will be good.

To prevent getting loss, I am thinking to use a messenger bag or a small backpack for ditch bag.
 
#13 ·
Survival needs add up faster than you would think. How about batteries that will run your flashlights, GPS, radio, etc for a week. Raft repair supplies. You will need a minum of 8 oz of drinking water per person per day for survival and you will still feel continually very thirsty. 4 people in the raft and you need a quart per day or a gallon and a half for a week. That's 12 lbs alone and it would nearly kill you having that little. Multiply it by 4 to really have enough. Your probably going to want an emergency desalinator.
 
#18 ·
Give them a call, they are very helpful. I understand that self-righting is a bit of a fairy tale. Easy to right is more accurate.

Survival needs add up faster than you would think. How about batteries that will run your flashlights, GPS, radio, etc for a week. Raft repair supplies. You will need a minum of 8 oz of drinking water per person per day for survival and you will still feel continually very thirsty. 4 people in the raft and you need a quart per day or a gallon and a half for a week. That's 12 lbs alone and it would nearly kill you having that little. Multiply it by 4 to really have enough. Your probably going to want an emergency desalinator.
After taking the safety at sea course and played with the life raft, I walked away with a feeling that the current design need lot of improvement, just poor engineering, inadequate testing and rush to market. Unfortunately, without much competition, this will continue.

1. If they make the canopy top with a spherical dome, supported by the light weight alum7000 post (camping tent). It will right itself every time.

2. The life raft should be user serviceable, the gas cartridge can be replaced without repacking.

Yeah, I have thought about having a RO system for emergency use. They are getting cheaper now.
 
#17 ·
You can get them in Canada but you are not going to do well on price because there is little competition and the companies you deal with are mainly selling to ships and have little interest in pursuing the recreational market. Best prices are likely to be at major boat shows like Annapolis. Note that companies like Defender offer boat show prices online too.
 
#19 ·
Here are the parameters:
1. You don't want to rent one just like you never lease a car, You like to keep it until you die
2. Your likely cruising areas are Northern Atlantic from Boston to Europe and from N30 to S30.
3. Self righting is important since you are likely to be alone or with just one crew.
4. You need and are willing to survive for a week in Hell before rescue. Toilet paper is not essential to you.

If you are spend the money to get a life raft now, which one will you buy? Please also share links for good reviews on Life Rafts, particular from Practical sailors. I have their subscription, but I can't recall one from them.
Avon makes nice ones!
 
#23 ·
A few years back I joined a STCW course for the life raft and survival suit drill in a heated indoor swimming pool. I had a 6 man raft on my boat at the time and was wondering what it would be like to use this and the survival suits.

In a heated indoor pool, without waves, wind or anything to bother us it was not easy. The survival suits are very restrictive. The ladder to enter the life raft slips beneath the raft when you try to enter. It's hard to climb in. And we were in the easiest conditions possible. We inverted the raft in the pool and then tried to right it. We did it after struggle, again not easy in perfect conditions.

I'd recommend to anyone contemplating this safety gear to practice with it. Also agree that dealing with a knowledgable supplier local to you like LRSE in RI is a good idea. You'll need someone who can do inspections and repacks periodically for any of the inflatable stuff (rafts, MOMs, etc).
 
#24 ·
Another things to consider is the cost of continually re-certifying a raft that one is transporting from boat to boat.

Generally, if your raft is vacuum packed, the manufacturers recommend re-certifying every 3 years. If not, then every year. However, all offshore races that I'm familiar with require a 12 month re-certification, regardless. Not to mention that you have a properly equipped raft in the first place, not just a single tube with no canopy, for example.

Re-certification for a 6 place raft, with essentially nothing wrong, is approx $1,000. If seems or rubber has failed, it will be more.

If you're going to haul one half way around kingdom come, there is no doubt that you will have to budget an annual inspection at dollars like this.
 
#25 ·
Here are the parameters:
1. You don't want to rent one just like you never lease a car, You like to keep it until you die
They don't last that long. 15, maybe 20 years tops.

After taking the safety at sea course and played with the life raft, I walked away with a feeling that the current design need lot of improvement, just poor engineering, inadequate testing and rush to market. Unfortunately, without much competition, this will continue.

1. If they make the canopy top with a spherical dome, supported by the light weight alum7000 post (camping tent). It will right itself every time.

2. The life raft should be user serviceable, the gas cartridge can be replaced without repacking.
What expertise do you have to reach this judgment?

From my perspective as a degreed naval architect and marine engineer with over three decades of marine experience of various sorts but only incidental contact with SOLAS and life-saving equipment the aluminum post idea would result in cascading issues with chafe and puncture. The air bladders in canopies are quite simple and elegant. Leaks can be repaired while deployed with the included kit.

You can service your own life raft. If you want it certified afterward you have to get the required training from the manufacturer. The gas cartridge is the least worrisome part of inspection, repack, and recertification. I'm a very DIY guy with a lot of applicable skills and education. I have professionals care for my life raft.

Have you repacked an inflatable PFD? Do you realize how many people accidentally inflate the PFD trying to fit a new bobbin and gas cartridge?

Re-certification for a 6 place raft, with essentially nothing wrong, is approx $1,000. If seems or rubber has failed, it will be more.
Vane Brothers in MD is doing mine, including scheduling inflation so I can watch, for $400US plus any replacement flares, water, and food. No shipping cost since I'm delivering and picking up. Easily $100 in gas driving to and fro.
 
#26 ·
.....Vane Brothers in MD is doing mine, including scheduling inflation so I can watch, for $400US plus any replacement flares, water, and food. No shipping cost since I'm delivering and picking up. Easily $100 in gas driving to and fro.
Now that you mention it, the grand that I recall was from shipping to/from the the Winslow factory itself, including repacked supplies.

Still, your deal of $500 to $600, all in, sounds pretty good. I think LRSE will recert for about $800, under normal conditions. You are always welcome to view the inflation with them too.
 
#42 ·
Reminds me of the bottle of aspirin I used up last week.

Marked 99c/100 pills, from a national chain, and when I looked around for a new bottle, the local chains all wanted more like six bucks, even for generics. Amazon would sell me 300 for $5, I just don't need that many and my friends have their own. And then there was WalMart, where I found another bottle of 100 for 99c.

Of course a hospital would bill Medicare about two fifty for one aspirin.

Just doesn't seem right, does it? Supply and demand should only go so far, for half the price of a new raft, they should at least include a couple of vinyl sex dolls or some decent whiskey so folks could party in there, shouldn't they? You know, like Crackerjacks, put on a label "Surprise inside!".

One can only wonder if a lot of repack places have been held liable in court, because you just KNOW their excuse is going to be "well, our insurance costs so much...".

I know, it is what it is. and that's still obscene unless it included a full dozen SOLAS parachute flares, along with the whiskey.
 
#43 ·
This being a basic safety issue, you would think there would be gouging laws against this kind of abuse. Commercial boats, being required to bend over the barrel, get the worst of it. I wonder who in government has the brother-in-law in the raft servicing business? You can bet politics are ultimately behind this kind of legalized theft.
 
#45 ·
An alternative idea for the OP might be to buy one of these one man liferafts. Not up to the specifications you wanted, but it comes in a wearable harness, or packed in a very small bag and as a travelling crew, it would be easy to pack along. You could even bring one along for the captain too and still be way ahead on the price of a "real" raft.

They come in 2 year service interval "loose pack" models that you could play around with and become familiar with. They also have hermetically sealed 5 year service interval models.

Just a different idea that might supplement/suit your purpose.
Switlik - ISPLR Single Person Life Raft - Tech Specs

MedSailor
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top