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anchorage etiquette

16K views 129 replies 44 participants last post by  olddog60 
#1 ·
Being fairly new liveaboards (2yrs) and having hopped from secluded anchorages to marinas, we now find ourselves in a very crowded anchorage. I'm wondering what is proper generator running etiquette? Time guidelines? Perhaps this has been discussed in another thread, but my "search" isn't functioning correctly. Thanks!
 
#41 ·
A lot of comments here, some good. I do not have a generator but must run the engine to top off the batteries, starting the second day away from dock. The main culprit is the fridge, and, while underway, all the instruments and the autopilot (no air conditioning). Even though the engine runs quietly, at idle speed (a no-no for a diesel, but...), I resent it. I will probably install sufficient solar panels to reduce the reliance on diesel-generated power to an absolute minimum (up here, you can not rely on wind when in a well protected anchorage). An alternative that my spouse will not consider is to reduce or eliminate the use of the fridge, even though we are often away for short trips of only 3 or 4 nights. "Back to basics" goes only so far for her, and for many others...
 
#42 ·
Forgive me brothers & sisters, for I have sinned ;). We've had a Yamaha 1000 portable gas generator for years now. It's our electrical safety blanket. But up until last season, we'd used it twice in 8 years while on the hook, and both those were when we were alone.

Last season we got three days into our six-week meander around Lake Superior and discovered our wind generator had packed it in. Our electrical needs are modest, but we motor very little while cruising, so we eventually had to choose between running the big diesel at anchor, or running the little generator. The choice became obvious...

I abhor noise at anchor, so I visited all the boats in our anchorages, and chagrinly requested their approval. Everyone was great, and assured us it would be no problem. After running the generator for a while I polled the boats, and no one said the noise was a problem, however our anchorages are rarely busy, and the gaps between boats can be relatively large. Although none of our neighbours said they found it annoying, and most said they couldn't even hear it -- I FOUND IT ANNOYING! Quite frankly, I think my fellow anchorage neighbours were just being nice :eek:.

My little experiment proved to me that while those little generators are not as annoying as a big genset, nor as loud or wasteful as running the ship's diesel, they are certainly not quiet, even in "eco" mode. I shall not sin again ... We are installing a new wing generator (one of those "silent" ones), and new solar panels for the coming season.
 
#43 ·
most said they couldn't even hear it -- I FOUND IT ANNOYING! Quite frankly, I think my fellow anchorage neighbours were just being nice :eek:.
It's human behavior to not complain but then go seethe. It's nice of you to have gone around and asked. It gave them all the opportunity to express their real thoughts.

I recently had the reverse experience talking to a guy on a Hunter with his lil red Honda on the swim platform. He was saying how they couldn't hear it at all. The rest of the anchorage could because it was pointing at us!

It's nice that you are understanding of the noise. :)

Of course we must expect there to be odd situations, especially when outside the tropics where solar is abundant... If someone gets back to their boat late at night and sees the batteries are accidentally way down and they have a choice of loosing their frozen food, or damaging their batteries then they must charge immediately, and should feel free to do so.
We all make mistakes, and we all need to be understanding of it.
 
#44 ·
honestly.. I have no problems with people starting up a generator to charge batteries (or even cook as these new boats seem too dependant on electricity) but it is when people leave them running for hours on end...
 
#45 ·
I say we ban Ellen for starting such a controversial thread!! (She and I are friends, btw... see you in a couple of weeks or less!)

On topic: After sunrise and before sunset. Interesting timing here Ellen, because we all anchored out for one last hoorah at Longboat this last weekend, and someone had a generator going that night and the police stopped by the next morning and told all the boaters, "No generators after 1000 pm." For those that do not know, Longboat is a VERY tight anchorage with boats generally anchored within a few boat lengths or less. In fact, we saw a nice, high speed collision this weekend.

Off Topic:

This thread seems to have taken a "don't take or use a generator" bent to it. All of you that are arguing against generators, or their use, do you cruise fulltime?

I get the weekend warriors that can somehow make their battery banks last a few days. Of course, many of you are the same ones that leave the dock with two coolers full of ice (also called Cruiser's Gold)!! But after a few days (even with a large solar bank), your batteries are not getting fully charged and you will be surprised how quickly you will lose your power.

I personally have 780 watts (6-Kyocera 130 watt panels) on my boat and I still have issues when the sun does not participate. Now my example is a bit extreme because all four of us (the kids included) require computers and have to use them during the day (the kids are home schooled). However, 150 ah/day is not unreasonable for a cruiser with a fridge. I understand that there are some who can do without refrigeration, and Capt Aaron has my immense respect, but most cruisers I know who have tried to go minimalist do not last very long. And that is just for batteries!! We have not even disccused a windless night where the lows are in the mid 80s. We have not discussed hot water which goes very fast in cool/cold weather. We have not diuscussed making water, the microwave, toaster, coffee pot, etc. Sure, you can go without a lot of that stuff, but other than the fact it always makes the boat feel like you are camping out (compared to a home), now you are eating up propane. Diesel and gas are easy to get, but propane is a right PITA to get as a F/T cruiser. Sorry... just reality. If you do not run your generator, you will need some other way to charge your batteries. You can plug into a marina every other night, you can run your main (not much quieter with the spalsh-splash, incidentally), or you can put in a very expensive electrical charging system (solar, wind, large battery bank, etc).

Personally, I periodically use a Mastervolt Diesel generator. It is very hard to hear unless you are in the cockpit. You can hear the splashing though. It burns about a pint/hour of diesel. I can tell you that if you are a few boat legths away, you will not hear it. It does produce some fumes, but they are minimal. Its cost? Well, I guess installed around $15,000. How many of you want to go dump $15,000 in a quiet diesel generator so you do not upset the anchorage? I wouldn't. Solar? Well, you will likely need in the neighborhood or 4 130 watt panels to stay off the grid if you are conservative. Let's see... $2400 for the panels, $500 for the controller, $4000 (aluminum)-$10,000 (Stainless) for the arch (mine was $4), few hundred dollars for the wiring and connectors... and for the grand total of $7500-$13,500 (assuming you do the entire install yourself) you can be quiet... assuming the sun participates. You will still run low on power eventually and have to recharge as it is unlikely that you will always (sometimes never) get your batteries back to a full SOC. Oh, and that does not get you hot water.

So, if faced with putting off cruising for a while, or getting a little red Honda, which would you choose? If the choice was staying out cruising longer, using less money (boat dollars) or dumping $8-10,000 to be quiet, which would you choose? I mean, many people on Sailnet do not even have a $10,000 boat!!! $10,000 might be the total costs for cruising for a year.

All I am saying is have pity on those who run the generators. Many abuse it. I get that. But many more are doing what they are doing because they have to and took the least expensive option they could. And if I could do it all over, that little red thing would look awfully tempting versus the rediculous money I have spent to do without it.

My opinions,

Brian

PS Ellen - Kick Bob for me, ok?
 
#46 · (Edited)
Agreed. For the most part

The OP posted on the etiquette of it. Personnally I dont care if you run your generator or not. Most of us are not cruisers and are "weekend warriors" as you determined it. There are not a lot of cruisers on the Chesapeake so most running generators for air conditioning or minor battery charging I assume. I have one of those Honda 2000 myself. It is not my concern how or why you have to recharge your batteries or run your air conditioner, nor is it my right to tell you not to do it, unless you have come into an anchorage after me and pulled upwind and I and others are choking on your fumes. My wife has a super sensitivity to fumes and smoke, and it can give her a potential asthma attack.

In actuallity I am not concerned about the noise as much as I am about the fumes coming off any of the generators. Most generators inboard and the HOndas are quite quiet when below for sure. However one wants to smell or be sickened by a generator of a boat who positions himself windward of you.

I think the proper etiquette is for those of you who anchor and need to run a generator to anchor on the peirphery of the anchorage areas if they are crowded, if possible so very few people if any are downwind of you. It IMHO is improper etiquette and downright rude if you know you will be using a generator, to pull into a crowded anchorage or any anchorage and purposely place other boats in your " fume shadow" and act like it is ok to ruin their anchoring experience. Doesnt make any difference if you are a cruiser, weekend warrior or day tripper, no one is less than. Its about being courteous.

I also beleive it is the responsibilty of boats who arrive after you to recognize you are running your generator and anchor themselves accordingly not down wind of you and not to blame you or expect you to shut your generator down.

Etiquette in this case is really courtesy and respecting others rights to breathe clean air.:):)
 
#47 ·
I was a guest on a friend's boat in a quiet anchorage, when another boat came in, anchored nearby, then proceeded to rev up a portable generator, put it into his dinghy, and push it away from his boat. The painter and the electrical cable were long enough for the dinghy to drift very close to our boat, making it noisy for us but quiet for our neighbour. My friend, without saying a word either to them or to me, quietly slipped overboard, swam underneath the dinghy and punched out the drain plug. We then sat back and watched the results. The folk on the other boat didn't appear to suspect what had actually happened.
 
#50 ·
what a bunch of thin skin sailors! LOL.

you don't know noise until you anchor at elliot key on a holiday weekend. Generators are the least of your problems!

there is nothing like an all night Latin party with subwoofers, and mega watt amps.

Oh man, how I wished for the steady drone of a generator's white noise...


Those 1000wt honda's are fine. run them all night.
 
#53 ·
Guilty. We have a little red Honda AND a noisy wind generator! Brian, we're saving you a mooring ball downwind of us. Tho, in self defense, I will tell you we installed more solar while (permanently) moored here and are finally getting a handle on our power needs.
BTW, what's a microwave?
 
#54 ·
We try to conserve power and enjoy the anchorage. We can live without a microwave, AC and TV. We have amazing views and we read books when the views aren't there or just socialize. We have solar and a wind generator. I will not pull in close to anyone and use the wind gen but if I am the first one there, I will leave it running to ward off those who think anchoring as close as possible to another boat is socially acceptable. We welcome you to come visit in your dinghy(bearing gifts of course) but feel free to anchor on the other side of the cove if possible.

We love cruising Maine and the only sounds we want to hear are the waves, the wind and the laughter.
 
#55 ·
I think the answer is as everyone has stated: be kind and courteous to others around you. Just like you wouldn't blare your music late at night (ftldiver, you have my sympathy), neither should you be running generators or your main diesel. If you gotta charge, so be it. But do it during daytime hours. And if you've gotta run a generator through the night, anchor away from others.

BTW, same goes for windmills. You can turn them off at night if the wind is makin' them howl (as some of the older models do).
 
#56 · (Edited)
I'm not anti gen. I'm looking at one for my trip down south this spring. It's about the etiquette. And I move my boat if someone bothers me, ask if I can't move, and only at sunset. I don't even care if you start up after th sun set, just not during. I own a 40 foot dive boat with 450 hp turbo deisel and a 75 kw kubota - northern lights gen set. A big noisy stink box. I do over night dive trips that turn into back country boom box party's out in the middle of no where. I use etiquette when I'm running my sh!t. simple. I say please and thank you, and try not to bother my neighbors. As I prepare my little sloop for a sail to Guanaja, Honduras, in order to make life easier, my wife and I have rented a studio apt. 2 blocks off Duval st. in Key West. We are moving everything to our property in Guanaja to make a go of it down there mostly full time. I know it's noisy 2 blocks from Duval so I don't complain about the noise
( or the smell) I always tell people, if drunks, roosters and the din of club music bother you, why the @#!*% did you move 2 blocks from Duval! Now the dude who lets his gen drift off the back in a dinghy so he's not botherd and it's right up on me, he got what he deserved and the dude who pulled the plug ought to get a gold star!
 
#60 ·
If I put my gen in your yard so I did'nt have to hear it and smell it, I would be destroying it myself. One could only assume the effected party would take some action towards the device. If I Plowed my drive way and piled it up at the end of yours, I would expect retaliation.
I personaly, as I stated earlier, alway's ask politely for the offending party to stop what they are doing first, but blatent disrespect is quite rightly often met with action, and yes I aplaud it.
As for Central America.
I spent 6 months, after surviving Huricane Mitch myself, carrying medicine and food on my back up over land slides to effected areas cut off from the world, high up in the Guatemalan highlands, and digging body's out of river banks with the Red Cross and C.A.R.E.
I spent 4 years studying the natural disaster of Huricane Gilbert on the reef off the Yucatan coast. I volunteerd for 3 months changing diapers in an orphanage. I sponsored a base ball team of under privilaged kids in Isla Mujeres when I owned a night club there. And I am currently raising funds for a clinic in Guanaja because we have nothing of the sort on the east end of the Island as well as promoting and Island clean up because the trash is out of control. I worked with the first lady of Guatemala and her girls scout troop puting together emergancy drop bags for family's cut off from supply's due to swolen rivers. I worked clearing mine fields in Columbia with the dep. director of the U.N. with a thing that looks like an over sized lawn mower. When you find one it detinates under a dome that you are holding with a 6 foot handle. My father in law and I set up a free veteranarian clinic to nueter animals in Honduras. And I sent two smart and under privilaged Venezualan Kids to college via a scholarship I connected them with so ya, you can rest assured I'll do you proud.
 
#64 ·
As for Central America.
I spent 6 months, after surviving Huricane Mitch myself, carrying medicine and food on my back up over land slides to effected areas cut off from the world, high up in the Guatemalan highlands, and digging body's out of river banks with the Red Cross and C.A.R.E.
I spent 4 years studying the natural disaster of Huricane Gilbert on the reef off the Yucatan coast. I volunteerd for 3 months changing diapers in an orphanage. I sponsored a base ball team of under privilaged kids in Isla Mujeres when I owned a night club there. And I am currently raising funds for a clinic in Guanaja because we have nothing of the sort on the east end of the Island as well as promoting and Island clean up because the trash is out of control. I worked with the first lady of Guatemala and her girls scout troop puting together emergancy drop bags for family's cut off from supply's due to swolen rivers. I worked clearing mine fields in Columbia with the dep. director of the U.N. with a thing that looks like an over sized lawn mower. When you find one it detinates under a dome that you are holding with a 6 foot handle. My father in law and I set up a free veteranarian clinic to nueter animals in Honduras. And I sent two smart and under privilaged Venezualan Kids to college via a scholarship I connected them with so ya, you can rest assured I'll do you proud.
Mother F'n OUCH! I donated blood last month and thought I was doin' something. Guess I need to step it up...AWESOME. :eek:
 
#62 · (Edited)
My family has owned this house down there for 20 plus years, we all know each other well and some of us have even married in to the local population. When I was 18 years old, I signed on to a sailing research vessel and the rest is history. One thing has led to another and here we are. I was raised by a mean old man on a little sailboat who did'nt put up with peoples crap
 
#67 ·
Like I said. I've alway's asked politely if they would'nt mind killi'n it for sun set. If the fumes Bother me, I move, if I can't move, I ask them to kill it, or move. Unfortunatly, there are some self centerd f@#K nuts out there, especially people who look at my little sloop and feel an overwhelming sense of entitlement, sitt'n there on their "YACHT" who basically say "F@#K you"
In these situations it's game on. Some lessons come hard.
 
#76 ·
That makes sense to me. There are real exceptions, a few posted here. But for the most part, none of us want to put up with anymore noise and pollution on the water than is necessary.

A couple seasons ago, we took a float in tiny Camden Harbor Maine. It's really nice in there for an overnight. 30 feet off our starboard decks, a Hinckley B40 started his engine, and I could see, he was going to charge, right there(B40 on the left).

The irony was, that with the light prevailing southerly, his exhaust was going directly,...into another Hinckley B40, just a few yards downwind. He charged for over an hour, the typical needs of his dorm room sized refrigerator below.

From watching him, I sensed he was a nice guy, chatting and waving to people going by. Simply, with all the hubbub in that popular little harbor, he was oblivious to the fact this might bother someone.

The guy downwind, did come up a few times, and fan his nose, looking back. But he wasn't bothered enough to say anything. It was a beautiful day. You can buy blocks of ice, 10 and 50 pounds, on both sides of this harbor.

I didn't say anything either. It was a beautiful day, and I realized he was a charterer when his dinghy drifted under his counter and caught the exhaust outflow for a half hour. Live and learn.

 

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#74 ·
Spec'd two D400s and solar on top of hard bimini on new boat. Spec'd plumbing for generator but no generator. Have high output alternator. HATE, HATE generators. Another engine to maintain. Another arteficial noise and smell. Can't agree with Mark more. On prior boats used coastally brought a couple blocks of ice ( less money than the fuel for a generator). No excuse for a generator except in unusual circumstances. Have ac in saloon. Will run it to get humidity down and that's it. Interesting review of electrical sources in I think SAIL a few months back. Guy was cruising in scotland. Seems generator was most expensive way to get juice. Would expect given wind and sun density you would do better with wind/solar generation than generator anywhere in US for less money.
 
#78 ·
I have two solar panels of 140w each and a small wind gen that runs quiet and doesn't disturb the neighbors. But on my boat my average daily consumption is about 230Ah and the passive systems above even on a good day do not always recover that. Unless I want my boat to look like a science experiment, these systems are not charging Nirvana

So if I want to replace what I use a genset is the only way to do it (or reduce life back to primitive). So I have built my own diesel genset that will run quiet enough that all one will hear outside the boat is the splashing of the exhausted coolant. It is not installed in the boat yet but I can run it in my garage and my family can't hear it in the room next door.

The fumes are something else - can't stop them but I allow my batteries to go down to a point where I have to charge then I will run the genset which puts out constant 200A at 12V so it will only run for short while to put back that which the passive systems can't. I can live with that and I believe all my neighbors in the anchorage will also.

But as has been said many times on this thread, live and let live. If anyone complains then the genset goes off.
 
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#79 ·
Our 260w solar keeps our ice cream frozen and our beer cold. No need for genset or ice blocks.

Zee, that is just the inner harbor and not much bigger than what you see in that photo. Some people love it here but my wife and I do not. Good provisioning stop but that is all. Mostly a big tourist trap. Mooring field outside of this area is much more private as you are interspersed with seasonal moorings. Fun to watch the schooners come and go.
 
#81 ·
It is pretty, and cold right now. Like Tim says, it's two habors, inner and outer. It's a buzz in season.

We have a soft spot for it, we lived in the inner harbor for a summer while I built us some digs to live in over an old fish market on the harbor(a long story).

Our kids would swim right off the boat(when the harbormaster wasn't looking). We like to grab an inner float now and then. It's a fun little town and harbor, to sit and watch it all go by. We like it all.

We moved though, to a quieter town(and harbor), right next door.

 
#82 ·
Gorgeous shot, Tom.. beautiful country too. I think you downeasters and we BCers have a lot in common.. I'd love an opportunity to spend some time cruising Maine one day, cold or not, busy or not....
 
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#83 ·
Thanks, Faster. I can't take credit for that shot but it's a typical one from nearby Mt Battie. You only see half of the inner harbor and a third of the outer in this photo.

I feel the same, I'd love to explore your area by sailboat. I have friends and relatives that live there. They don't ever speak of leaving, only how much they love it.

I know it's a beautiful place. There are too many for us to sail.
 
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