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Mostly singlehanded...what lines should I run aft?

31K views 156 replies 38 participants last post by  Cruisingdad 
#1 ·
I am planning on doing some deck work and everyone says this is the time to run lines to the cockpit. What lines should I run aft? Right now the only lines aft are the main sheet, jib sheets, topping lift and travelers. I was planning on running the cunningham and boom vang back. Should I do main halyard? Spin Halyard? I am going to be using an Asym. Spinnaker I assume the topping lift isnt needed? Anyone have before and after pics?
 
#2 ·
Boom vang yes, but I would leave the rest alone, Just because you single hand does not mean you cant leave the cockpit. I find it annoying trying to sail a boat with everything back to the cockpit, It can be like standing in a bowl of spaghetti if your not anal about trying to keep it neat . It might have been the reason some boat use continuous lines.
 
#4 ·
I agree, with the exception of the spinnaker halyard, so you can blow it if you broach, the mainsheet, jib sheets and spin sheets. Don't bother running other lines aft unless you are an invalid or like to buy gear. Otherwise, there is no need. You can walk the 10 feet up to the mast.
I think this is a question of where you sail. I do offshore cruising - including a solo trans-Atlantic. That 10 feet to the mast can be quite a challenge in 35 knot winds and 25 foot seas (did I mention at night?):)
 
#5 ·
We have everything but the topping lift run back. Love it. But, it's ten feet or more from the helm to the cabin top winches. Quite a bit further to the mast. Reefing from the cockpit is a real plus, because that's usually done when you would prefer not to be on the deck. Of course, you need a furler or jiffy reef type system to do it.
 
#6 ·
I predominantly single-hand in coastal waters and have for nearly 50 years. I tend to sail my boats in conditions that most people do not, enjoy keeping my boat properly trimmed and up to speed, and I also race my boat single-hand.

Because of that I typically set my boats up with all halyards and sheets run aft, the boom vang run aft, the outhaul and at least one reef run aft, and the pole lift and foreguy run aft. I also have my jib sheet leads run aft. I don't use the cunningham when single-handed since it does so little that cannot be done with the main halyard. In large part I do this to clear the winches and cleats off the mast, boom and deck forward since I firmly believe that fouling sheets on these is a bigger hazard to a single-hander than having to go to the mast to reef. I also run my backstay adjuster to the helm, which in your case may mean bringing your baby stay adjuster to the helm.

But beyond that, I believe that people adjust the control lines that they can easily reach. If you are single-handing and you need to leave the helm to make an adjustment, you will not adjust halyard tension, outhaul, or vang. This can make a huge difference in performance or be a big nuisance.

I must admit that running everything aft did not come free. I had to add a number of Garhauer blocks at the mast base, and a rack of stoppers and also cam cleats where they made more sense. I regularly use 6 of the 12 aft stoppers on my boat (9 when the chute is up since the pole lift and foreguy are run aft as well). On a boat your size you might get by with small cam cleats for the majority of minor control lines, with only stoppers for the halyards.

If you were only going to run one line aft, I would suggest that it should be the main halyard. To some extent, on most boats, if you can get the mainsail up, the boat will short tack upwind with the mainsheet cleated and the helm loosely tied amidships allowing you to raise and adjust the jib at leisure.

Jeff
 
#7 ·
I know you didn't ask but I will offer this bit of advice. For single handing if you do not have midship cleats, and you are doing deck work anyway, you might consider adding them with sound backing plates. A line from a midship cleat lead back to the cockpit winch or a cleat will make you look like a docking genius when you are single handing.
 
#10 ·
Hey,

IMHO, for single handing, the nicest piece of gear is an autopilot. With the AP on, I can leave the wheel and do whatever needs to be done. Depending on your boat layout, just having lines run to the cockpit may not be enough. For example my boat has the typical layout of traveler on the cabin top with control lines led port and starboard. If I am at the wheel I can't reach the main sheet or the traveler lines. So even though those lines are 'led aft' I can't reach them unless I leave the wheel. Since I don't particularly like to steer, I usually use the AP (or have a guest steer) and this allows me to trim the sails to my heart's content.

Regarding the main halyard, where is your reef line? If you need to go to the mast to reef then running the halyard aft isn't going to help. On my 28' boat I had single line reefing (led aft) and the main halyard aft too. It was very easy to raise and lower the main from the cockpit as well as put in a reef. On my 35' boat there is too much friction to make raising the main from the cockpit easy (but it's very easy to do from the mast). There is also too much friction for single line reefing to be easy. So I raise / lower the main from the mast, as well as put in the reef at the mast too.

I do have the outhall, vang, topping lift, and reefing line (for the rear of the sail) run aft.

Lastly, I am 49 years old, fit, and with good balance. I find it easy to leave the cockpit to go to the mast (or bow) and perform any necessary tasks. I don't have a complicated dodger / bimini setup that makes leaving the cockpit difficult, and my boat has decent hand holds as I go forward.

Take care,
Barry
 
#11 ·
Lastly, I am 49 years old, fit, and with good balance. I find it easy to leave the cockpit to go to the mast (or bow) and perform any necessary tasks. I don't have a complicated dodger / bimini setup that makes leaving the cockpit difficult, and my boat has decent hand holds as I go forward.

Take care,
Barry
And, that is as it should be... On a proper sailing yacht, there should be little fear, or hesitation, of leaving the cockpit in anything short of extremely boisterous conditions, and darkness should not at all add to the risk of doing so...

Perhaps my biggest gripe with many modern boats, is the poor cockpit and deck ergonomics - the subtle contours and facets of the deck and coachroof, large expanses of areas uncovered by non-skid, the huge coamings that must be straddled in an ungainly fashion without good handholds to gain access to pathetically narrow side-decks with minimal toerails, and on and on... Then, bolt on some of those Canvas Contraptions becoming more and more prevalent, and it's easy to see why some folks fear having to drag themselves out on deck... (grin)

Last boat I was on, leaving the cockpit was as safe as could be, the boat was an absolute delight to move around on deck (absent the ice, of course) A sturdy, unobtrusive dodger with side rails, 30" high lifelines, and absence of jerry jugs and other crap creating needless deck clutter, etc...

As it should be... A sad sign of the times, that going forward in a gale at sea would entail far less risk on this 31-footer, than it would on many modern boats almost twice her size...

 
#12 ·
If you run everything aft it has to work.. this means good gear, blocks, the right tackle etc..

I agree that for this kind of the a working autopilot is a huge advantage, being able to move around the boat and tend to things without having to dash back and forth to correct a course or wind angle is really nice.

Headsail halyards (if not furling), spinnaker lines, downhauls, vang if applicable are all good candidates. Depending on the boat I'm not sure I'd run the main halyard aft unless the reefing lines are run aft too. If you have to go to the mast to deal with the reef tack and clew, the halyard may as well be there too. (and see 'autopilot' reference above ;))

Running reef lines aft is the most problematic, as they are going to be the most friction-prone. This can add up to a good bit of good (costly) gear, but it's out there if you want it.
 
#13 ·
I made my reefing lines run a lot better by doing a Amsteel to XLS splice using these instructions:
Splicing Amsteel to Sta-Set

The portion running through the sail is 3/16" Amsteel. What runs back to the cockpit is 3/8" XLS. When the reef is in use the splice ends just at the clutch. This has made the single line reefing work well on my boat and it's nice not having a heavy line running up and down along the sail cloth. The Amsteel slips nicely through the reefing grommits on the sail. It also doesn't stretch.

I'd say keep it simple on what you run back. On my boat I have a dodger and the following run back: outhaul, reef, main halyard, vang, jib halyard, spinnaker halyard. This is how the boat came setup (except for the vang, which I added). The only control not run back is the topping lift, which is forward under the boom. Furling and spinnaker tack line both run back too, but along the stanchions.

I setup my previous boat and only ran the two halyards (jib was hank on) and reefing lines back to the cockpit. Topping lift and outhaul are on the boom. Spinnaker halyard is on the mast. Vang is at the base of the mast and is accessible from the companionway. It's less cluttered and still pretty easy to access everything if single handing with an autopilot. It's also easier for guest crew to figure out.
 
#17 ·
Before you spend all that money on lines, halyards and hardware, list on a step by step basis all the tasks you will need to reef your main.
You will then realize that you still have to go to the mast for at least two tasks: hook the reef cringle and lash the sail to the boom.
In my opinion, if your lines run aft and you still need to go to the mast, what is the purpose? The only thing I can think of is to stay there less time, but what da heck, 5 minutes or 10 minutes of exposure will not do any harm, besides, its fun! ;)
 
#20 ·
You will then realize that you still have to go to the mast for at least two tasks: hook the reef cringle and lash the sail to the boom.
Neither of those are necessary in many reefing systems. Often the reef tack cringle is held down with line, just as the reef clew cringle is.

The sail should never be lashed to the boom, the reef knots should go around the sail cloth only. That is an optional step that makes it neater, but it's not mandatory.

Here my boat Elena is reefed with neither of those things done:


Here my friend's boat Jackie is reefed with reefing line tidying up the loose sail at the boom:


His boat has no lines going to the cockpit and and he single hands all the time. His boat is also engineless (he even glassed over the propshaft through hull).
 
#18 ·
I have everything aft except the spin pole topping lift.

All reefing lines are aft.

I don't like having to get out of the cockpit in very nasty weather.. Although when reefing often I need to go forward and play with the reefing lines at the mast where they tend to get themselves caught up.


Mark
 
#21 ·
I am reminded by this commentary of the old saying "amputation with a dull spoon is possible, it just takes a long time and is very messy." Yes, K. Adlard Coles used to take his poor wife out into the English Channel in the worst of conditions and survived. Frankly I got tired of reading how many times he had to trim the wicks and relight the running lights. I found very little of value in his recounting of his antics. My favorite old salt advice: "If you are thinking it might be time to reef you should have already reefed."

For me setting up a boat is about safety first and then convenience. I single hand a great deal in open ocean conditions. In Newfoundland the water temperature was 40 Fahrenheit. Even a splash was a bone chilling experience, a fall into the water attached to a harness and lifeline gave you maybe 5 minutes to get back on board. When you are sailing for 15 or 20 days in a row without stopping or the assistance of other people dealing with conditions others might consider "fun" is exhausting. Waves in the Atlantic are always confused (at least it seems that way.) Spending time at the mast with the boat pitching in weird ways because I can see a thunderstorm bearing down on me is to me not exciting, it is part of what I do because I have to. I prefer to minimize that time, although as pointed out when I reef I do have to go forward to secure the reef point to the gooseneck. (I have played with single line reefing and have not found a solution I like.) Having too many things lashed down or up - spinnaker, boom preventer, whisker pole - when the wind shifts 180 degrees because of the oncoming storm and then back again adds to the exhaustion factor.

Reboot is rigged for single hand sailing with a jib and main. All those lines are led back to the cockpit. I can put up the whisker pole by myself, but that requires quite a bit of foredeck work. The asymmetric and spinnaker require me to have crew on board. Being a very conservative sailor I don't fly these sails when I am single handing - they require too much effort in changing weather conditions. I could in fact fly them, but getting an extra knot is usually not worth the effort (Reboot usually can get close to hull speed in normal open ocean conditions - about 15 to 20 knots of wind.

I agree that for single handing an autopilot is a must. I actually have two, an electric and a wind vane. When the wheel steering failed 1000 NM offshore and took the wind vane with it having a redundant system (the electric autopilot) was a great savior. I use the electric autopilot during all sail changes - it does make life easier.

So, my view is you work out how and where you are going to sail, who you are going to sail with, and then figure out what lines need to come back. The two I think are critical to safety are the main and jib halyards. When things go really wrong I just trip the clutches and the sails pretty much come down by themselves, at least enough for me to get control of the boat again. Yes, I have a roller reefing jib but sometimes the roller just doesn't want to roll or the wind speed makes furling difficult. So every once in a while I just have to trip the halyard and clean up the mess afterwards.

Hope this helps
 
#22 ·
I'll second the suggestion for a "crewman in a can" (autopilot),
but for the type of sailing the OP typically does, running all lines aft will just be an inconvenient tangle of spaghetti.

My vang is run aft, and I've just run a jib downhaul for nasty weather. Jacklines get me to the mast, where my "pit" position is. Sometimes, the trip hazard of the spaghetti offsets the safety of running all lines to the cockpit.
 
#24 ·
Thks guys. Up to now I have not felt the need to have any lines in the cockpit that are not there. Cunningham maybe as my main likes it to help with luff tension. Boom vang. I can reach it now from the cockpit to tighten it but cannot loosen it without a trip out of the cockpit. Main halyard is just a thought but I have not really adjusted or reefed the main after it goes up. Spin halyard I thought maybe but I have not run a spin yet so it's just forward thinking. I think an auto pilot and instruments will be much higher on the list.
 
#26 ·
Lashing to the boom, day sailing or not, can cause issues that will also be much larger. The eyelets for the reef knots aren't reinforced in any way and can't handle any loads. Should your reefing clew line accidentally release you will destroy the sail.

I agree with you that if you are reefing for long periods of time that tidying up the bottom of the sail is good. However that barely fits under emergency reefing (the one time when having reefing gear in the cockpit is handy).

I don't see how the reefing hook holding down my reef cringle is any better than a piece of amsteel line holding down my reef cringle.
 
#29 ·
Put me in the old curmudgeon category. Sheets and running backs go to the cockpit. Everything else is at the mast. I have yet to sail a boat with lines aft that hadn't built up enough friction to require grinding about everything up with a winch, a time-consuming process. I can get everything done faster at the mast, including the time to get out there and back.

Further, and specific to my boat, the hard windscreen and dodger above keep most of the cockpit really dry. There is no way I'm going to punch holes in that for lines and let water through.

Y'all can do as you please. I deliver enough boats in different configurations to be confident in my conclusions. Running halyards and adjustment lines into the cockpit is one of those ideas that seems superficially appealing but in reality turns out to reduce both safety and operational performance.

I feel that way about enclosures too so it is likely that the concepts are related.
 
#31 ·
Put me in the old curmudgeon category. Sheets and running backs go to the cockpit. Everything else is at the mast. I have yet to sail a boat with lines aft that hadn't built up enough friction to require grinding about everything up with a winch, a time-consuming process. I can get everything done faster at the mast, including the time to get out there and back.

Further, and specific to my boat, the hard windscreen and dodger above keep most of the cockpit really dry. There is no way I'm going to punch holes in that for lines and let water through.

Y'all can do as you please. I deliver enough boats in different configurations to be confident in my conclusions. Running halyards and adjustment lines into the cockpit is one of those ideas that seems superficially appealing but in reality turns out to reduce both safety and operational performance.

I feel that way about enclosures too so it is likely that the concepts are related.
I guess it is a matter of what you are used to. I have only sailed on a couple of boats with halyard winches on the mast, and I have always considered them relics from the past! ;)

On a boat the size of NewportNewbie's there should be no reason there is so much friction that a winch is required to hoist a sail, If there is, something is very wrong!

I like being able to make halyard adjustments to my main and genoa without even letting go of the helm! (ok, to be fair I do steer with my foot if I need both hands!)
 
#30 ·
Everything is lead to the cockpit on my boat. 2 spin halyards, 2 genoa halyards, topping lift, spinnaker tack line/downhaul, main Halyard, and Baby stay adjustment. Reefing lines are still at the front of the boom, but I have never used them. All halyards can be directed to one of the 2 cabin top winches.

 
#37 ·
Wow. I never thought this would be a debate. To me. Having lines handy means I can more safely and effectively sail the boat. Especially single and shorthanded. I test sailed a brand new Beneteau First 30 and all lines led act and it was almost silly how convenient it was. Yes alot of lines in the cockpit meant I had to be more conscious of keeping things neat but it was very nice. That's like saying dont get furlers, lazy jacks, instruments, engines, etc because when Columbus did it he didn't have all that. I see guys in the Vendee global or the Volvo Ocean race with all the technology in the world and I would never call them less of a sailor because of it.
 
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