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Ipad as sailing instrument....

16K views 50 replies 18 participants last post by  vtsailguy 
#1 ·
Hello everyone,

I am on my second year sailing and leatning a lot! -:) I am thinking of upgrading my electronic although I have a smaller sailboat (Tanzer 7.5). I looked at Garmin and Furano for depth, wind and speed. However, I know some sailer are using Ipad as GPS. I am thinking of using my iPad not so much as GPS but instead of using it as my depth sounder and wind meter/ speed meter. Anyone done this? what about cost? It needs to be WIFI right? How to get this on water?... so many question.... Thanks for your help!

Coolsailing
 
#2 ·
#5 ·
Thank you everyone for the fats response.

Using the GPS capability, I would be able to obtain both speed and positioning.

1. You are saying that I could actually connect a transducer for the depth to the iPad or will it show using the GPS capability on the iPad?

2. Same for the wind? How does it work?

I know, I have too many questions...
:)
 
#6 ·
What u need are the transducers to get the depth and wind data. If you do that with nmea compatible instruments you can get them sent via wifi to an iPad. That will require something that sends that data via wifi. This currently will probably cost you as much as a entry level instrument sail pack. After you have that having the data sent to an iPad is doable. What you also have to worry about is powering the devices and since it's done via wifi having something create a wifi network like a computer. For a small boat that may be alot of power requirements. There may be other options but from my research this is what may be involved. Raymarine and I think simrad have an iPad app that allows you to see the nmea data on their network. You still have to get their instruments and build that network so it's not in addition to the instruments not instead of.
 
#8 ·
Hey,

IMHO, you are betting off using something small, cheap, waterproof, and designed for boats than you are using an iPAD.

I used to have a Lowrance 3.5" color GPS unit that came with high quality charts and a fishfinder / depthfinder. They still make a similar unit, the Lowrance Elite 4:
Elite-4 - LOWRANCE | Marine Electronics
It costs around $300.

For wind display you will need to purchase a separate unit. A less expensive unit, like from Moor Electronics
capw
is around $400.

good luck,

Barry
 
#9 ·
Hey,

IMHO, you are betting off using something small, cheap, waterproof, and designed for boats than you are using an iPAD......
While I don't necessarily advocate the iPad as primary navigation, I continue to feel it is the single greatest piece of cruising technology to come along in decades. Navigation, anchor alarm, bookshelf system manuals, email, movies, pandora radio, weather, radar, research, communication, skype, internet access, games.... oh yea and sailnet. For the money, its a dozen devices in one.

They sell a waterproof cover for $30.
 
#10 ·
Coolsailing, I'm by no means a minimalist sailor, but it would be a lot less expensive to teach yourself how to read the wind without instruments. It's a good thing to know in case your electronics fail but not something one usually thinks about doing when all the conveniences are in front of you. We lost our windvane to a bird a few years ago and I don't miss it at all. I have wind apps but they don't tell me what's happening immediately around my boat. I record Beaufort scale readings in our log and rely on how the wind feels.

That said, I've used a netbook for navigation until this season when I'm going to experiment with the Garmin app on my iPad. I found a waterproof case to mitigate some of that risk.
 
#11 ·
Coolsailing, check out "iRegatta" which is a dedicated sailing app for the iPad. It's primarily geared toward racing but does display your wind info and GPS info so is still useful when not racing.
I currently use iRegatta on my WiFi only iPad with a BadElf GPS dongle.
I've been building a NMEA to WiFi bridge with the aim of getting rid of the BadElf dongle and connecting a separate GPS unit (maybe even my VHF radio which has GPS built in) to the NMEA to WiFi bridge and sending the data to my iPad over WiFi.
 
#15 ·
Yes, I am in the computer industry, and I was thinking all day today that it would be easy and is very doable for a wind vane to be setup to a transmitter box, that just sends the data out via a wifi network. Well damn, there it is! I thought that if the marine electronics companies got it, they could sell a wifi version of their units and then sell the software...it would make their displays obselete in some issues, or maybe even have wifi enabled displays, so again, no wires. (tack tick/raymarine?) Whats cool is this wind vane has free software that can be downloaded so it can show actual sail time to a point including tacking, and uses wind and boat speed data to give you the optimal tacks for the fastest speed to a waypoint. Its also always updating based on the boat speed and wind data. Pretty cool.
 
#21 ·
I still dont get why not just by a system and have it permanently installed at the helm, powered by your 12 volt power, protected from the elements. Why cobble together a whole bunch of differing stuff.

The I pad is a great instrument as Minnnie noted above and I concur and it is portable. When conditions are rougher and the weather inclement I dont want to rely on that topsides if I dont have to. I love my I Pad and it portability. Its a great planning tool. If I was serious about all the electronic data I would get the equipment designed for it. Its not that expensive anymore.

Its like too much head down sailing. Everyone looking at their screens,,,whats the computer say the wind is here, whats the computer say the current is here, whats the computer say where we are, whats the computer say about the ship 10 miles away and are we going to colide. Then sail 10 minutes and check all the elctronics again.

Hey I have a chartplotter ,radar, ais, instruments and an I Pad to boot. But I am out there to sail my boat not be a quantum elctronics engineer. I am not an airline pilot needing to compute my next emergency landing.

On our boat we have " no electronics days" where we sail without the toys on. When is the last time youve all tried that for 8 hours or so???????
 
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#23 · (Edited)
I still dont get why not just by a system and have it permanently installed at the helm, powered by your 12 volt power, protected from the elements. Why cobble together a whole bunch of differing stuff.

The I pad is a great instrument as Minnnie noted above and I concur and it is portable. When conditions are rougher and the weather inclement I dont want to rely on that topsides if I dont have to. I love my I Pad and it portability. Its a great planning tool. If I was serious about all the electronic data I would get the equipment designed for it. Its not that expensive anymore.

Its like too much head down sailing. Everyone looking at their screens,,,whats the computer say the wind is here, whats the computer say the current is here, whats the computer say where we are, whats the computer say about the ship 10 miles away and are we going to colide. Then sail 10 minutes and check all the elctronics again.

Hey I have a chartplotter ,radar, ais, instruments and an I Pad to boot. But I am out there to sail my boat not be a quantum elctronics engineer. I am not an airline pilot needing to compute my next emergency landing.

On our boat we have " no electronics days" where we sail without the toys on. When is the last time youve all tried that for 8 hours or so???????
Dave my friend,

We've had this debate before, and as I've said before, different setups work better for different people.

But I think you're "talking out of both sides of your mouth" by suggesting that people spend $$$$ for a permanently mounted system like yours (including radar, AIS, and other nice "distractions"), but then accusing others of head-down sailing. Any system, whether laptop, tablet, or a permanent turnkey system, can be as simple or as complex as you want it. If you design it properly and keep it simple it is a nice dashboard to have in front of you without touching it, and if it's too complex you'll spend too much time zooming in and out, and otherwise manipulating it. But this is true whether it's a turnkey Raymarine system (which, on both of my charters, I found to require a ridiculous number of button pushes to get any information) or a cobbled together PC/tablet system. I've got my Netbook configured with a dual screen, one side zoomed in for detail, the other zoomed out for AIS targets. The chartplotter program runs continuously - I reboot it a couple times a season, otherwise it's simply put to sleep when I stow it away between sails, where I believe it is stored more securely than a fancy display in the cockpit.



I have very little room at my helm, and a "pod" on the binnacle would obstruct movement far more than my little Netbook bracket. Also, my Netbook mount is infinitely adjustable, so if I choose to sit next to the wheel on the windward side, I can pivot it to view it from that position.



If it rains or I'm in rough conditions, I put the thing away in the cabin (where it still continues to run and can still control the autopilot via Bluetooth, if I so choose), but for those situations I have the waterproof handheld mounted on the binnacle (which you can see in the pic above).



These things are wonderful tools to have, and I believe the parody of someone running head-on into an island with his head buried in the computer screen is just a figment of a cynic's imagination.

As for the computer telling me if I am going to collide, I can tell you that the closest-point-of-approach calculations of the AIS system are a HUGE safety improvement that takes a most of the guesswork out of sailing on my crowded river. I give the big freighters a lot of space, but I know with confidence that I have 15 minutes to cross the channel before it's here (or, more frequently, that the distant ship is only anchored and not coming toward me at all). It turns a potentially dangerous river into a safe sailing range.

I'm curious about the SailTime Wind Vane, but reluctant because I have resisted to avoid the very complexity you've expressed concern about. My windex works fine (even though the PO installed it backwards :confused: ), and I just had the window on my bimini enlarged so I can have a better view of it. I hope you're more tolerant of people looking up than looking down. :laugher
 
#22 ·
Ok chef I'll chime in.

1. Cost
For navigation alone my iPad is a touchscreen navigation system that in some cases is far not sophisticated than a system costing many many thousands of dollars.

2. Convenience. I can mount it in my boat so I can see it just like other instruments. Heads not down. It's above the companionway.

3. Learning. When I sail I am always learning. How do I know the minute adjustment I did to sail made it better or worse?

I'm also a techie so I love the high tech options.

In my opinion if if helps you sail better then use it. I plan on getting dedicated instruments but almost all systems now can link to an iPad for a good reason.

Convenience.

The thing that will probably happen at some time in the future is that all these things will get merged into one device.
 
#25 ·
Hey I didnt say not to use it. I guess thats where the talking out of both sides of my mouth came. I have a dedicated system so obviously I beleive in the elctrontics too.

But I also beleive what Jon has been preaching here for a while that people with electrontics will take risks that normally they wouldnt.

For sailing a few hours on the Delaware River in good weather your set up works.

For a 12 hour trip in rough weather down through Delaware Bay or in the Ocean it doesnt. So it does work for your type of sailing. I want something there when the weather gets rougher. Thats when you really want it too. For less than a couple of thousand dollars you can get a good touch screen CP and radar now. You flip a switch it works...it doesnt have to reboot...it doesnt have to be charged..it dimms in poor light...its integrated with autohelms and other intruments...it gives you weather...and some even hook into an I pad.

I AM NOT AGAINST ELECTRONICS obviously. I am against the overdependence on them.

My point about sailing without electronics is that for me it can take away from the experience sometimes FOR ME. I also find that people who dont practice without it, are at a loss with out it when it goes out.
 
#26 ·
As a bit of a traditionalist, I still think that navigation belongs at the nav station. I am quite happy not having a chartplotter / iPad / computer / handheld at the helm. Give me a navigator who communicates clearly and succinctly and and a helm who understands. And both know how to use their eyes.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Three minor points:
1. There are two categories of IPAD. One is wifi only and one has wifi and cellular.
The wifi only model does not have the built-in gps chip.
You need to get the cellular model.
You do not need to purchase the cellular plan as the gps chip will still work but you do need the cellular model or you have to purchase a separate plug-in compatible gps dongle for the wifi only unit.
2. The ability to see in bright sunlight is an issue for most of us.
3. The battery will run down very quickly so you need a charging source.
 
#30 · (Edited)
New technology, like the wireless anemometer above are terrific and will surely increase the capabilities of electronics and decrease the price as it progresses. I have serious reservations about actually depending on non-marine designed electronic products. Maybe they'd be ok for close inshore application, but not for any kind of extended trip. Sunlight visibility is a BIG issue. Displays designed for indoor use can be totally useless when you need them most.

I have tried OpenCPN a number of times and finally got tired of it crashing and burning. Maybe it's my computers (which work fine for Sailcruiser, Polar Navy, and Seaclear) but I would never depend on this program.
 
#33 · (Edited)
[Edit: This was in reply to Vency's pics. Somehow 2 pages worth of posts came in while I was typing, so it's been mostly overtaken by events.]

Nice. Do you know the integration details?

In spite of my comment about daytime readability, I've been considering going this route myself. My old C80 has screen damage. I am considering taking taking that as an upgrade opportunity, but the cost of a modern MPD with a similar screen size is considerably higher than the cost of a lower end iPad plus water proof case.

But integrating into you on-board systems is more than just installing the right apps on your iPad. Others have mentioned NMEA wifi bridges--what are people's experience with those? How solid are they? The sort of fiddliness we are used to putting up with for home networks would not be not good for marine instrument networks. The last thing I want to do is troubleshoot a wifi connection during a blow or have my sounder stop reporting in skinny water.

The big marine electronic venders seem to almost willfully get wifi integration wrong, doing things like insisting on hosting their own network rather than joining an existing one. That makes it hard to do things live internet integration via a phone or iPad.
 
#35 ·
I went with a Ray E7 and used NMEA 2000 for my triducer and wheel pilot. It all integrated as advertised. Ray also has an Ipad app so you can mirror the E7 and control it using its own wifi. Just started playing with it, but it seems to work.
 
#36 ·
Joel,

Youll be real happy with that unit.

I wish they had the wireless available in the c90w last summer when they replace the lightening strike stuff. The c95w now has it also.

I need a larger screen than the 7 as my eyes are older than yours:p:p
 
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