Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat... - Page 8 - SailNet Community
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post #71 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

Yeah, no such thing as a free slip. Even my dock in Honduras which I own has cost me 2 grand this year. My neighbors are always tied to it, and they don't ever bring rum.

" Some are boat wise and some are other wise"

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post #72 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

Sorry to hear it, bummer.

My view is that it's a bad idea to get sentimental with boats, I'd take the opportunity to move on.
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post #73 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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Originally Posted by chrisncate View Post
Sorry to hear it, bummer.

My view is that it's a bad idea to get sentimental with boats, I'd take the opportunity to move on.
I'm really sorry to hear about Jim's misfortune.

But I don't think this is about sentimentality, it's about risk management and practicality. There's a certain price/displacement ratio that's always going to have some risk involved. So if he dumps this boat and gets another similar boat, the next one might have similar or worse problems. Only if you alter the ratio by going higher in price and/or lower displacement (i.e., a newer, more reliable but costlier or smaller boat) do you get a little less risk.

It sounds to me like the stuff that failed was destined to fail on a boat this age. It would have been replaced in the next couple of years, but unfortunately has to be done now before he can enjoy the boat. But once it's done, he can be confident that he'll have reliable aux power.

This whole concept of "it'll cost more than the boat is worth" is always a bit misleading. Any low cost boat is going to need greater maintenance and repairs. So you're inviting that when you buy it. The correct comparison is not really between repair cost and current boat value, it's between repair cost (current and anticipated future) and anticipated enjoyment of this particular vessel. In other words, what's this boat worth to YOU? But always keep in mind that dumping this boat and getting another could just be a replay of the same experience, unless you alter your price/displacement ratio in a different way.
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post #74 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

Jim,
I took some time to think a bit.

What you need is to have it hauled, and put a claim in to the insurance company for damages.
They will then have to have it inspected and prove that the problem was not caused by hitting something (i.e., normal wear and tear).
They will have a hard time proving that when faced by a written report from the delivery skipper, and the FACT that he motored against 20-30 kt winds for 2 days prior to the catastrophic and sudden failure of the transmission.

Play hard ball with them, you have literally nothing to lose.
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post #75 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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Originally Posted by CalebD View Post
Jimgo,

At least the engine in your Allmand isn't a Volvo!!!
Replacement parts prices for Volvo diesels are through the roof.
I'm not loving it, but I find the general perception to be overstated, unless really getting into specialty parts.

100hp turbo charged diesel.

Turbo = 3,100
Elbow = 900

What would equivalent parts be on a 100hp Yanmar? You can't compare it to a 35hp.


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post #76 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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I'm not loving it, but I find the general perception to be overstated, unless really getting into specialty parts.

100hp turbo charged diesel.

Turbo = 3,100
Elbow = 900

What would equivalent parts be on a 100hp Yanmar? You can't compare it to a 35hp.
For the price you spent on parts I could almost afford a newly refurbished Atomic 4.

Actually it is not just Volvo diesels that have a ridiculous markup for parts.
For a friends Universal engine I priced new injectors at Torreson: $90 per injector (x 3 cylinders = $270).
With some cross referencing to the Kubota engine block I found the same injectors for around $8 per (x 33 cylinders = $24). That is one astounding mark up for a marine use product that tractor owners pay nearly 90% less for the same item.
Not sure if you can source Volvo parts that way (from truck or heavy equipment dealers).
You would have to put a gun to my head to get me to buy a boat with an older Volvo or Farymann diesel in it.
I'm spoiled from owning an Atomic 4 which is easy to self service and parts cost about what they should. Guess I'm just a cheap azzed, bottom feeding boater, but that is my story and I'm sticking to it.
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Last edited by CalebD; 04-04-2013 at 07:57 PM.
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post #77 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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Originally Posted by CalebD View Post
For the price you spent on parts I could almost afford a newly refurbished Atomic 4.

I'm spoiled from owning an Atomic 4 which is easy to self service and parts cost about what they should. Guess I'm just a cheap azzed, bottom feeding boater, but that is my story and I'm sticking to it.
Good on ya. Everyone should be happy with the bed they're sleeping in!

My Volvo is only 8 yrs old. Toasted the turbo, because a mech reinstalled the heat shield cover incorrectly and jammed the waste gate open. But I will never know which one.

What is an A4 in hp? 30? That's not a fair compare. But I get your point.


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post #78 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
I'm really sorry to hear about Jim's misfortune.

But I don't think this is about sentimentality, it's about risk management and practicality. There's a certain price/displacement ratio that's always going to have some risk involved. So if he dumps this boat and gets another similar boat, the next one might have similar or worse problems. Only if you alter the ratio by going higher in price and/or lower displacement (i.e., a newer, more reliable but costlier or smaller boat) do you get a little less risk.

It sounds to me like the stuff that failed was destined to fail on a boat this age. It would have been replaced in the next couple of years, but unfortunately has to be done now before he can enjoy the boat. But once it's done, he can be confident that he'll have reliable aux power.

This whole concept of "it'll cost more than the boat is worth" is always a bit misleading. Any low cost boat is going to need greater maintenance and repairs. So you're inviting that when you buy it. The correct comparison is not really between repair cost and current boat value, it's between repair cost (current and anticipated future) and anticipated enjoyment of this particular vessel. In other words, what's this boat worth to YOU? But always keep in mind that dumping this boat and getting another could just be a replay of the same experience, unless you alter your price/displacement ratio in a different way.
My view on these matters is biased. It's easy to waste a lot of money and time on an old boat because you love the boat.

I really meant to express that one should try to take a critical eye when thinking about getting into a moderate project like this. The "what's it worth to you" idea is one I am very familiar with, as I often justified what I did expressing that very sentiment. I no longer subscribe to that notion after trying it though.

Now I believe in the "what's it worth to a sane person/would a sane person do what I am thinking about doing" notion. Things seem to be working out better this way so far...

Last edited by chrisncate; 04-04-2013 at 10:15 PM.
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post #79 of 455 Old 04-04-2013
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

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Originally Posted by chrisncate View Post
My view on these matters is biased. It's easy to waste a lot of money and time on an old boat because you love the boat.

I really meant to express that one should try to take a critical eye when thinking about getting into a moderate project like this. The "what's it worth to you" idea is one I am very familiar with, as I often justified what I did expressing that very sentiment. I no longer subscribe to that notion after trying it though.

Now I believe in the "what's it worth to a sane person/would a sane person do what I am thinking about doing" notion. Things seem to be working out better this way so far...
I don't disagree with you. I'm just saying that buying another large, old, inexpensive, risky boat could end up in the same result or worse, so giving up this one and starting over with another similar boat is just doubling down on the same risks. IMO the most direct way to reduce the risk is to spend more or go smaller (assuming it's from a reputable builder). But people have budget limits and want a certain size boat for various reasons, so they take the risk (and sometimes it ends up costing them).


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post #80 of 455 Old 04-04-2013 Thread Starter
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Re: Apparently I'm not meant to have a boat...

Chrisncate, that's basically the analysis I'm going through. So far, the local marina hasn't given me a written description of their findings, nor have they given me an estimate for the costs. We paid a nice price for teh boat, one where we could invest a few thousand and still have "equity" left in the boat. We had hoped not to make that investment SO soon.

Chuck, I've asked the local marina to pull the boat; haven't heard back from them. I'll give you a call tomorrow.

- Jim
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1980 Allmand 31
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