It was you that dismissed the importance of stability curves in modern Yacht design and remembered the old day where they were not used. For what you have said It seemed you did not consider them important in modern boat design. I am referring to this post:
You guys and your graphs. Do you really understand how inadequate a 2D graph like that is compared to the dynamic forces of the sea. But if it amuses you then play on. I'm not sure this is the right environment for me.
Do me a favor, go back and determine how many designs from the S&S office had full stability studies done. Surpirse! Now do it for Phil Rhodes office. Surpise! All this preoccupation with numbers is a function of the computer age and the ability to use some bozos program to get some numbers.
I did a full stability study of the Valiant 40 about a year after production had begun. I did it because people wanted to know. ..
Silly people. Scared yet?
For the record:
Of course the modern design offices all do stability studies. We all use computers now andf all it takes is the push of a button. I love it when Paulo lectures me on how a yacht design office works. Usually these days we do multiple stability studies as we evaluate different keels and draft options.
I am glad you consider them an important tool, as everybody else.
For the record:
Paulo's claim that you can use all that volume aft in the flat, wide stern racer type hull for cruising gear is not valid. You cannot put a 100 gallon fuel tank in the stern of one of those boats without bad trim problems. However, in a heavier boat, say a D/L arpound 275 you may have volume below the cabin sole in the keel cavity to install a 100 gal. fuel tank amidships where it will not hurt anything while actually helping to lower your VCG.
Regarding inspired hulls from Open solo racer being used by several Major NAs and many sailors for voyage boats that is a fact
The existence of a fact does not deserve discussion
but the why and how is the relevant issue.
I understand why and how those hull, designed by several major NAs for the purpose of fast voyage boats work in what regards sailing potential, load and characteristics.
Since it is a fact they are used and that has to do with the advantages they offer to the sailors that choose them for voyaging I respectfully suggest you try to understand how they are used for voyaging (because they are
) and how they can carry the needed load (because they can
) that the ones that use them considers necessary.
Regarding carrying heavy loads on the back of the transom, everybody knows that is not indicated and should be avoided. I never said that. I said that those boats have a large transom and all the beam pushed back. That means that in comparison with a narrow boat, or a boat with the max beam at the middle and a tiny transom, the back cabins are comparatively huge. The back cabin is not the transom
and in there are plenty of storage space away from the transom. Anyway, not all needed things to cruise are heavy and even the extra space near the back of the transom can come handy for the storage of light but voluminous stuff.
Regarding water and fuel we can ask Eric but I think that they are carried at the center of the boat. Almost all that voyage in those boat uses hydrogenerators, similar to the ones racing boats use. The produce 500w at 7K (if I am not mistaken) and on the trade winds 7K is a very low average speed for these boats.
They are very light and sail with very little wind so the quantity of fuel they have to carry is very small. Regarding water they use normally a watermaker but even so the water tankage of a Pogo 12.50 is 200l, the one from a Cigale 14 is 500L and the one from a RM 1260 is 400l. All of them can take more tankage as an option.
You seem to forget that there are some that prefer to voyage in small boats like Contessa or westsail and those have normally not a watermaker and an inferior or equal water tankage regarding the boats I am talking about.
But Bob, the important point here is : They exist, they have been used successfully used as fast voyage boats for many years, their number has always been increasing and they are the right voyage boats for many among the ones that like fast boats.
Saying that they cannot exist because they cannot carry the needed load does not make sense, since they exist they are increasing in numbers, they are designed and used for voyaging and obviously satisfy those that own and use them for that purpose.
For the record: I think Paulo and I have the same taste in boats.
I like to sail fast.
If you like only one type of boat I am sorry to disappoint you but that that is not true because I like many types of different boats and some of them are not even fast, like old traditional boats. If I could I would have a collection, just for fun and to suit my mood.
Yes in what regards cruising I like fast boats but the one that I have chosen is the one adequate (for me) to do the cruise I do, that involves a lot of variable winds and lots of upwind sailing.
If I went for a circumnavigation or went for extensive voyaging on the trade winds, then if I could I would pick a Cigale or RM and then we would not agree in the boats we like anymore.
It I went for cruising in high latitudes, I would pick a Boreal that has also the hull shape based on Open solo racers and then again we would not agree on the type of boat we like.
It seems to me that I like the boats you like but you don’t like all the boats I like
I will not be able to continue this agreeable discussion (insults apart, of course). I am on the limit of time to prepare my annual 4 months of cruising and I will restrict my participation to some posts on the interesting sailboat thread.