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  #21  
Old 04-20-2013
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Paying for Document

Most people do not mind paying for service or products of value at an reasonable appropriate price -- open for judgement of course. Review any service or product for such judgement of your own accord.

It is easy to understand folks not favoring a renewal fee for a service that does not increase value, yet, if the fee is void would the service cease? Most likely it would not, so would the free renewal result in a decrease in service? Possible.

To understand the matter of the cost one must follow the money. Do not listen to words of political decision makers to understand their thoughts, rather follow where they decide money is routed.

When one thinks of the changing of business practices it seems everything is moving toward a subscription service; an annual fee could be thought of as a subscription service under an
a legacy name.

Who knows?? Perhaps there may be a fee to de-document a boat in the future??? Anything is possible.
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  #22  
Old 04-20-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

smurph-
A small one. The IRS used to make tax forms available by faxback system, so you could call in, get an index, then call back and get any form you needed immediately.
They improved that by offering PDF versions of the forms. And then, the improved that again, substantially, by updating to "fillable PDF" forms that can be filled out on the computer, not just printed as blanks.
All at no charge.

So yes, you might call that small progress but it sets the unthinkable precedent that someone at a government agency can actually make the paperwork simpler, and do so for free.

I'm also reminded of what happens every time there is a fare increase on public transit systems: Ridership goes down, revenue doesn't increase as projected. If the USCG turns documentation into another annual PITA bill, it will also become cheaper for folks to simply drop it, and then just pay the $100 up front again when and if they need it to go abroad.
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  #23  
Old 04-20-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

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Originally Posted by chuck53 View Post
..... a service that many of us want and/or need...
You really want or need routine renewals of your registration? Why?

We all pay for the initial registration, which makes sense. What additional value is there in renewing it?
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  #24  
Old 04-20-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Our state (Connecticut) requires that ANY vessel that stays in state waters more than X days (I think it is 30?) pay the state registration fee, even if it is Documented. Our 36' boat costs $180. Federal documentation provides a lien history that state registration can not, so Documentation can simplify the sale of a vessel, because the buyer only has to check with the Feds to make sure there are no liens on the boat, instead of any of 50 states that the boat may have traveled through and incurred bills in. I have had no issues with sending in the renewal (by fax, most recently) and getting the Documentation Certificate quickly back from West Virginia, where the Documentation Offices are located. Since the documentation number doesn't change, all you have to do is keep a copy of your application for renewal along with your old certificate until you get the renewed certificate. It really isn't a big deal, even if you are "over there" somewhere.

I would certainly prefer to continue getting renewals at no cost, but can understand that with the Coast Guard being hit with major budget cuts due to the sequester, (thank you GOP) they are looking to recoup costs wherever they can. While we pleasure craft owners may question it, annual renewals may be useful in the case of commercial vessels that might change hands frequently. It enables the Coast Guard to actually keep closer track of who is responsible for the towboat that runs into the Mississippi mile 48 Bridge, or the freighter that runs down a sailboat on a foggy night. Of course, if Documenting your boat isn't worth it to you.... don't!

Last edited by paulk; 04-20-2013 at 10:06 PM.
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  #25  
Old 04-20-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
You really want or need routine renewals of your registration? Why?

We all pay for the initial registration, which makes sense. What additional value is there in renewing it?
Since I live in VA, a CG documented boat does not have to be state registered. If I don't renew, I'm in deep doo-doo because my boat will be neither registered or documented. We have to renew (and pay for) our car registration every year, why not boats?
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Last edited by chuck53; 04-20-2013 at 10:32 PM.
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  #26  
Old 04-20-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
smurph-
A small one. The IRS used to make tax forms available by faxback system, so you could call in, get an index, then call back and get any form you needed immediately.
They improved that by offering PDF versions of the forms. And then, the improved that again, substantially, by updating to "fillable PDF" forms that can be filled out on the computer, not just printed as blanks.
All at no charge.

So yes, you might call that small progress but it sets the unthinkable precedent that someone at a government agency can actually make the paperwork simpler, and do so for free.

I'm also reminded of what happens every time there is a fare increase on public transit systems: Ridership goes down, revenue doesn't increase as projected. If the USCG turns documentation into another annual PITA bill, it will also become cheaper for folks to simply drop it, and then just pay the $100 up front again when and if they need it to go abroad.
It could be the real motivation is to eliminate a large portion of the documentation. I think you're right that many people will just drop it and go with their state registration. The benefits of documentation are really questionable and probably not worth it to many if it's going to cost money. In NY, the state has been smart enough to make boat (and car) registrations good for multiple years so that's also an example of some small progress.
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Old 04-21-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

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Originally Posted by chuck53 View Post
Since I live in VA, a CG documented boat does not have to be state registered. If I don't renew, I'm in deep doo-doo because my boat will be neither registered or documented. We have to renew (and pay for) our car registration every year, why not boats?
Your logic presumes that the documentation needs to expire, when the question was why you see value in it expiring at all. There is no reason for annual auto registration expiration either, other than to collect the fee.
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  #28  
Old 04-21-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
Your logic presumes that the documentation needs to expire, when the question was why you see value in it expiring at all. There is no reason for annual auto registration expiration either, other than to collect the fee.
Those agencies that register/document boats, cars, trailers, trucks, motorcycles, airplanes, etc. will eventually become overwhelmed with records of vehicles that no longer exist, have been abandoned, sold out of their jurisdiction, etc. People are good at getting things registered as there are consequences of not doing it, but having vehicles de-registered just ain't going to happen.
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  #29  
Old 04-21-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Be nice if there was single website for all "stamps and ribbons". AIS,SSB,ERIRB, boat Doc. etc. Could set up password protected account once ( possibly linked to US bank account) and take care of all this stuff anywhere at anytime. Would simplify life for us and the commercial folk as well. Curently moving some stuff from old boat to new and trying to set up boat with new stuff. Can't fully go through all the paperwork until it is landed in the U.S. Need one piece of paper to get another peice of paper. Major PIA.
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Old 04-21-2013
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Re: Paying for Document

Folks please use comment secton mentioned in original post. Just did it and it was effortless. May make no difference but you never know. Seems general agreement on this thread their proposal makes little sense for us or security or as a way to generate funds. Pleae let them know.
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