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  #181  
Old 09-05-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

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Originally Posted by tdw View Post
Interestingly enough while me and the Wombet have been known to exchange the odd cross word, and nothing cryptic about that at all, when we have attended classes together we have had zero problems, indeed we become a very effective team.
That is very cool and kinda rare. For us a big part of it has honestly been the situation at the time. One of us watch kids while the other goes for the class for a few days. With really small ones and no family nearby it is sometimes the only option. We are a great team in the course of doing, but we have very different learning styles and having recognized it long ago we have avoided it.

Pink for boys huh? Just kidding. I hate the gender identity as color identity thing.

And yes, poor Robin. What exactly does a "Ward" have to do?
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  #182  
Old 09-06-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

I can so relate to all of this being that I've always been a tomboy, always disliked pink & frilly(also never had a Barbie) & know that I can do many things just as good as men can. Don't get me wrong I love men. I just don't feel beneath them.

I hope to meet many of you strong minded women on my cruising adventures!
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  #183  
Old 09-06-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

I hate the *concept* of women-only classes, just as I strongly disagree with the concept of gender-segregated elementary and junior-high school classes. It's just too easy to go from "different" learning styles to lesser learning. Sorry, but last time we tried "separate but equal" in education in this country it didn't turn out so well, ya know?

That said, of course there are different styles in learning, individual differences not gender-caused. I'm an engineer and a visual learner and if a class doesn't include at least one vector diagram I probably won't retain much. Not because I'm a girl, just because I'm me. Dan, OTOH, doesn't like to work with numbers, even though he has an engineering degree also.

I'm very pleased that we both learned together, from the same instructor in the same way, from our initial liveaboard/learn-to-sail vacation in the Virgin Islands; to our Coast Guard Aux navigation classes, to our Navy Sailing adventures. For us, that meant there was no debate of "my instructor said to do it this way" when his instructor said to do it a different way in a new or challenging situation.
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  #184  
Old 09-06-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

Be careful about letting the women learn too much about how the boat works! I know one poor guy whose wife ran off with the boat when he was ashore doing something and is now halfway around the world with it
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  #185  
Old 09-06-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

Not sure what point this makes, you decide.

I just moved my daughter into her dorm a couple of weeks back. Her floor has three bathrooms. One Men's, one Women's and one Co-ed. Each have multiple stalls and showers for approx 6 people to be using at once. Interesting liberal Ivy League idea. I swear I wondered if it is really a social experiment, run by a wacky professor.

After a couple of weeks, she says there are really two Men's rooms and one Women's room. The men don't seem to care if there is a woman in the next stall or shower, but the women do and never go in there.

There seem to be some differentiators between genders that are self selected, not imposed.
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  #186  
Old 09-08-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

I'm not quite sure where you're going with this point either Minne. The reasons these women have for not wanting to share bathrooms with the guys may come from motivations that do are not relevant to the reasons they may not want to learn sailing together. I'm thinking of body-modesty taboos; or maybe the guys are sloppier, or drunken barfing after frat parties; or who-knows-what.

And as for learning styles ... how many of the guys here can honestly say that they preferred learning in an environment where they were yelled at? I don't think that's a gender thing, I think its a respect thing.
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  #187  
Old 09-08-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

As long as that book gave directions on how to make the perfect sandwich, it was worth the money.
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  #188  
Old 09-08-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingNwing View Post
I'm not quite sure where you're going with this point either Minne. The reasons these women have for not wanting to share bathrooms with the guys may come from motivations that do are not relevant to the reasons they may not want to learn sailing together. I'm thinking of body-modesty taboos; or maybe the guys are sloppier, or drunken barfing after frat parties; or who-knows-what. .
Fear of being sexually assaulted! Or just good common sense.

Neither of which belong in a this debate. :-)




Carry on....
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

No intention to offend. Certainly not making any connection between co-ed bathrooms and sail training preferences. The discussion is over sexism. I just thought it interesting, when presented with an equal opportunity, there was clear self selected choice.
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Old 09-08-2013
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Re: Is Sailing Sexist?

My wife and I have sailed together for 4 decades. We have attended sailing schools over the years but never on the same course. The reason is simply we have different motives.

For example, I wanted to learn the finer points of celestial navigation (long before the wonders of GPS), she just wanted to learn the meaning of lights so that she would be more confident on a night watch. So we would go to the same school, different course. I would do an diesel engine course, she would do a cooking or victualing course. Is that gender discriminatory? No, I don't believe it is. We concentrate on what we're good at.

I don't subscribe to gender specific courses but I do support couples not being on the same course. Watching a stranger on a course shouting at my wife would be something to behold. And I also know the fact in our relationship that my wife can sail a boat competently and she cooks a meal at sea like nobody else I've met. But she has (self-acknowledged) "no feeling for machinery" - she never notices a change in the note of an engine running or the groan of something wearing or that the boat speed relative to engine revs has dropped.

Neither does she care. That's for me to worry about. And I don't know whether the chicken that defrosted three days ago is going to kill me. That's hers.
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