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  #21  
Old 04-09-2012
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Re: Compresion post repaired

Headliner - I'm about done with my replacement. Cleats epoxied to the headliner made from 1" cedar strips and 1/4" plywood sheets screwed to the cleats for the covering. I suppose it technically isn't done yet - but I've used the same technique before with no issues.
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  #22  
Old 04-10-2012
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Re: Compresion post repaired

At least on the 1979 version I have, all the cabinets and the countertop were a high quality teak veneer plywood but I think not Bruneel. It looked different from the stuff I assumed was Bruneel which is exposed as structural members in the head locker chainplates. My counter had squashed down to about 1/4" from its original 3/4". I pulled out the whole thing and started over because rot had ruined the counter. Lots of screw holes on the trim to re-plug! I tried to keep my promise of pictures but the upload technology baffles me. What I intended to show was that, after a closer inspection this weekend, I believe one should take a hard look at replacing the entire system with a single compression post bedded into the hull cross-members as the best fix. Steel, aluminum, or wood (kept dry) would all work. After all, if you can take a shower in an I-28 head, you can certainly squeeze by the new post!
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  #23  
Old 04-13-2012
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Re: Compresion post repaired

gknott, you are correct about the counter not being burneel, my metal portion of the compression post has sunk about 3/16 of an inch in to the counter-top too. So, its not as hard as the plywood under the 4x4 and cabin sole. So, it is a weak link of the set up.

I'm going for the option of replacing a portion of the cabin sole, the piece or plywood under the 4x4, cutting out the counter-top around the metal post, and replacing all of them with the GO3 fiberglass, and bonded to mating surfaces with epoxy. Of course the metal post would be bolted down still in the same location.

Mark15, I have seen your pictures of your rebuild, nice work is an understatement. Your rebuild under the 4x4 is better then what I plan, but within my technical skill, not sure I could do what you did. I will take some pictures of my rebuild when I get to it and post them on this thread.

Our recent discussions on this subject will give more choices for future members wanting to fix this problem with the aging boats out there. I do know the boat is definitely worth fixing, I just love the way it sails and the daily compliments I get on mine.
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  #24  
Old 03-15-2013
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Re: Compression post repaired

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
510, a lot of the plywood on the I28 is "Bruneel" plywood, which is damned strong stuff. I don't recall ever looking at what that little counter top section is made from, but if that's also Bruneel, it is already as strong as fiberglass.(VBG)
I would disagree with any organic wood being stronger then GP03 electric grade fiberglass. Wood absorbs water, it's suppose to supply the tree with water and is more easily deformed the more it absorbs, yielding to permanent deformation. Hence, why my floor has sagged under load. GP03 fiberglass resist absorbing water better then regular polyester resin fiberglass, has glass fiber and fillers, and therefore less likely to have permanent deformation.

However, I have decided to use 6061 T-6 Aluminum instead of fiberglass supported by concrete filled in the keel between the joices and to the same level as the joices.

Anyway, on to my update on how I will be fixing my sagging compression post.

I have found the reason my two support joice are at different heights. While both have torn away from keel walls where they were fiberglassed to the keel walls, one has departed more then the other.

So, I will need to remove both and put in new ones, both at the height of the higher one, closer to the original height.

Then remove the two joices, a 10"x24" portion of the 3/4 plywood floor, glass in two new joices, put down a piece of PVC pipe for drainage, pour concrete between the joices, level with the joices. I have a piece of 3/4"x10"x24" of powder coated 6061-T6 aluminum to put in place of the floor. I will remove the 3/4 piece of plywood under the wood post attached to the bulkhead, replace it with a piece of 3"x4" of powder coated aluminum. Then once everything has cured, remove the jacks.

Then unscrew the metal post from the counter top, and jack up the mast again, re-secure with lumber, and move the metal post enough to remove the sunk portion of the 3/4 plywood counter. I have a 5" diameter piece of 3/4" thick teak to replace under the metal post. Then remove the jacks, lumber, and install new standing rigging.

Lastly, make a two piece portion of 1/2 plywood topped with 1/4 mahogany plywood to go around the metal post to finish up the counter top.

I'm doing most of the work Saturday, Sunday, and Monday. I will take pictures of everything, and post them up as soon as I get time after the job is finished.

I will greatly appreciate your prayers all goes well and safely. I will be praying for sure!

Be back soon!

I have decided to remove the mast to do the repairs. I need the mast painted, new wiring, and want new LED lights.

Last edited by 510datsun; 03-19-2013 at 07:23 PM.
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  #25  
Old 03-15-2013
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Re: Compresion post repaired

510, I'm talking about the plywood used above deck, for the cabin sides and deck. You couldn't afford to buy G10 or any other fiberglass in a thickness that gave you strength equivalent to what is there. I'm not saying wood is as strong as fiberglass, only that the existing wood is as strong as any fiberglass you would try to replace it with, partly because it is so much thicker--as is, in that application.

As to the sagging floors, that's a matter of poor design and constant humidity. The boat was not designed for that offset mast support, the original plans show a keel-stepped mast. Wood obviously was sufficient as long as it was kept dry, which it couldn't be.

I would personally never use concrete ot fill anything in the bilge, since concrete consists mainly of water and in fact it has no strength and easily crumbles if you remove the water content. Kept in the blige, it will attract and retain water at the highest concentration, rotting out anything it touches. This is why fenceposts and traditional wrought iron fencing were always set in molten lead--never directly in concrete or other materials that retained moisture. Today, an epoxy is more likely to be used for the barrier material. Modern stuff dropped into concrete or sand is chosen to be rot-resistant, and even then, replaced in 30 years as it rots. The old old iron set in lead? Timeless.
As powder coating is not forever, and any faults will trap moisture in between the lifting coat and the aluminum...I'm not sure I'd bury powder-coated aluminum in the floor either. Any edges that compress against it should also cut through the coating. But ten years from now, we can debate how well those choices have held up.<G>

Last edited by hellosailor; 03-15-2013 at 08:43 AM.
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Old 03-15-2013
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Re: Compresion post repaired

Just to prove how detail-oriented I am, it's "Bruynzeel" plywood. An interesting story with a little internet search. Bottom line, it's slipped a little but is still just about indestructable. Back to the compression post, I still advocate for removing the mast to do the repair if at all possible. If not for safety then just to save hassle, time, and work space with all the jacking. Especially if you plan to replace the standing rigging anyway. Good luck and just ignore all those cracking sounds when the mast comes up. BTW, I am still happy with my aluminum plates. Now I'm worried about the cross members they sit on. How in the world did the cross members on, I think it was, 510's boat tear away from the hull? What generated that kind of force?
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Old 03-19-2013
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Re: Compression post repaired

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
510, I'm talking about the plywood used above deck, for the cabin sides and deck. You couldn't afford to buy G10 or any other fiberglass in a thickness that gave you strength equivalent to what is there. I'm not saying wood is as strong as fiberglass, only that the existing wood is as strong as any fiberglass you would try to replace it with, partly because it is so much thicker--as is, in that application.

As to the sagging floors, that's a matter of poor design and constant humidity. The boat was not designed for that offset mast support, the original plans show a keel-stepped mast. Wood obviously was sufficient as long as it was kept dry, which it couldn't be.

I would personally never use concrete ot fill anything in the bilge, since concrete consists mainly of water and in fact it has no strength and easily crumbles if you remove the water content. Kept in the bilge, it will attract and retain water at the highest concentration, rotting out anything it touches. This is why fenceposts and traditional wrought iron fencing were always set in molten lead--never directly in concrete or other materials that retained moisture. Today, an epoxy is more likely to be used for the barrier material. Modern stuff dropped into concrete or sand is chosen to be rot-resistant, and even then, replaced in 30 years as it rots. The old old iron set in lead? Timeless.
As powder coating is not forever, and any faults will trap moisture in between the lifting coat and the aluminum...I'm not sure I'd bury powder-coated aluminum in the floor either. Any edges that compress against it should also cut through the coating. But ten years from now, we can debate how well those choices have held up.<G>
Point taken, I will not use concrete, I will just use joices fiberglassed to the hull. I will still use the aluminum plate for to support the compression post. Yes, aluminum can be attacked and have some electrolysis, but it will take a very long time to get to the point where it would be weaker then the plywood. I used some self etching primer and then several coats of paint, instead of the powder coating.

I currently have a drip-less on my propeller shaft, fixed most, if not all leaks from the hull, and only get some moisture from the hull condensation. I even have the icebox drain fixed with a pump to pump out the melted water through an outlet above the waterline at the stern, with a shutoff valve for just in case. So, I have a dry bilge. If I get any water in the bilge from working on anything, whatever the bilge pump does not remove, I vacuum out with a shopvac.

So, as long as I own the boat, corrosion to the aluminum will be close to zero, but hey, you never know. You can always remove the aluminum plate later if need be. I'm leaving floor access to do just that, I believe nothing is permanent, and therefore, should be able to be serviced.
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  #28  
Old 03-19-2013
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Re: Compression post repaired

Quote:
Originally Posted by gknott View Post
Just to prove how detail-oriented I am, it's "Bruynzeel" plywood. An interesting story with a little internet search. Bottom line, it's slipped a little but is still just about indestructable. Back to the compression post, I still advocate for removing the mast to do the repair if at all possible. If not for safety then just to save hassle, time, and work space with all the jacking. Especially if you plan to replace the standing rigging anyway. Good luck and just ignore all those cracking sounds when the mast comes up. BTW, I am still happy with my aluminum plates. Now I'm worried about the cross members they sit on. How in the world did the cross members on, I think it was, 510's boat tear away from the hull? What generated that kind of force?
Poor preparation in the hull prior to fiberglassing the joices from the looks of it, and soaked in bilge water for long periods prior to my owning the boat. I bought the boat basically from a lean sale for dock fees. The boat was poorly maintained when I purchased her.

I have had reservations and opt to remove the mast for repairs. So, its going to be awhile before I have completed this fix.
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Old 03-19-2013
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Re: Compresion post repaired

Thanks 510, I'll double check mine. When you were rooting around down there did you have a chance to see what kind of wood was used in the cross members? Mine are completely fiberglass covered so I cannot tell. What I do know from test drilling is that they are sound but saturated. Unfortunately, I do not have a dry bilge - yet. Which leaves me curious about your ice box pump. How did you set that up? Right now mine drains into a plastic container which I empty daily - or forget to empty daily.
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Old 03-19-2013
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Re: Compresion post repaired

A nice way to pump the icebox is with a foot pump connected to a spigot on the sink. The unobvious reason for this? In the morning or early afternoon, when the sink is empty and likekly to stay that way, you put in the stopper, pump the icebox, and now you've got a sink full of reasonably clean ice water to cool down drinks for the hot part of the day.

Don't need the cold drinks? That's ok, you can still pump the meltwater down the galley drain.
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