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Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Learning to Sail
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  #21  
Old 03-20-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog
Generally, the shrouds should never be sagging... slack on the leeward side might be okay, depending on the boat and design...but sagging or loose is generally a bad thing.

I was just wondering about the spreaders, because I don't recall seeing many boats that have forward swept spreaders.
I did notice the lee shrouds did loosen a little, but no sag at all.
I don't have alot of sailboats around here to compare to, or get ideas from so I'm just assuming she was rigged right and looking at all the pics I can find.
I learned another thing. I always wondered why nobody flew their country flag at the top of the rear stay, always at a lower point. It gets wrapped up in the main halyard when you raise the sail.
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  #22  
Old 03-20-2007
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Goose-

You really should fly the ensign on a staff from the transom of the boat... rather than along the backstay IMHO.
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  #23  
Old 03-20-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog
Generally, the shrouds should never be sagging... slack on the leeward side might be okay, depending on the boat and design...but sagging or loose is generally a bad thing.

I was just wondering about the spreaders, because I don't recall seeing many boats that have forward swept spreaders.
Dale,
Remember when you first lobbed in here I sent you a post re rig tightness ??
What is (I guess) happening to you is that because your rig is not set up correctly you are getting a lot of belly in your main. This is fine for light air drifting conditions as it gives the sail more power but it's not terribly aerodynamic which is what you need as the wind pipes up. Then your main will act like a wing rather than a bag of air. With forestay(s) taut you will have both sails , winging it, so to speak. The effect of this is to give you efficiency (lift) without the bagging causing the boat to go sideways. The boat will stand up to it's canvas better than it did before. (by winging it I mean both your fore and main sails with be acting like wings, I don't mean running wing and wing)

As it is now, because your main is overpowered its pushing the bum of the boat to leeward and so you will have all that weatherhelm. Tightening up on the rig (usually achieved by adjustable backstay) will improve your lot as the wind pipes up. If you have a mainsheet traveller then you will also help the situation by letting the car slide down to leeward which is a preferable method of losing wind from the sail than simply letting out the sheet. Letting out the sheet allows the boom end to rise which is not what you want.

Make sure the luff and foot tension on the main is good and tight for windy conditions, loosened off for drifting.

Finally you will also find that as the wind increases and a certain amount of weatherhelm reappears, don't fight it or you will stall the rudder. You can either ease that car to leeward which will help or , and this is one from the racing boys, use the weatherhelm to point higher into the wind, Let her ride up as the puff comes in and drop off in the lulls. It will take you awhile to get the hang of it but when you do you will also discover that it's a lot of fun. You will point higher and go faster.

SD,
The forward facing "spreaders" are I think called something like diamond stays. On a smallish fractional rig they stop the mast from bending forward and are effectively an alternative to running back stays. 30 years ago I had a small (21') keel boat which was a 7/8ths rig and it had this setup.
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Last edited by tdw; 03-21-2007 at 01:52 AM.
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  #24  
Old 03-20-2007
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I'm used to sailing boats with a masthead rig or near masthead rig... and the ones that have a fractional rig that extreme generally had running backstays.. which are a royal pain.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #25  
Old 03-20-2007
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"Dale,
Remember when you first lobbed in here I sent you a post re rig tightness ??"

I do now,,LOL. Next time out I'll take pictures of all the rigging and you guys can guide me through the adjustments.
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  #26  
Old 03-21-2007
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Dale-

I hope you have a tension gauge... You're gonna need one.
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You know what the first rule of sailing is? ...Love. You can learn all the math in the 'verse, but you take
a boat to the sea you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of the worlds. Love keeps
her going when she oughta fall down, tells you she's hurting 'fore she keens. Makes her a home.

—Cpt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity (edited)

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  #27  
Old 03-21-2007
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Goose:

That's a nice looking boat. Enjoy.
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  #28  
Old 03-21-2007
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I think the Portagee is on to something Goose. Next time, once you've got the mast up and the boat in the water, you need to get that mast straight up and down. Other threads on here deal with rig tension, but you need to get it lined up first. That will affect how she sails. Don't worry about the traveler, since you ain't got one. Me neither. Sail On, and congrats on the A-frame, you'll have it down to under an hour before you know it.
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  #29  
Old 03-21-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailingdog
I was just wondering about the spreaders, because I don't recall seeing many boats that have forward swept spreaders.
Giulietta does, doesn't she? I am sure Giu will be happy to post another pic.

Goose - there is a whole article on here somewhere about how to fly flags, what to fly where and when, its interesting.

One thing I do notice, and it may just be my bad eyesite, but the mainsheet set up looks different. in the other boats, (especially the one with the blue and white stay sail) it looks more vertical, like its attached to the toerail. Yours looks to be at more of an angle and it mounts to the transom. With the design of no vang and no traveller, that less vertical sheet may hinder your ability to shape the main properly. Then again, I could be completely wrong. I will leave it up to the experts to scrutinize my observation.

Make that two things. The boat with the blue and white stay sail is a masthead rig. I wonder how these were supposed to be rigged initially. Is that a modification? Fractional, masthead, or both?

Heres a guy that has a forestay, and a cockpit traveler.
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Last edited by bestfriend; 03-21-2007 at 03:41 AM.
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  #30  
Old 03-21-2007
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Bestfriend...all the mainsheets look the same to me but I think your instincts are right. Maybe a boom vang adjustment would take some of the belly out but I see no evidence of a boom vang. Goose....do ya have one?

Also...someone else noted a bellied main sail...how old is the mainsail Goose? Could be she is just blown out and has to much belly because of that.

And then there is the forestays and backstay. I would try letting go of your back stay tension a bit...then tightening up your forestays...then re-tensioning your backstay pulling the forestays much tighter.

All of the above are probably conributors to the weather helm you are experienceing. Also....if you are in deep water and not gonna hit bottom...you can experiment with lifting that centerboard and seeing what effect it has. You can always rig a new pin stop if a different position is better on some points of sail.
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