so I've done it!

[Cruisingdad]

For once, I think a photo will say a thousand words. Good idea BF. I would like to see a picture of your J to make sure this is not a farce.

I would not use a jet ski to tow a barge, I would not use a tug to tow a skier, and I would not take a J24 out further than I could swim back. And I HAVE SAILED THEM, and raced them. Nice, fun little boat to race. Had no problems stepping off of it back on the dock though. I cannot even comprehend how it would manage in 8-10' swells... forget the storm.

Surely this is a joke... but with some of the threads we have been getting lately, one has to wonder. Tom, if you are serious about this (which I HOPE you are not), this is not deep woods backpacking (which I have done a lot of too, incidentally). This is serious business. Since you have backpacked, assuming that is true, I would compare it to going through Intl Glacier with no bear bells and a nice steak tied around your neck. That is what the sharks will think, at any rate.

Ohhh, surely this is a joke... after what I just dealt with on another member, I could use a laugh. Please tell me this is Giu??

- CD

[Cruisingdad]

Tom, I just got a PM from a member that feels you are serious about this. Is this true?

- CD

[TomScanlan]

Originally Posted by sailingdog

Congratulations on the purchase and moving aboard. I'd agree that a J/24, while a great day sailing boat and good for racing around the buoys, is probably a very poor choice for any type of cruising, even limited distances, due to some problems inherent in the design.

There are several boats in that size range that would have been much better choices IMHO, like the Olson 25, which are also relatively "sporty" but are much more suited for cruising and living aboard. It would make sense, given your goals, to look at something like a Pearson Triton or Ariel, Albin Vega, or something a bit more forgiving in the conditions you'd probably face crossing to Latin America.

I probably have failed to make my plans very clear, as they are very loose. My mid-term goal to south america. I don't know or even expect that this will be the boat going there. Short term, I'm just out to learn and stay in the ICW up to NYC. With that said, I have looked at a number of boats other folks have mentioned would be good for that mid term goal. I just can't fit them into my money or time budget right now. BTW, if in florida, the chapman school near stuart FL is a good place for cheap fixer-uppers.

I am really curious why, besides obvious lack of space this is a bad boat for cruising in general or for going to south america. Again, I am really new to this, and though I'm an avid reader and grabber of verbal info, I just haven't had the exposure yet to the reasons behind your, and others, comments.

[bestfriend]

Tom, its just the basic principles of the design of a racing boat vs. a cruiser. First, it is a cored hull, lighter and faster, but not as strong when it comes to extreme weather. The shape of the hull also comes into play, designed to go over the waves, on top of the water, which is faster than going through them. Everything is built for speed. Structurally, they are built to last up to a point, then they will fail, and when they fail, it will be catastrophic. A boat designed for ocean cruising has a failure point too, but it is greater, and when it does fail, it does not destroy and sink the whole boat. The most simple way I can relay it is in ladders, wood vs. aluminum. Both work well. The wood ladder starts to creak and crack and moan and groan when it starts to fail, you have time to repair it. When an aluminum ladder fails, it just crumbles, no warning, complete failure. That is the difference between boats built for racing and offshore cruising.

[TomScanlan]

Originally Posted by Cruisingdad

For once, I think a photo will say a thousand words. Good idea BF. I would like to see a picture of your J to make sure this is not a farce.

I would not use a jet ski to tow a barge, I would not use a tug to tow a skier, and I would not take a J24 out further than I could swim back. And I HAVE SAILED THEM, and raced them. Nice, fun little boat to race. Had no problems stepping off of it back on the dock though. I cannot even comprehend how it would manage in 8-10' swells... forget the storm.

Surely this is a joke... but with some of the threads we have been getting lately, one has to wonder. Tom, if you are serious about this (which I HOPE you are not), this is not deep woods backpacking (which I have done a lot of too, incidentally). This is serious business. Since you have backpacked, assuming that is true, I would compare it to going through Intl Glacier with no bear bells and a nice steak tied around your neck. That is what the sharks will think, at any rate.

Ohhh, surely this is a joke... after what I just dealt with on another member, I could use a laugh. Please tell me this is Giu??

- CD

Nope, no joke, though I think folks have heard more than I'm saying. I'm trying to say that I bought my first boat and plan on heading to NYC when I've become more comfortable. After that, with all the knowledge that entails, my plan is to go to south america. It probably won't be this boat. I'd love to have something to cross oceans, but that just doesn't fit my mid-life semi-retirement budget.

As for pictures, I'm finishing the title change early this coming week, and will probably have photos just after that. I've only been out on it once, looked at it prior to that, and hope to have the transfer finalized shortly. It is kept at the melbourne yacht club, and they don't like stangers with cameras like me running through their gated marina, or I's snap some photos now

[Cruisingdad]

Instead of listing the things that would make this a bad boat to go cruising with, I think it would be better to list the things (if any) that would make it a good boat. It has sails and it floats... short of that, I cannot think of another, single reason.

I have been on those boats. Many other members have too. Many of us learned from them. There is NOTHING about that boat which would make it even pretend to be a good boat for cruising. If you stay in VERY protected waters, that is fine. I cannot imagine it in a storm in a bay... much less open water.

I am not trying to be doomsday on this, honestly. I have heard it said that we often squash dreams. Thus, if you feel that might be the case, I suggest stopping by the USCG on your way out to discuss your plans on cruising on a J24 and get their reaction about you taking that boat in open water. If you wre simply going to stay in the ICW... maybe... but at some point you have to travel into open water.

There are small boats that are made for cruising. I think SD mentioned a few of them, IIRC. There is a reason they are built the way that they are. Buy the boat that is right for what you intend to do with it. Buy a racer to race. Buy a cruiser to cruise. Like backpacking, if you screw up, other people have to risk their lives to come save you.

The decisions you make on the paths you take burden more than yourself - ESPECIALLY in the ocean.

- CD

[TomScanlan]

Originally Posted by bestfriend

Tom, its just the basic principles of the design of a racing boat vs. a cruiser. First, it is a cored hull, lighter and faster, but not as strong when it comes to extreme weather. The shape of the hull also comes into play, designed to go over the waves, on top of the water, which is faster than going through them. Everything is built for speed. Structurally, they are built to last up to a point, then they will fail, and when they fail, it will be catastrophic. A boat designed for ocean cruising has a failure point too, but it is greater, and when it does fail, it does not destroy and sink the whole boat. The most simple way I can relay it is in ladders, wood vs. aluminum. Both work well. The wood ladder starts to creak and crack and moan and groan when it starts to fail, you have time to repair it. When an aluminum ladder fails, it just crumbles, no warning, complete failure. That is the difference between boats built for racing and offshore cruising.

I hear you, and I wouldn't trust this in a knock down or hull failure. But is everyone claiming that staying near shore (yes, as far as I can swim) down to south america is more of a risk than staying in these local waters? I guess I asking, does something drastic change between here and there in weather or waves?

[Cruisingdad]

Tom, perhaps I read you wrong then. I guess I understood that youwould want to take this boat to S America. I would not take that boat to S Carolina from NYC.

HOWEVER, if you are saying that you bought a nice boat to learn on and one day wish to go up to NYC and one day travel to S America (ON A DIFFERENT BOAT), that is awesome. Congratulations. I absolutely wish you the best.

Hoenstly.

I am not trying to sound like a jerk. We all start somewhere. But it would be like someone that has not conditioned and does not own a backpack, does not know how to hang a bear bag, read a map, etc saying they are going to take the Intnl Divide from Colorado through Canada next week with a fanny pack.

I am not saying it is impossible... but odds are against you making it very far. And when you do not make it, how many lives will be risked coming to look for you?

- CD

[TomScanlan]

Originally Posted by Cruisingdad

Instead of listing the things that would make this a bad boat to go cruising with, I think it would be better to list the things (if any) that would make it a good boat. It has sails and it floats... short of that, I cannot think of another, single reason.

I have been on those boats. Many other members have too. Many of us learned from them. There is NOTHING about that boat which would make it even pretend to be a good boat for cruising. If you stay in VERY protected waters, that is fine. I cannot imagine it in a storm in a bay... much less open water.

I am not trying to be doomsday on this, honestly. I have heard it said that we often squash dreams. Thus, if you feel that might be the case, I suggest stopping by the USCG on your way out to discuss your plans on cruising on a J24 and get their reaction about you taking that boat in open water. If you wre simply going to stay in the ICW... maybe... but at some point you have to travel into open water.

There are small boats that are made for cruising. I think SD mentioned a few of them, IIRC. There is a reason they are built the way that they are. Buy the boat that is right for what you intend to do with it. Buy a racer to race. Buy a cruiser to cruise. Like backpacking, if you screw up, other people have to risk their lives to come save you.

The decisions you make on the paths you take burden more than yourself - ESPECIALLY in the ocean.

- CD

Again, I'm pretty new I'm definitely one to worry about other going into risk for me. Depending on the type of risk I'm usually in the camp, of "he was fool enough, let'm croak." Don't send a rescue up mt. everest for a risk taker. Most folks don't agree, but I'm not saying I'd take a huge risk while I'm still in training wheels.

Is there a clear reason this boat shouldn't be taken to NYC?

[bestfriend]

Tom, if you have bought this boat already, take it out and sail it. Judge for yourself. Go out when it is nice, and not so nice. Thats all I can add to what I have already said.