Will I get comfortable over time? - Page 6 - SailNet Community

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Learning to Sail
 Not a Member? 


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #51  
Old 06-01-2008
KeelHaulin's Avatar
STARBOARD!!
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,662
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 10
KeelHaulin will become famous soon enough KeelHaulin will become famous soon enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMR View Post
Again, its a matter of control and TRUST. When I am with a captain who obviously knows his boat and controls it well, I have less anxiety about heeling, etc. When someone who is obviously NOT relaxed and in control of the boat is in charge (me or another person - my boat or another boat), then my anxiety and tension goes up.
I agree with this; and let me be the first to say that in the instance of our botched sea-trial I immediately decided that we would not be going out for the full daysail. Since I felt we were not sailing with much control in the entrance channel (tacking on close reaches, inattentive crew, no defined skipper); I decided that it was enough after 3 tacks and we motored back to the marina.

In regards to my GF's recent bout with sailing anxiety; it is more relative to her overall level of anxiety before she even sets foot on the boat. The stresses of her every-day life as a school teacher are carrying over and giving rise to other fears (like heeling) when there is no reason to be afraid. The two crossing situations I mentioned are in her mind "near collisions"; when really we were never in any danger of such. I have asked her if she is not confident with me as a skipper and she said that she is more confident when I am at the helm than with anyone else. When we sailed two weeks ago we sailed much closer to other boats and the owner(s) had less concern about the possibility of collision than I would have had. I think it showed her that you can sail in close proximity to other boats without getting into a dangerous situation. Again; if it were just her and me we would never be maneuvering so close to other boats unless it was required for some reason. I think her fear is more associated to the fact that other boats are "unknowns" in sailing ability and ability to control their craft and stay clear of running into us (not us running into them). SF bay is a hectic mess of pleasure craft, ferries, tugs, ships, and races; especially so on the weekends. We do fine in most cases staying clear of all of them; but that day ~2 months ago was a rare day when the foolhearty were in the majority.

The photo in my avatar is of us doublehanding; I know it's difficult to see but we were heeled to the rail touching the water in about 20kts of wind. This was before her recent bout with sailing anxiety.

More pictures of that day are here: Lyons Imaging :: Our Galleries- powered by SmugMug

If you look at the later photos in the series can see that she is at ease with our sailing heel; we spilled then reefed as we passed through the windy spot between Angel Island and Sausalito (lovingly known as Hurricane Gulch on SF Bay). We both felt good about the sail and were enjoying the robust wind and flat water.

Last edited by KeelHaulin; 06-01-2008 at 03:45 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #52  
Old 06-01-2008
MMR's Avatar
MMR MMR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Annapolis, MD
Posts: 355
Thanks: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
MMR is on a distinguished road
Send a message via AIM to MMR
Quote:
In regards to my GF's recent bout with sailing anxiety; it is more relative to her overall level of anxiety before she even sets foot on the boat. The stresses of her every-day life as a school teacher are carrying over and giving rise to other fears (like heeling) when there is no reason to be afraid.
I know how hard it is to shed anxiety from work, etc, and how that impacts one's coping ability. I've noticed since our friend died while sailing, the level of anxiety not only with hubby and me on our boat, but other couples in our sailing group, is pretty high. We all are being VERY conservative in our sailing and boat handling. We'll just have to beat through it and get past it.

I worry about other boats, also, and have struggled to find a way to "respectfully" point out the other oncoming or crossing boat to the captain w/o questioning his competence (or looking like a panicked idiot)

We had a US Coast Guard licensed captain onboard for Ralph's memorial service and he quietly stood behind my hubby as we maneuvered through the 40+ boats that were out for the service. Every once in awhile he'd say quietly, "got that one off the portside?" Hubby'd say, "yep, got it" or "thanks, got it". I resolved then and there to adopt that communication mode - we'll see how it goes!

Its a work in progress and definitely worth the effort!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #53  
Old 06-16-2008
bobmcgov's Avatar
baDumbumbum
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Windy Wyoming
Posts: 1,037
Thanks: 0
Thanked 25 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 8
bobmcgov will become famous soon enough
Lucy, you are approaching this matter with exactly the right mix of reasoned self-dialogue and systematic desensitization that will almost surely see you through. Bravo. What's tougher to analyze than the physical forces are the social forces in play. Some people are intimidated into silence when part of a group or lesson. Others complain loudly, overstating their discomfort to make sure it registers. Some find a leader who takes charge and radiates confidence a soothing or empowering thing; other retreat into passivity and helplessness. THAT'S a nasty dynamic, especially when spousal or filial entanglements are involved.

And what makes it harder, the same people can exhibit radically differing traits on one day versus another. A person normally at ease with heeling or helming a boat may, some Wednesday evening, decide they really don't feel up to it. Others may reason with them, say "It was windier than this Saturday, you were steering us straight into the breakers and laughing like a madwoman!" All the unhappy parson can do is shrug and say, "I just am not enjoying it right now."

Used to happen in rock climbing all the time, where partner dynamics are life-and-death. First rule: Never belittle another person's anxiety. It is real to them, and trying to minimize it will only make them guilty or defensive. Second: Maybe their fears are not groundless -- there's something about the swells that presages danger, or the boat is responding badly, or the whole top of the mountain you are climbing is fixing to fall on you; if you want them to trust your instincts, you ought to trust theirs. Third: Someday, you will be the one having a bad day, or feeling put-upon or shouted-at, or seasick, or overcome with forebodings. Respect the qualms of others because we all have our breaking points.

Finding the right boat, sailing grounds, cruising style, and partner(s) takes time and broad experience, some of it likely unpleasant. Fortunately sailing offers plenty of avenues you can try out. Luck and peace.
__________________
Buccaneer18, Grainnia
SJ21, Diarmuid
Albin Ballad 30, Fionn

Last edited by bobmcgov; 06-16-2008 at 10:03 PM.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #54  
Old 06-19-2008
tjaldur's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 165
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 7
tjaldur is on a distinguished road
Lucy:

Many posts in this thread have given you good advices. I only want to underline that heeling to a large extent is a matter of decision, it is not a happening. Most boats, as has been mentioned earlier, sail best when not heeling. Some boats, those with long overhangs fore and and aft, sails better when heeling because they get a longer waterline when heeling.

Now the degree of heeling can be controlled by proper handling of the sails, like reefing and sometimes twisting the main sail leewards. So I agree with those that say that the main thing is to understand the physical laws governing sailing.

When heeling the keel area gradually becomes smaller and the boat will be more prone to drifting. When sailing flat the keel area is maximum. So even if the boat apparently goes faster through the water when heeling it will drift less and thus sail a shorter distance (against the wind) when sailing flat.

But still I believe the main thing is that you should gradually learn to control the boat, so that the amount of heeling in the end is your decision and not your fate.
__________________
Use your head, ram the wall till it falls.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #55  
Old 06-19-2008
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Lucy54 is on a distinguished road
Thank you once again, everyone, for your wonderful comments, thoughts, and advice. It has all been very much appreciated, and so helpful.
I am happy to report that we are currently in negotiations for a sailboat of our own. I'll report back with more specifics when/if the transaction is complete.

We're very excited, and know that over time, the more often we can go out the easier and better it will become. We are determined to take it slow and not bite off more than we can chew. My husband is especially sensitive to my feelings and I'm sure will do his best to make sure every outing is as pleasant and safe as it can be.
Very much looking forward to this new adventure in our lives!
Thanks again everyone....
Lucy
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #56  
Old 06-19-2008
Skipper
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Mattapoisett, MA
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
rabbit238 is on a distinguished road
One of the first things kids do when they learn to sail with an instructor is to go out and capsize (a small dinghy). You might try sailing on a smaller scale and in a single handed dinghy. If you are comfortable as a swimmer this might be good training.

But in the end sailing is not always a husband and wife activity.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #57  
Old 06-19-2008
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 0
Lucy54 is on a distinguished road
Not always a husband and wife activity? Gosh, I hope that's not the case for us....

I am a fairly decent swimmer, but I'm also in my mid-fifties, so therefore more fearful than a 12 year old.

I'm going at this with a positive point of view, thanks in large part to the help I've received on this forum. Hope that makes this husband and wife endeavor a successful one!
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #58  
Old 06-19-2008
merlin2375's Avatar
*starboard*
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 495
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 8
merlin2375 will become famous soon enough
Can't wait to hear what you and your husband end up buying We'll be expecting pictures of the new boat!
__________________
I sail.
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #59  
Old 06-19-2008
Stillraining's Avatar
Handsome devil
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: LaConner,Washington
Posts: 3,477
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 9
Stillraining is a jewel in the rough Stillraining is a jewel in the rough Stillraining is a jewel in the rough
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucy54 View Post
Not always a husband and wife activity? Gosh, I hope that's not the case for us....

I am a fairly decent swimmer, but I'm also in my mid-fifties, so therefore more fearful than a 12 year old.

I'm going at this with a positive point of view, thanks in large part to the help I've received on this forum. Hope that makes this husband and wife endeavor a successful one!
No Worries...you being here asking thease questions proves that...Good Luck with the purchase....and dont forget us ....We need pictures and your story. ..
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
  #60  
Old 06-19-2008
seeker
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: western canada
Posts: 74
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 9
feetup is on a distinguished road
LUCY;

I admire your desire to see this through, and the open way you have posted here.
My wife (also in her mid 50's) had never sailed when we bough our boat, and with the boat still on the hard (out of the water) the opportunity to go for a day sail with visiting friends on their boat was exciting for her to say the least. The skipper spoke with her as we motored out on a brisk morning explaining that the boat was going to heel, but that this was normal and it would not capsize, and always come back up if it got pushed well over.
I could see her stiffen up as the sails were first trimmed on a close reach and the boat heeled to about 20 deg. or so, but she could see we were all enjoying the day so decided that this must be normal. As time went on the wind began to ease and everything got slower, and I sensed she was a bit disappointed.
A few hours later, with very little wind we were all relaxed and chatting, not really watching the sky when heavy rain suddenly hit, and, as is not uncommon in our area a very sudden gust knocked us right down, water over the ports, Genoa in the water. The boat stayed that way for about 15 or 20 seconds then came head to wind and stood up again, and just as suddenly the wind died off to about 5 knots. Nobody in the water, nobody thrown about. Poor Ruth was white as a sheet with her "I don't think I like this " expression. Our friend, always quick on his feet, immediately said, "See I told you she will always come back up"
Now Ruth knows that a keelboat can fall right on her side, but pop right back up again, and she understands that the boats' natural tendency if knocked down is to come head to wind and stand upright again. She has experienced about the worst that will happen in our sheltered area and knows it's O.K.
I won't say she wants to do it all again for fun, but she now can manage her fear.

Tim J
Reply With Quote Share with Facebook
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Her first time cardiacpaul herSailNet 47 01-20-2008 09:04 AM
Dead Reckoning Calculations Jim Sexton Seamanship Articles 0 04-27-2004 08:00 PM
From the Origin of Time to the Y2K Jim Sexton Seamanship Articles 0 10-14-1999 08:00 PM
Weather Movements and a Flip Chart Bob Rice Seamanship Articles 0 09-20-1999 08:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:55 PM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.