Help!!!!! No Control!!

[mrjd1981]

Hello,

Yet another new sailor here. We have been attending sailing school and we also are taking our Cat-22 out when we have time. So far we have taken her twice and each time I seem to have an issue where the rudder suddenly feels like it has no control at all.

I've been reading about weather helm and broaching, but most of those seem to deal with heavy air. Both days we took our C22 out was very light air, around 5knts.. In fact the second day we sailed with the storm jib just to avoid the feeling of the jibb pulling us away from our tack. The best way I can describe it is if we are sailing close hauled and our intention is to tack to opposite close hauled, we start to tack, tiller is maybe turned maybe 30deg from center.......tack gets close to complete, turn tiller 30deg from center other direction to even out............boat continues to build speed turning regardless of tiller position being hard over.....and the boat will not regain control until i let both sheets out and we are at the opposite tack broad reach. at which point I still have the tiller hard over and it slowly turns back towards the wind.


I contacted our instructor and he says that its just a matter of skill with the catalina's, to not tack to far to the point that it over takes the jibb with the wind........But i feel like there must be another solution besides just timing. Can anyone else provide some input on this?

[tomandchris]

Sounds like a momentum issue to me. With only 5 kts. of wind you are not moving the boat fast enough through the tack to allow the rudder to work efficiently. If your jib backs in the tack you will be pushed sideways more than have steerage. Turn it through the wind a little quicker at these low wind speeds and see if that helps.

[mrjd1981]

That makes sense. If there is no water passing over the rudder then its not doing anything I guess....... And once we hit broad reach it would pick up more speed because that is the fastest p.o.s., right?

I guess i have to get out there and play with it some more and see if thats what it is and not something else. It did do it to me on our first day out with the C22 and the wind was a bit stronger. But when it happened i remember moving pretty slow I think.... It was rather scary to lose control in that position however because we were near a pennsula on our lake and i was afraid of getting to close to the shallow water so I kicked the engine on and got outta there in a hurry.


So I guess I need to make sure to build up as much speed as possible before tacking to ensure the momentum does not fall off....and then get blown sideways.

[CapnBilll]

Another new sailer here. I have the same problem, but I can see boats speed drop when I tack. tomandchris correct, the rudder doesn't work well at slow speeds. Even at low wind speeds sail trim can have a greater effect than rudder. I'm afraid it is a matter of timing to complete tack before you lose too much speed.

When I tack I leave the mainsheet alone, and change sides, (sheets), on the jib. if you take too long to tighten jib sheet you have power on the main imediately, and no power on the jib while changing over. (rudder small, mainsheet big), the rudder will lose that fight unless boat is moving very fast.

[mrjd1981]

So are you saying you tighten the jibb immediately after passing no go zone? and that will keep the main from taking over the rudder's job?

[SailKing1]

When you get ready to tack, look over your shoulder towards the stern and pick a spot to tack too. Make sure you are at max speed and start your tack. Once you have almost reached the tack point, center rudder and adjust sails, they will fill. Then adjust course once making way. When you tack in light winds you are almost coming to a stop.

[JoeDiver]

Are you using a storm jib in only 5 kts of wind? I'd fly a big 150 drifter in that.

The boat needs to be moving at least 1.5 to 2 kts to have decent steerage. Get those sails up and catch some wind!

[mrjd1981]

I just thought, if I was going slow enough during my tack that the rudder may actually have been working.........because with the rudder hard over the boat would swing the opposite way rather quickly.............Maybe I was to the point that the boat was actually moving backwards?

Guess I need back out there again and just tack like crazy till i get it right. Provided there is no other boats/land/turtles/humpbacks etc with in a few hundred feet of my uncontrolled steering.

[mrjd1981]

Originally Posted by JoeDiver

Are you using a storm jib in only 5 kts of wind? I'd fly a big 150 drifter in that.

Few reasons, I have a large light air gen, but we had it up the first day and I thought it was the culprit of the uncontrolled tack.(filling quickly and hard and pushing the bow) Unfortunately one of the hanks broke on that sail that day so I decided to try the smaller sail and see if it fixes everything...........Obviously it didn't =\

But you all are being a great help, and its giving me ideas of what to do next time.

[Tempest]

In light winds like you've described, (besides flying a genoa rather than a storm jib) you do not want your sails to be sheeted in hard ( flat).

You want some sail shape in light air, so ease the sheets a little and perhaps ease the outhaul somewhat. Try sailing a close reach to maximize your speed before heading up and tacking. When you tack in such light air try to keep the rudder movement smooth and gradual.