Jib vs shaking out a reef

[jmjatlanta]

I'll be playing in a bit more wind than what I'm used to this weekend, and would like to pose some questions to those with more experience than I. These winds are in no way dangerous, I would just like to perhaps find the consequences for doing the wrong thing by hearing it from someone else than finding out for myself. You can say I'm at the "Don't know what I don't know" stage.

So I plan to head out under power, and deploy my main double-reefed. None of my jib (85%, roller-furling) out. That way it would be difficult to have too much sail up.

So hypothetically, the main is double-reefed, things are going good and it is time to add a bit more sail. So do I raise my main to the next reefing point, or do I open up the jib?

The Jib seems to me to be too much sail to be deployed at this stage. Is it possible to only roll out partially? I don't know if that is hard on the equipment, or impractical, or useless. Or perhaps it will add to stability and would be a good idea instead of letting out a reef in the main.

Your thoughts?

[JordanH]

Hi Jim,
What kind of boat do you have?



My little Contessa runs along quite well with a double-reefed main and 100% jib in 25knots +/- of wind. I don't like sailing under main alone as it creates a great deal of weather helm; I need some jib/genoa to balance the boat and make it liveable.

With that in mind, you asked: "So do I raise my main to the next reefing point, or do I open up the jib?"
To answer your question explicitly, I would leave the main reefed and open the jib fully. In fact, if you are running downwind, sometimes it's better to just leave the jib out and drop the main.

If the wind is strong enough that you aren't comfortable to handle an 85% jib along with your main, perhaps it would be more prudent to be at port instead of choosing to head out into the weather when the winds are that high.

[tomandchris]

Most boats do not sail at all well under main alone. Especially masthead rigs. So, it depends on your boat, its rig, and the conditions. If your jib has a foam luff it can be rolled in somewhat and still have some shape, but it will not be perfect by any means.

In my case I either have both main and genoa up, or just the genoa. It is a lot easier to sail with just the genny to handle, but the boat will roll a little more and heel a little less.

An example: Yesterday I delivered my boat north for a few days. Forecast was for SSW winds from 15-25kts with higher gusts. I was single handling the boat for 20+ miles so decided to take the easy way and just sail with the genoa alone. Cheating...yes. Easier and safer......very much so. As the waves built to 3-4' coming up the bay the boat rolled a little more than I like, but I did not have to deal with the main in the big gusts. Points of sail mostly downwind and a beam reach for the last 4 miles. Forecast was dead on with winds from 15-29 and speeds from 4-7 kts. Had a great time and did not work hard at it.

If I have a full cockpit of guests or newbies with me I often do the same thing when winds are up. Heeling is not as much a factor in gusts.

Have a good time.

[SHNOOL]

Yes you can partially deploy your jib... in heavy winds, you may want to point to the wind... deploy slowly while sheeting the jib, then lock the jib where your preferred max sheeting point is.

with an 85% on a furler I suppose you are trying to use it as a STORM jib then. hmmmm where have I seen a storm lately?

Yeah... I know hurricanes are the only way we get southerly winds that are steady on our lake too!

[anthemj24]

The answer to your question really depends on your boat. For instance a J24 is perfectly happy under main alone, while as Jordan points out, a Contessa may hate it. As far as sailing with the Jib partially unfurled, most furlers can handle that, however the more sail you have rolled up, the more distorted the shape of the headsail. You could probably roll up 20% and still have a sail that works, however 50%, probably not.

[jmjatlanta]

Thanks for the replies so far.

The boat is a Hunter 29.5, and I'll be in Tampa Bay / Egmont Key.

The predicted winds for this weekend continue to fall as the hurricane predictions move further from the FL coast, but we all know how accurate weather predictions can be.

[nolatom]

I'm also a fan of keeping at least a "handkerchief" of jib working, it really helps you bear off, get/stay out of irons, get the boat accelerated again from a stop, and not have excessive weather helm, all of which are hard to do with only the main. Basically, if you're going to sail above a beam reach, or tack at any time, then I would opt for having at least a little bit of jib up there.

[BarryL]

Hello,

I believe that your boat has a relatively large main and a relatively small headsail. So, with a double reef in the main, I would think that you could use most of your jib in winds up to 25 - 30 kts.

I have done a fair amount of experimenting in winds around 25 kts in both my Newport 28 and O'day 35. Both boats are comparable in that they are typical mid 80's production racer - cruisers with masthead rigs. Anyway, I have sailed with main alone, headsail alone, and combinations. I have found that my boats sailed just fine with a headsail alone. I could not point very high, but boat speed was good and the ride comfortable. If I sail with main only (reefed or not) the speed is slow, pointing is poor and I was unable to tack. With the headsail (140% genoa on roller furling) alone, I can reef it to about about a 100% jib and still get decent performance on a reach, but trying to point just made the boat slow down a lot.

Both boats sailed best with a reef in the main and the headsail reduced to about 100%. The Newport would just fly with that sail configuration. 25 kts was no problem at all, but the ride upwind into a chop would be rough and wet. The O'day is a much bigger and heaver boat, so I can carry more sail, but it has a shoal draft, and if I try to point high she just heels over and makes a lot of leeway.

Don't be afraid to get out there any try. I think your plan of starting with a double reef and no headsail, and then gradually adding additional sail area is a good one. Make sure you have lots of sea room. If you get in trouble just head downwind. The difference in apparent wind will make the downwind run seem like an easy sail. Just don't go too far downwind, because eventually you'll have to get home!

Barry

[WDS123]

It depends,

On boats that sail perfectly well under main alone, I'd increase the mainsail before adding any foresail.


However, many boats really need a bit of foresail to sail well. In this case, keep double reefed main and unfurl a iffy bit of jib. Note, the boat will not sail exactly the same with the ittty bitty jib unfurled .

You will have to do a bit of trial and error.

[jmjatlanta]

Thanks again, guys.

I'm looking forward to experamenting. We have our trip planned out, and have good lengths of time that will be on most points of sail. So if I feel comfortable with adding sail, I'll attempt to do some controlled experaments.