I guessing we should've reefed or ? - Page 2 - SailNet Community

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Go Back   SailNet Community > Skills and Seamanship > Learning to Sail
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  #11  
Old 09-13-2011
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I agree with everything and have one thing to add. Before you leave port, especially with an unfamilar boat (we still do this with Paloma and we've owned her for a couple of decades), is go over the boat from stem to stern and check everything that has to work at sea. If something is broken or isn't functioning - fix it, replace it, or stay home until it is.
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  #12  
Old 09-13-2011
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I'm experiencing a similar situation with my Admiral (whom I love dearly) and have been calm but have often said the wrong thing the wrong time; like whne we heel and she does a sharp intake of breath and I point out that we're only going 7 knots. Somehow my comparison of driving a car to a sailboat doesn't hold up at all. Go figure. She has gotten more used to heeling as I don't panic and she understands the physics involved and the boat hasn't capsized and sunk.
Key is to just keep her sailing, as gently as you can. Let out the main and head up a bit more into the wind. Reef and lower sails. Avoid going out when the weather is too much for the boat and your crew. Whatever it takes to keep your lady in the boat happy.
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  #13  
Old 09-13-2011
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Just reading through this quickly I think the underlying issue is that you both could use some more experience, gained most readily from training and secondly from racing. May I strongly recommend that whichever you chose to do, you spend some time sailing on different boats so that the learning experience isn't polluted by the relationship between you?
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  #14  
Old 09-13-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faster View Post
We started out sailing in an area notorious for high winds on a daily basis, often topping 20 knots on a typical day (thankfully no waves to speak of)
And where would that be?
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  #15  
Old 09-13-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamLein View Post
And where would that be?
Adam.. we lived in and sailed out of Squamish for 23 years... Daily thermal inflow winds frequently in the teens, in summer more often high 20s in the last mile or two at the head of Howe Sound. The topography and relatively short fetch of the higher winds creates a sailor's paradise. Kiteboarding is crazy up there too. SOAR (Squamish Open Annual Regatta) in August is famous for its conditions, and is often a sailmaker's and rigger's delight!!

However the learning curve is very steep there sailtrim-wise because you can learn to deal with high winds in the absence of large seas.

Sad to say, by moving to the city and sailing English Bay, we've traded 'wind and no waves' for 'waves and no wind'......
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Old 09-13-2011
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I took my better half out the other day. The winds were almost to the point of needing to reef. While I was wanting to let her heel over, my better half was pretty nervous. So, no big deal. I reduced sail. I have a fractional rig and a roller furler so it was easier for me to just roll up the jib than to reef.
Panic isn't fun for anyone and it's important to me that everyone is comfortable on my boat.
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Old 09-13-2011
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The J/22 is a difficult boat to manage in heavy air ( not as difficult as a J/24 which are notorious for wipe outs and sinking ) . They aren't particularly stiff boats, being designed with serious hiking in mind.


If heavy air on a J22 - take in the jib and sail under main alone. Try hard to keep the rudder in the water - easing the main such that that luff luffs and using only the leech for power usually provides enough speed and control.


BTW nearly all modern boats sail poorly and slowly when heeled more than 10-15 degrees.
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Old 09-13-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WDSchock View Post
The J/22 is a difficult boat to manage in heavy air ( not as difficult as a J/24 which are notorious for wipe outs and sinking ) . They aren't particularly stiff boats, being designed with serious hiking in mind.


If heavy air on a J22 - take in the jib and sail under main alone. Try hard to keep the rudder in the water - easing the main such that that luff luffs and using only the leech for power usually provides enough speed and control.


BTW nearly all modern boats sail poorly and slowly when heeled more than 10-15 degrees.
It seems you never miss a chance to bring up the fact that it is possible to sink a J24, however I would point out that J24s are hardly alone in this. In fact Santana 20s sink at a prodigious rate as well. Secondly J24s are hardly a bear to sail in heavy wind, in fact you can carry the Genoa from 0 up to 20 knots. If anything, they are substantially underpowered by today's standards. My wife and I doublehand ours frequently including in wind at 30+ knots, and all these years later we have yet to sink one. This J24 bashing is really childish. It is a free country, and you can keep bringing it up, however you can also count on me pointing out how stupid the comment is. If you need me to start pulling up news stories of sinking Santana 20s, I can do that as well.
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The design flaws of the J/24 are well known, no need to be so defensive about your boat. Most sailors in the US have spent a fair amount of time on J/24s and are aware of the design flaws.

It is good that you and your wife enjoy your boat and have enough skill to sail comfortably with the 150 in 20knts.


The OP was asking a question about sailing a J/22 in heavy air. I believe my answer helped him.
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Old 09-14-2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WDSchock View Post
The design flaws of the J/24 are well known, no need to be so defensive about your boat. Most sailors in the US have spent a fair amount of time on J/24s and are aware of the design flaws.

It is good that you and your wife enjoy your boat and have enough skill to sail comfortably with the 150 in 20knts.


The OP was asking a question about sailing a J/22 in heavy air. I believe my answer helped him.
The same could be said about the Santana 20, however you never seem to drag that into a thread.

From the Santana 20 class website

Quote:
A19: The original Santana 20s were built with square cutouts in the V berth and quarter berth. These were seen as good places to store sails and gear. As the boat became more and more of a race boat these holds were not used. And as Santana 20s were raced in more and more breeze -- and broached, took on water, and capsized, things changed again. With no positive flotation, the boat would actually sink pretty fast. At some point in the production series, the squares stopped being cut in the berths and instead round inspection ports were installed. This would allow an air pocket to float the boat in an emergency. This is not something most folks should be too worried about, but if you are concerned about sailing in heavy air, seal those square cutouts, lock the front hatch down, and sail with your vertical companionway hatch in place. With these precautions it would take a tidal wave to sink you.
I am not at all defensive about J24s, but I will be vocal if someone is exaggerating the issues with the boat. It is not difficult to handle in heavy wind, and the sinking issue is solved be simply latching the cockpit lazarettes. If your intent is to be helpful, then you ought to include that simple bit of information on how to avoid sinking.
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