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Boat for Single-Handed

14K views 29 replies 20 participants last post by  Jeff_H 
#1 ·
I'm finally getting around to sailing lessons this year and I'd like to follow that up with a boat purchase. While my wife tries to be a good sport about the whole sailing thing, she's clearly reluctant about it. If I'm to do this, I expect I'll be doing it alone much of the time.

I'd like to get a lot of sailing in this first season, and I'm wondering about a couple choices. I live five minutes from Lake Erie and one hour from a nice 14,000 acre inland lake with no Lake Erie chop (if ya know what I mean).

I'm wondering whether to get a relatively smaller boat (19-23") and spend a lot of Saturdays at the inland lake, or get a larger keel boat (25-30") and go for the gusto on Lake Erie. Even with a 25-footer, the chop can really beat you up on Erie.

My reluctance about Lake Erie mainly has to do with handling a boat that size single-handed and with little experience. I'm particularly concerned about docking a boat that size single-handed. I also wonder if I could develop better sailing skills faster on a smaller boat.

Whaddaya think?

Jonathan
 
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#2 ·
If you're just learning and have the opportunity to sail on a somewhat calm lake, you can't go wrong with a Blue Jay or a Lightning. If you can sail these, you can pretty much step up to anything. They are also large enough to pack some lunch in and enjoy daysailing. However, if you are going on a larger lake with any waves to speak of, these flat-bottomed designs will pound like the dickens and you should look for something with a deeper hull. Learning to sail on smaller boats is always a good idea. Fear of docking single-handed will NEVER go away:)
 
#3 ·
I love lake Erie ! I grew up in Erie. You can find the type of water you wish from smooth as glass to white caps most of the time in the same day almost everyday in july and Aug. It has to do with the time of day. We would water ski in the AM and PM and sail in the daytime in very small boats. The wind, sea,land breeze cycle can be so good to you. Take care for the thunder storms but they leave as fast as they come up most of the time. I would think any boat you pick will work because you can find wind and waves that you like on Lake Erie
 
#4 ·
the Bear's two cents:
Start small, Lightning, Thistle, Comet. Get in a club, take lessons, sailing with buddies helps you learn and is more fun. Little boats are easier to learn in and mistakes are easier to recover from. The leasons you will learn on these small craft apply the same way to big boats. Small boats are cheaper to buy, maintain, and easier to sell when you feel like you're ready to move up. Yes, little boats should Not be on big water unless you have a great deal of experience and the boat is totally set up for the conditions that large lakes (read great) and open waters can have. Little boats can trailer home and stay in the back yard, or can go to another area for a chance to try new waters. Big boats have to stay at the marina. $$$ Little boats have inexpensive parts and gear, big boats have big parts, large lines, big anchors. $$$
I am assuming you are going to try an interest your wife into sailing and quiet afternoons on calm waters are a much better learning experience than a choppy afternoon with 15 degree heel with land further off than she feels comfortable with. IMHO
the Bear
 
#6 ·
The Harbor 20 would be a Great Choice for a New sailor- Easy to Trim and stable with enormous cockpit.

The Harbor 25 might be a bit much for a new sailor, but it is a stiff boat easily slice through Lake Erie short chop.


Both are good light air sailors and have single line reefing
 
#7 ·
I think starting small on the smaller lake is a good move. I learned to sail on a small lake on Cape Cod, Long Pond in a 16' Oday Daysailor. My grandfather taught me when I was 10 yrs old. With a few months i was single handing it and had some pretty fun times. My grandfather always to told me the larger the boat the easier to sail. So far this has been true except docking..... My small daysailor on that lake was a handful at times with large gusts, people water sking, no engine and generally speaking, learning to sail. All the lessons I learned way back when have made sailing my larger 30' sailboat a breeze, especially when the wind pipes up. My keel boat does not respond nearly as quickly as the cb daysailor.
Either way you go, It would be a good idea to have another sailor show you the ropes a bit, the first few times. Experience on the water is alway a good thing. I am sure Lake erie can get quite nasty rather quickly and overcome if the most experienced sailors because of the steep chop.
Most important is to take small steps and have fun sailing and learning. the small boat will even let you get your feet wet on general boat maintenance which is a good thing to know when stepping up to a larger boat.
 
#8 ·
Just my opinion,
If you have good common sense, a little mechanical ability and learn fast, your first boat can be any size. I volunteered to crew on a few boats in our local race club and learned a great deal. I also volunteered to crew for a few cruisers and learned much. This method doesn't cost much (pay for the beer and they will ask you to return) and you can find out what kind of sailing you would like to do. I have a hard time finding crew and am pleased if someone asks. Your first car, house and sometimes wife isn't the one you wished you picked. Sail for free, learn for free and you might end up with the love of your life. (the boat that is) I made the mistake of buying my first boat with friends and that's like sharing your wife.
Good luck and God Bless
 
#9 ·
I did lessons last year on a Colgate 26 and had a great time. I also did a refreasher a few weeks ago on a Colgate again. I decided to get a 27' boat as my first. Some people will say start small and go now and others are comfortable going for the larger boats first. If you don't think you'll be doing long because of the wife, something smaller to have fun with could be a good choice. Like mentioned before, volunteering could be a good place to learn. I met a guy in Texas who lives on a 40' boat but said he doesn't take it out much because he needs more people to help him handle the boat. Find someone who is like that and they could be your best friend teaching you along the way and he (or she) gets a helper. Walk around nearby marinas asking if anyone needs an extra hand. Good or bad, you'll walk away learning something new.
 
#10 ·
I sail single handed on Lake Erie with my 25 foot Tanzer as my wife's not into the sail boat.
It's not uncommon for me to sail 50 miles in a day, sleep on my boat , then run the 50 miles back to Port. Sailing on Lake Erie is using common sense . If you have a storm warning, you know in advance it's going to be uncomfortable so why risk it ?
I've been caught in 8 footers on Lake Erie, and the main thing is not to panic and stay calm.
Sailing the Great Lakes is unlike any ocean as the waves are very close and cap quickly, but as I mentioned , don't panic ! I purposely went out in major winds, to see how far I could push my boat , believe me, I was tired and wore out, but my boat returned in one piece ! I can now appreciate the boat's capability if I ever encountered a serious change of conditions !
I grew up on power boats since I was born, but I've had more fun the past 5 years sailing then I have in my life !
Learn to respect the water , that's 75% of staying safe !
Scott
 
#11 ·
I would lean toward learning on the smaller lake. However, down the road you will find it wonderful to have the boat nearby. It is great to be able to pop down to the boat for an evening onboard. That is the kind of stuff a sail-resistant wife likes (at least mine does). And without the hour drive you can be more selective what weather you go out in. If you trailer a boat to the lake expect at least another hour to get it rigged.

Remember there is a steep learning curve in sailing, AND there is a steep learning curve in boat ownership. Doing both at the same time is more difficult.
 
#12 ·
I'm finally getting around to sailing lessons this year and I'd like to follow that up with a boat purchase. While my wife tries to be a good sport about the whole sailing thing, she's clearly reluctant about it. If I'm to do this, I expect I'll be doing it alone much of the time.
Why not have her take sailing lessons along with you? My wife fell in love with sailing when we took lessons together. Life is much easier when you both like being on the boat. She has to be comfortable on board. Knowing how to sail the boat herself will give her confidence.

Making it a "destination" weekend may help convince her. We did a B&B in Annapolis. Best money I ever spent. ;)
 
#13 ·
Wow, lots of great responses. Thanks for all the helpful input.

Lots of votes for small boat/small lake, and lots more for big boat/big lake. Sounds like you can't go wrong either way. My inclination is to pick up a cheap used small boat and sail it like crazy for a couple seasons. I could probably sell it easily and not lose much when I decide to move up to the big lake boat.

I'm mainly reluctant about buying a bigger boat in the hopes that I can consistently dock it single-handed. A smaller boat is probably a lot more forgiving at the dock. If I get really good at docking a smaller boat smoothly, I'm hoping that stepping up to something line a 27' boat will be an easy transition.

More ideas on a smaller (not too small) daysailer that's easy to find cheap are always welcome. I'm seeing some 22' Tanzers, Catalinas and Hunters that look intriguing. I'm assuming a boat that size would be a lot more manageable both at the dock and under sail than a 27-footer.

Thanks again for all the input; you guys are the coolest.
 
#26 · (Edited by Moderator)
Wow, lots of great responses. Thanks for all the helpful input.
Lots of votes for small boat/small lake, and lots more for big boat/big lake. Sounds like you can't go wrong either way. My inclination is to pick up a cheap used small boat and sail it like crazy for a couple seasons. I could probably sell it easily and not lose much when I decide to move up to the big lake boat.

I'm mainly reluctant about buying a bigger boat in the hopes that I can consistently dock it single-handed. A smaller boat is probably a lot more forgiving at the dock. If I get really good at docking a smaller boat smoothly, I'm hoping that stepping up to something line a 27' boat will be an easy transition.

More ideas on a smaller (not too small) daysailer that's easy to find cheap are always welcome. I'm seeing some 22' Tanzers, Catalinas and Hunters that look intriguing. I'm assuming a boat that size would be a lot more manageable both at the dock and under sail than a 27-footer.QUOTE]

I think you should try the small lake with a small day sailor. Get good at that then move up to the big lake bigger boat. I think you want to get your sailing skills down so they are second nature, then move up.

I single my 34 and the hardest part of all is the docking followed by undocking. If there is little wind, no problem, but add some wind and things get not only difficult, but stressful with the worry of damaging someone elses boat in the process. Trying to dock a big boat in very windy conditions is like driving a car on black ice. You have little stopping (wind blowing bow off) and steering power.
 
#14 ·
Personally, I feel it's easier to dock my 30 then the 23 I had. I can make the boat crawl, or just have enough power to match the current flow and ease the boat to port(still have it more difficult easing to starboard) using the propwash. The little boat.. was a PITA reaching over the transom for the engine, handling the tiller. bobbing all over the place (2000 lbs as opposed to 10,000 lbs) :)

Suggestion; Join a club or rent smaller boats and save money for the larger one. :)
 
#16 ·
More ideas on a smaller (not too small) daysailer that's easy to find cheap are always welcome. I'm seeing some 22' Tanzers, Catalinas and Hunters that look intriguing. I'm assuming a boat that size would be a lot more manageable both at the dock and under sail than a 27-footer.
Depends on if you plan to trailer the boat to the lake or leave it on the water. I had a Catalina 22 that we could launch from most ramps (swing keel). However, it took a good 1.5 hours to set-up b/f sailing. And another hour after sailing. We found that once we got a mooring pin, we sailed more. OTOH, you may find a smaller boat that you could get on the water faster.
 
#17 ·
Denise: Interesting point about being able to manage a larger boat at the dock more easily. For somebody without much experience it seems counterintuitive, but I guess I'm thinking more about actually tethering that longer, heavier boat to the doc. Food for thought.

Barquito: I definitely expect to dock the boat. Life is to short for a couple hours of prep work every time you want to take the boat out.

Thanks for the input.
 
#18 ·
Jazz I really feel that way too. Wheel steering with the controls on the pedestal allow for fwd, rev, and neutral and with lots of practice one can approach a slip or dock with lots more control then an outboard. In the summer I practice every time I take a transient slip at Curtain's Wharf in Burlington NJ The current broadsides the keel as we approach the finger pier. timing speed and reverse are all important! The restaurant there over looks the docks so there is always an audience. I've only sailed on/off a dock a few times but it's not difficult if there aren't other boats around. :) I've been at this about 5 yrs now. had a hunter 23 before my O30. nice boat but too small!
 
#19 ·
Jonathan,

Some other thoughts from someone who is in same boat, pun intended, with lack of spousal enthusiam and who generally sails alone.

I started with a Macgregor 26 four years ago for lake sailing. Found it to be a great little boat for lake sailing. Also have been out in some pretty rough weather by myself. Allows for weekend/overnights. Good trailer sailer - in my opinion most trailer sailers of this size consume too much time for set up and take down if you are thinking of hauling and launching each time you sail. Even with help and moving at a brisk pace you could easily spend 2-3 hours for put in/take down time - way too much time.

Last season I moved up to Catalina 27 - like my Macgregor but was spending a lot more time on the boat and needed more space. Miss the speed and nimbleness of the Mac and abilty to haul it around with my van but enjoy the bigger boat and opportunity to sail in heavier wind. I also single hand this most of the time. Two tips I would share are building time on the water and having the boat set-up for single sailing. I had to redo my running rigging to run lines aft to the cockpit in a manner that made it safe to sail both boats single-handed. I got caught in a storm in my Mac before I had done this and it was not a good expereince as I could not leave the tiller to manage lines.

good luck ....
 
#20 ·
I'd go right for the gusto & get the boat you want. If you go small, before your first season is up you will come down with the infectious disease know as "boatitis".

A smaller boat will be fun at first but if you & your wife plan on spending any real time on it, might as well compare it to camping. Plus before you can upgrade, you'll have a boat you need to sell. Been there & got the t-shirt.
 
#22 ·
Sounds like my tentative plan was to follow in your foot steps going from a small boat up to a bigger one, Denise. I'll be training on a 30' boat, so we'll see how that feels.

I'd hate find myself discontented with my boat purchase after a single season, especially if I ended up taking a beating on the resale. I'll keep an open mind.
 
#23 ·
I'd hate find myself discontented with my boat purchase after a single season, especially if I ended up taking a beating on the resale. I'll keep an open mind.
starting off with something smaller might be a good way to go just to have fun and get started. this will help for learning sail trim and getting a feel for the boat. once you get some experience, you can get a larger boat you'll be more serious about that you wouldn't worry about costs and just take care of the one you really like.
 
#24 ·
I am not going to try to tell you what kind of boat will be the best I just do not want to see you look at Lake Erie like it is a wild beast. A lot can be said for a small lake to learn in and do not leave a safe fun level if you do not feel safe it is not fun . This is true for others with you and how they feel they are not going to have fun. I did say if you go to the lake you will find the weather you like. Look at what other boats are doing on the lake. I was and am still amazed at the huge amount of high $ boats that sit at the dock others that never left the bay. I have crossed the lake more than a few times. The best part of the lake is from 1 to 4 miles out. You will have know one else's wake to bother your boat. You can hold the course you want for as long as you like. Stay in close untill you feel safe then enjoy the lake . To repeat the lake will have the weather you like almost twice each day late in the summer because of a land sea breeze. Study this make notes time date wave height 4 hours apart if you want. You will see how it is almost like a time slot for what you want to do. You live near some of the best water on the planet and the warmest of the great lakes.
 
#25 · (Edited)
i'm still learning so i'm not one to give advice, but for what it's worth:

i sailed for the first few times as crew on a buddy's 28 footer. he races so that's how i learned. i actually bought my boat before i went sailing for the first time. crazy move but i somehow picked the right boat. i got a vandestadt & mcgruer siren 17. so far i have sailed her a few times and i love the boat. love it. we were definitely meant to be together LOL. i have single handed her a few times and it's really all about practice. and being physically able to manage your equipment.

i never set foot on a sunfish, although i don't see anything wrong with learning on a sunfish if that's what is available... and in hindsight if i had bought a sunfish instead of my siren i'd probably be able to go out alone more often because stepping the mast would be easier.

anyway, on my buddy's boat we have gone racing in some very aggressive weather, something i would never want to be out in my smaller boat on. that said, if i planned on taking long boat trips across open water i would want to be in a big full keel boat. however, knowing that i am not yet even close to ready to take that type of trip, i went with the smaller boat and it turns out to be perfect.


good luck

PS as far as picking the larger boat to sail rougher waters, wait until you are ready to sail big water. i would have been calling the coast guard if i was out alone on my boat rather then with other people on my friends larger boat in the weather i described above.
if i had a small lake nearby i'd be learning there on a sunfish and then stepping up when i was ready.
 
#27 ·
Having taught sailing in the Pacific NW, and learned the ropes mostly by osmosis; here's my nickles worth.
The smaller the boat, the less expensive the errors. Make all your really dumb moves in a self bailing skiff like a laser, or topper; they are cheap to purchase, and if well maintained, will sell easily when you want to move up.
Most of my instructing was done on 35 ftrs, as economics force a certain class size 3 or 4 students, hence the need for 4 or 5 bunks for a 5 day cruise and learn. As noted above, not the ideal size to really knock about in, the wear on running rigging and sail fatique with all those slow sloppy tacks, gybes and man overboard manouvers can get expensive when a single sail is commonly costing over $1K. Learn on small boats! Get lots of hours in various conditions, and without an engine, you will quickly learn to read the weather and tide guides after being forced to paddle for a few hours to get in! Also volunteer as crew on as many different boats as you can.
Also re: docking. Rig a midship line, as it can slow your way easily, and gently use your momentum to snug up to the dock, whereas snubbing a bowline will take some paint off, and a stearnline will often be too late.
 
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