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Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Cruising & Liveaboard Forum > Living Aboard
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  #1  
Old 03-04-2003
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slimqs is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

Ok, I have noticed many topics like this with very little info about what the person actually wants so I will try to explain where I am comming from thouroughly. I have only sailed once haven''t learned much but LOVED it. My cousin lives aboard and I plan to do the same within 18 months. I am planning on living aboard with me (23yrs old) wife (26 years old) and mini dachshund. I have been thinking about 26 - 30 feet. Something very inexpensive and easy to handle. I was thinking of starting my voyage in Maine and going south to bahamas and spend a good length of time there. I would like to someday travel to england or hawii also. Would you need a much different type of boat to cross the ocean or would most cruising boats work for that too. I am also wondering how inexpensive it could be to do this. Under 30k for sailboat?? Also what would a cost per month be approx to live aboard without spending much money at all on eating out or at marinas?? Please let me know as much as you can. Thank you.
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Old 03-05-2003
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GordMay is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

Good for you!!!
My wife & I lived did exactly that from ''92 - 2000 - that is lived aboard/cruised Bahamas in winter, Florida in summer.
Our C&C29, "Southbound" was a premium boat, fitted out with everything - and sold (March 2001) for <$25K.
We were very happy aboard, though you must learn to do without "things", which take space to store, and money to purchase.
Life, afloat, can be cheap ... how cheap is up to you and your boat (maintenance & repair); but $500/month in Bahamas is very doable. Much more in Florida, due to dockage.
Best of luck!!!
Gord
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Old 03-10-2003
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c172guy is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

My wife and I are also planning to cruise for a few years. I suggest that you do a little sailing before you move aboard. We have spent several weeks a week at a time and many weekends aboard. The funny thing is that she reacts to living aboard better than I do. She likes to drink tea and read. Give her a good book and she hardly notices sailing even in the keys among reefs. I start to get bored after a few days. I''ll go exploring on shore while she prefers to stay aboard. I like the planning and naviagation she likes a quite place to anchor. I want to go sailing when it''s small craft advisory and whitecaps,she wants to find a deep cove. When we finally get to live aboard it will be interesting to see what happens. We have spent days at anchor in the pouring rain. She was just fine drinking tea and reading,by the end of the weekend I was looking forward to work!!!!!!!!!!!
My basic point is that you would be wise to see how you react to being on a boat before building a life around that lifestyle. The best sailing in my opinion is a small boat and a lot of wind. It is nice to spend the night or week aboard. But it is also great to get a steak dinner and a movie after a daysail.
Tom
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Old 04-18-2003
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Eligabiff is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

Hi!

I''m looking for some of the same information you are. So if you find any good sites or books please let me know. My boyfriend and I are wanting to build a boat and eventually go overseas with this and our dogs. (My dog is a miniature dachshund/italian greyhound mix.)

I am currently learning how to sail but I don''t know much about the laws of the sailing world. Is there somewhere I can find this information, including for international waters? I''m also looking for a site or place where I could find multi hull boat design. We are really interested in building the 31 foot Pahi. We need to see the plan though before we can decide what to make it out of etc.

Good luck with your adventures!

Eligabiff
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Old 04-22-2003
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mlc101 is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

My wife and I are in our 50''s now. When we were in our 20''s, we had a 30'' Offshore-capable sailboat (a fiberglass, S&S design, "Yankee 30"). Raced to Bermuda and did serious coastwise cruising. The boat was capable and ready. Spartan--no refrigeration, motor was always suspect, no TV, no entertainment radio, no air conditioning. Just lots of good sails, VHF, ham radios. Well found.
For whatever reasons, my wife and I never did the long term (greater than 3 weeks) cruise. Career, kids, "obligations" of whatever kind. No way to know what life would have been like had we decided to go.
Now, 3 decades later, the 3 kids are out of the house, but it somehow doesn''t get any easier. Roots and tentacles get deeper and more firmly entrenched as life goes on. There is always a further "reason" to stay--weddings, grandkids, parents--and seems like never a defining event to trigger a departure. The dream is still there, but it does not get easier to implement as time goes on.
Now we have a 43'' sailboat, are equipping it for long term cruising, and hopefully will actually leave the dock someday for that cruise. Or maybe not.

The only advice I can give, is advice given often by others. Go. Go now. Find a good offshore boat you can afford. If you have money for a year, then go for it. You will not regret going. You will only regret staying.
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Old 05-01-2003
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DEBSKIDMORE is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

Hello. My husband and I are newbies to sailing, especially since we live inland. People here say "sailboats, what''s a sailboat?" We have taken numerous ASA classes and have chartered in the BVI area on several occassions. We have decided to retire within the next 1-2 years and live onboard and cruise for the next dozen or so years. We will be buying a 43-47 foot boat, new or almost new. We won''t be paying for slip space, nor mooring balls, nor eating out every night. We are basically quiet people who enjoy watching nature and enjoy our own company (meaning we just don''t need "night Life entertainment"). My husband is pretty handy with minor repairs and I"m sure he will keep the boat in tip top shape as he does our house. With that in mind, what are you live aboards spending a month or year, including maintenance/repairs (the major ones that you have to purchase parts/replacements) on average? Does anyone keep track of their expenditures realistically? I''ve read back over some of the posts and saw $500 as a figure but was looking for more responses and feed back, please. Thanks.
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Old 05-01-2003
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bob-m is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

$500 per month only applies if you a minimalist and have no intention of maintaining your vessel.

The major expenses will be:
- Boat maintenance (15% of it''s cost is a good average)
- Insurance: Health, Life & Boat, if you intend to carry any. Alot of cruisers do not.
- Fuel
- Food
- Dockage
- Land based expenses: storage building, mail service, mobile phone, etc

Most everything else depends on the life style you lead.

My wife and I averaged $2500 - $3000 per month. We were not extravagant, nor were we minimalists. We also carried boat and health insurance.

Good luck on your plans.

Bob-m
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Old 05-01-2003
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rakuqueen1 is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

That included health and boat insurance?
WE are thinking $65,000 a year which will iclude everything. That is one child in college and another starting in three years.
We would like to save some of that, also.
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Old 05-11-2003
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namaste04 is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

Go for it!

As far as the boat search goes, I have a couple of suggestions. One, get a copy of Nigel Calder''s "Cruising Handbook". It was really valuable to us when we were boat shopping to guide us in what to look for in a good cruising boat. ''Course, you will take everything with a grain of salt since some things apply to new, bigger boats, but the basic advise is really valid and useful. It''s also just a really good primer on living aboard/cruising.

Two, you might consider working with a broker. You know how you get a "buyer broker" when you buy a house? You can use a boat broker the same way. They cost YOU nothing, taking their commision out of the sales price (ie seller pays). The MAIN ADVANTAGE to doing this is that you''ll have a professional, knowledgeable person to steer you in the right direction and give you advise about which boats are appropriate for what you ant to do, and which are not. (If you think you might go offshore you really DO NOT WANT a very lightly built coastal cruiser, no matter how spacious a liveaboard it might seem to you...) Now, there''s a good chance you''ll end up buying a "for sale by owner" boat at your price range, but that''s OK. We worked with a broker buying our last boat and it was SO helpful. Here''s how it worked: she brought us listings that she found in her broker network that she thought would suit us. Also, as we found (brokered) boats on line ourselves, we asked her about them (ie "IS a Westsail something we should consider?") If she thought it was, then SHE called the listing broker and got more info, and set up appointments for us to see the boat. Now, when we found For Sale By Owner boats, we did it all on our own, since she would not get any commission out of the sale.

We ended up buying a boat she helped with (from a broker) and she was INVALUABLE in closing the sale. Really, she was a tremendous resource. If you''re in maine, she was Annie Gray at Gray & Gray in Kennebunkport.

What we did initially, after reading Calder''s book as well as books like "Favorable and Unfavorable Characteristics of Offshore Yachts" (the CLASSIC), Handbook of Offshore Cruising, etc, was to make a list of all the characteristics we wanted to find in a boat, your list might be something like:
-standing headroom in main salon,
-galley with oven (or easy to retrofit),
-adequate fuel and water tankage (or easy to add),
-well-built, solid fiberglass hull,
-good hull-to-deck joint throughbolted,
-dodger,
-reasonably new sails,
-roller-furling headsail,
-self-tailing winches,
-atleast two deep reefpoints in mainsail,
-reliable engine (diesel a plus!!!!),
-holding tank for head,
-self-steering windvane and/or autopilot,
-adequate electrical system/batteries for longterm cruising,
-supplemental power: solar/wind?,
-liferaft, EPIRB safety equipment,
-VHF, SSB or Ham radios,
-depth sounder,
-storage space for clothes, food, books, etc.
.....or whatever.....

Then, each boat we looked at, we evaluated in terms of: did it meet our criteria? If not, how much would it coat to upgrade to meet the criteria? Would it still be within our budget? (It''s shocking how much it costs to upgrade a boat for offshore sailing!)

Of course, you need to evaluate what you think you need. Some people a re perfectly happy living aboard/cruising long term with a very spartan, "camping out" type of lifestyle (cooking over a little one-burner alcohol stove, not caring if the engine dies, taking more risks like not having a liferaft aboard, etc.)The other end of the spectrum wants TV, Air Conditioning, brand new electronic instruments, etc. I think the advise of trying it before diving in is good. See if you can borrow a friends smallish boat and take a long weekend cruise. See if you and your wife are comfortable aboard. think about the fact that when you are living aboard, at anchor (marinas are WAY too expensive) you won''t have the shower at home at the end of the weekend. On an under 30-footer you will likely be taking "sun-shower" showers on deck. Stuff like that. Notice the V-berth cushions and when you''re looking at boats think what it''ll be like to sleep on them every night. Will you need to get new cushions if they are too worn out? Stuff like that.

Your question re: types of boats for offshore or coastal. Personally, I would want a pretty offshore-capable boat to go to the Bahamas in, although folks do it in lightly built coastal cruisers all the time. But sailing down there from Maine.....well, it would be better to have a better-built boat. And ESPECIALLY if you are thinking you might want to go to England, Hawaii, etc. you need a REALLY strong boat. By lightly built coastal cruisers I am talking about boats like Hunters, Irwins, later CAtalinas, most Morgans, McGregors and other "trailor-sailors", etc. Some more well-built boats that I think could go offshore if they were thoroughly surveyed, upgraded as needed, and had new rigging, etc: Tartan 30, Tartan 34, Sabre, Bristol, CApe Dory (??maybe), Allied Princess, some older Pearsons.... I''ll think of more later I''m sure.

In your price range you will probably be able to get a better-built boat if you look at older boats. In the 60s and 70s lots of boats were made by tartan, Pearson, et al, with solid glass hulls and better build quality. However, they''ll likely need new rigging, interior cushions, sails, etc. so you need to budget for that.

Depending on the level of "creature comforts" you need and the size you are comfortable with, I think under $30k for an under 30-ft boat capable of going offshore is doable.

As other folks have said, cost per month varies widely. At your age and with an inexpensive boat you might not care about having health/boat insurance, which saves a lot of money. Or you could just get Travellors "Major Medical" insurance which is cheap but helps in a major catasptrophe. Also, the age of your boat and your ability to do your own repairs will affect what you spend. Stuff will break all the time, and if you can''t fix it yourself you''ll spend a lot more.

We are leaving on a long (1-2 yr) cruise soon. Two adults, one child on a 39 foot boat that we are renovating ourselves (which is to say that most everything on it is new, and when stuff breaks we''ve done all the work ourselves so are very familiar with the systems and can fix ourselves). On land we live a cheap lifestyle: we do not eat out very often (maybe a pizza and a couple sandwiches per month), don''t go to bars (wine at home), don''t go to movies, etc. (Basically we work on the boat ALL THE TIME!) So, when we move aboard, we won''t have to drastically reduce our standard of living in order to live cheaply. We WILL carry insurance, but that is not figured into our monthly budget of $1000/month. That''s for food, water, fuel, fees/permits for checking in/out of each place, a few cheap meals ashore, basic boat maintenance, etc. We''ll have a $10k emergency fund in case of a major problem, and to help us when we get back, since we''ll quit our jobs soon and have to start "all over" when we return. We are open to stopping someplace and working for a while to fund the crusing kitty if the opportunity arises. My sense is that if you''re younger (we''re mid-30s) and can bear less comfortable conditions, you can do it on a lot less. Though we are planning to spend a lot less than most of the retired folks out cruising are spending....

Whew!!! That was a long post! I hope that it answered some of your questions. It''s Mothers Day and I have the luxury of a lazy morning in front of the computer, so I got a little carried away!

If you''d like to see our boat and story, here''s our web site:
http://www.sailnamaste.com

Good luck and have fun!
Stacey
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Old 05-12-2003
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smallchange is on a distinguished road
Living aboard? Where to start?

I moved aboard and then learned to sail learned every inch of her. I''m glad I went for it 11 months ago.
I live pretty cheap and infact save money when I work part-time. Having started out with all fresh rigging and bottom paint, I''m still in the low maint. bracket. so, whatever you do, save some dollars for the boat and above all, enjoy yourself.
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