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-   -   MacGregor 21 rebuild (http://www.sailnet.com/forums/macgregor/21643-macgregor-21-rebuild.html)

Jolley Roger 08-17-2006 02:46 PM

MacGregor 21 rebuild
 
I have just embarked on a project to rebuild a mac 21.
I have the boat in 2 halves with everything stripped off.
i have a bunch of known repairs, and i assume some unforseen ones.
If anyone has done something similar i would appreciate their input
Main items
1 Mast step repair - the mast step has been torn off with some damage to the glass and plywood base. I plan to repair this by screwing a piece of 1/4 inch marine ply inside the cabin, beneath the mast (approx 8 to 10 inches square) then putting a layer of glass over the ply inside the cabin and also a layer on the deck above.
This extra thickness will mean i need to shave a little off the wooden mast support post inside the cabin when it is replaced. it looks to me that this post is allowed to extend vertically, since the bolts attaching it to the hull and the cabin ceiling are not screwed in tight???
2 Paint - i planned to paint the hull and the deck whilst the boat is in two halves. Any suggestions on paint? The boat will only be used in fresh water and anti fouling is not permitted. the condition is not too bad but there is some star burst in the gel coat. If I wanted to used regular paint (not intended for glass fibre) what type of primer would be necessary?
3 Joining the two halves together - the boat was originally screwed together. i intend to put some new glass to strengthen up the joint edges and repair some small cracks around the screw holes. I am wondering whether to replace the teak wood bead inside the hull, and glass this in place, or if I should remove this and pop rivit the 2 halves together??
4 Sliding Hatch Cover - the glass fibre hatch is cracked and warped, and I would appreciate input from anyone who may have replaced this with some other form of sliding hatch cover
5 Extra Storage - i plan to open up the plywood in the quarter berths to create some extra storage, anything I should watch out for here???
6 Rigging - whilst i'm at it, does anyone have any improvements to the rigging, i should incorporate??? I appear to have 2 forestays, is this normal? (My mast does not have spreaders).
7 Boom - The boom is a roller reefing type although i cannot see what will stop it unfurling, as the rachet type mechanism seems worn
8 Rudder - the rudder is in good shape although there does not seem to be anything to tether it, should it get knocked out of its hinges.
9 Pulpit and stantions - i will install these but do not have location dimensions as they are off another boat.
10 Cockpit layout - currently there are 2 quarter berths and the vee berth. ther is no space for a simple basin. Any suggestion of where to install?
11 Electrical system - there are stern and nav lights but no mast head light and all the wiring is scrap. Any suggestions of wiring layout and battery position?
12 Porta potty - I have to get one of these, however, the only location i can see for this is in the area between the 2 quarter berths, which would mean it would need to be put in the cockpit for any overnight stays
13 Keel - there is some wear to the keel locking bolt holes (the pivot hole is in great shape) Any repair suggestions. or should i just bore out and fit a larger bolt. This might get too large as the hole is quite worn.

I'll probably think of some more questions as i get further into the project, but would appreciate any help i can get at present!!!!:)

CharlieCobra 08-17-2006 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jolley Roger
I have just embarked on a project to rebuild a mac 21.
I have the boat in 2 halves with everything stripped off.
i have a bunch of known repairs, and i assume some unforseen ones.
If anyone has done something similar i would appreciate their input
Main items
1 Mast step repair - the mast step has been torn off with some damage to the glass and plywood base. I plan to repair this by screwing a piece of 1/4 inch marine ply inside the cabin, beneath the mast (approx 8 to 10 inches square) then putting a layer of glass over the ply inside the cabin and also a layer on the deck above.
This extra thickness will mean i need to shave a little off the wooden mast support post inside the cabin when it is replaced. it looks to me that this post is allowed to extend vertically, since the bolts attaching it to the hull and the cabin ceiling are not screwed in tight???


Mine's ok so I don't know what's under there.

2 Paint - i planned to paint the hull and the deck whilst the boat is in two halves. Any suggestions on paint? The boat will only be used in fresh water and anti fouling is not permitted. the condition is not too bad but there is some star burst in the gel coat. If I wanted to used regular paint (not intended for glass fibre) what type of primer would be necessary?

Epoxy based is best.

3 Joining the two halves together - the boat was originally screwed together. i intend to put some new glass to strengthen up the joint edges and repair some small cracks around the screw holes. I am wondering whether to replace the teak wood bead inside the hull, and glass this in place, or if I should remove this and pop rivit the 2 halves together??

I'd use the original method and make sure to use a sealer/adhesive between the hull and deck.

4 Sliding Hatch Cover - the glass fibre hatch is cracked and warped, and I would appreciate input from anyone who may have replaced this with some other form of sliding hatch cover
5 Extra Storage - i plan to open up the plywood in the quarter berths to create some extra storage, anything I should watch out for here???
6 Rigging - whilst i'm at it, does anyone have any improvements to the rigging, i should incorporate??? I appear to have 2 forestays, is this normal? (My mast does not have spreaders).

Mine is a fractional with swept spreaders. What year is this boat?

7 Boom - The boom is a roller reefing type although i cannot see what will stop it unfurling, as the rachet type mechanism seems worn
8 Rudder - the rudder is in good shape although there does not seem to be anything to tether it, should it get knocked out of its hinges.

No help there, min'es a standard gooseneck boom.

9 Pulpit and stantions - i will install these but do not have location dimensions as they are off another boat.
10 Cockpit layout - currently there are 2 quarter berths and the vee berth. ther is no space for a simple basin. Any suggestion of where to install?

The basin went to starboard just forward of the quarter berth.

11 Electrical system - there are stern and nav lights but no mast head light and all the wiring is scrap. Any suggestions of wiring layout and battery position?

Just abaft the companionway bulkhead is a good spot.

12 Porta potty - I have to get one of these, however, the only location i can see for this is in the area between the 2 quarter berths, which would mean it would need to be put in the cockpit for any overnight stays
13 Keel - there is some wear to the keel locking bolt holes (the pivot hole is in great shape) Any repair suggestions. or should i just bore out and fit a larger bolt. This might get too large as the hole is quite worn.

Mine doesn't have a keel lock.

I'll probably think of some more questions as i get further into the project, but would appreciate any help i can get at present!!!!:)

Mine V-21 is a 1976 model.

Jolley Roger 08-17-2006 03:40 PM

Thanks for the input
The boat is 1966 vintage (i think) I noticed the number 134 etched on the inside of the hull when I took it apart.
What's a fractional?
I don't think there is space to get a battery in where you suggest on this boat. Do you have a pic you could post of the battery location, and the basin?

CharlieCobra 08-17-2006 03:48 PM

I don't have any pics of the boat available yet. A frac rig has four shrouds with aft swept spreaders. Some do away with the backstay but mine still has it. Another feature of a Frac rig is the Jib doesn't run to the masthead but comes up a few feet short.

Blindhog 09-14-2006 10:36 PM

Jolley Roger,
I'm very interested in how your project is going. I just acquired a Venture 21 that my son and I plan to restore over this coming winter - or at least after high school football season. Looks like we'll be at least a few months behind you. A couple questions from a beginner if you don't mind....

1. Was it much trouble to separate the top from the hull, and now that you've done it do you think it is the right way to go? The idea of dealing with the "insides" from the outside is very appealing but I didn't want to get in too far over my head.

2. Where did you find the hull number on your boat? Ours has no HIN on the transom but according to the previous registration is a 1973 model. DNR will be paying a visit to give it a HIN but I would like to know the actual number if I can find it.

Any sage advice would be appreciated.
Thanks!

Jolley Roger 09-15-2006 11:54 AM

As with most boat projects it's coming along but not as fast as i would like!
I separated the topside from the hull, no real problems.
1 Take off the rub rail, in my case most of it had been knocked off, (it was wood).
2 Take out all the self tapping screws, around the joint face
3 take out the bolts in the teak wood board that is inbetween the quarterberths and most probably has the electrical blocks on it.
4 undo the hose clips on the down hole for the keel wire
5 Pull it apart (you will need to get something inbetween the joint faces to break the silicone seal)
6 Bingo!
I'm glad i did pull it apart as i found that the teak bead around the inside of the hull was very dry and brittle, and had cracked around the screw holes. Also the fibre glass had cracked around the screw holes too.
I lifted off the top with my wife myself and 2 teenage kids, so it is not too difficult.
I have since replaced the wooden bead, and i think made it more secure by clamping and screwing it on with an additional layer of glass and resin sandwiched inbetween, which strengthens the cracked screw holes also.
I flipped the topside over and have worked on that, stregthening the areas that had stress cracks, and where i intend to mount stantions and the pulpit, and also repairing the mast step from the inside, (much better that working upside down with resin!)
I flipped the top over with just 3 of us but it would have been better with 4
I've since painted the inside of the topside(??) and have flipped it right ways up to work on the topside.
I jacked the hull off the trailer and used my snow tyres as supports at the back, withe a plank on top, and a couple of step ladders with planks inbetween to support the bow, such that i could remove the trailer.
I have sanded all the crap off the hull and taken off the paint where it was blistered, maimly along the water line. I have also cracked any osmosis blisters i could find in prep for filling the holes with 3 m premium grade filler (the vinyl ester one). I will then paint the hull with interlus 3000 primer in prep for painting.
I am also planning to use any left over 3000 primer for the topside, since there is no osmosis, it's not really so important as the hull, plus the gel coat is pretty well intact, just crazed a little in places.
i hope to get the painting finished within the next couple of weeks then it's mount all the rigging back on and join the 2 pieces together.
i will of course paint the inside of the hull but I don't want to get inside it untill i have it back on the trailer.
The race will be with the weather as i live at over 6000ft and we do sometimes get early snow, however i should be good until mid October.
i will not mount the keel until i have the hull back on the trailer, and depending on timing this may be before or after I join the hull together again. I have purchased Taco V11-3447 rub rail kit to finish off the joint face, this should arrive soon. All in, I expect the cost to be around $1000 for the overhaul. (I have purchased a used replacement keel and some other parts totalling $350 which is included in this). Paint is expensive!
I could not verify the hull number. The documentation says 346 and dates the boat to 68' however I could only find the number 134 etched into the hull and the only way to see this was after i had separated the two halves.
The plate in the transon said only "Sailboats Inc Oakland CA" which i think was a dealer
I took photos of the original registration numbers before i sanded these off.
I have to take the boat down to the local dept of wildlife to title and register it. I can only do this once i have it back together on the trailer. I understand this is not too onerous a proceedure. They want to see the boat, take measurements, and i assume check it out for water worthiness. My trailer was re registered as a special as the original VIN had dissappeared, so the same may happen with the boat. I understand HIN's were only required for boats built after 1973. I may just have to call it a Jolley21 rather than a Mac/Venture! After the work i've put into it i think it will be justified too.

CharlieCobra 09-15-2006 12:38 PM

Nice, post up some pics when you're done.

ranrush 12-07-2006 06:34 AM

I have a 1971 22' MacGregor. My hull number is drilled into one of the beams under the cockpit just above the quarter berth.

Jolley Roger 03-24-2007 01:32 PM

That's where I found my number too.
I'm just about to start on the rigging so if anyone has any suggestions i would appreciate them.
Particularly the size of the turnbuckles
I have a 1/4 inch for the back stay
A combination of one 3/16 and one 7/32 for the shrouds (I'm assuming the 7/32 would be for the mast head shroud - i don't have spreaders on this boat, and the 3/16 for the shorter shroud)
I don't have any rigging for the forestay or the baby stay.
I was planning a quick release device for the forestay, any suggestions on size??? Should this be in combination with a turnbuckle if so what size.
Also what should I use on the baby stay - a regular turnbuckle? if so what size.
I'm assuming I should be using regular pins and rings to connect these turnbuckles to the shrouds and stays, and to the deck fittings (i did consider the spring loaded pins but decided these might pull out unintentionally with unpleasant effect!

jhnblngr 06-14-2008 03:00 AM

1969 v-21 rig
 
some discussion of rigs here, i have to ask advice. my rig is double headstay, and my question is what were issued as sails. the sails i have are conventional fractional length jib and masthead genoa. when i use the jib i just put it on the inside stay. i rig the genoa on the headstay and detache the inside stay. were there cutter sails used with this boat or am i doing what was intended? my spreaders are swept and only 6' down from the top of the mast. so there is only 2' between the stays, as they run parrallel down to the deck. not enough room between to shift the genny thru the 2' slot. thanks.


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