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  Topic Review (Newest First)
3 Days Ago 11:49 AM
jerryrlitton
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

I too have a balanced spade however with a modified full keel. I am looking forward to try it also.
4 Days Ago 10:04 AM
outbound
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Think to some extent sailing polars are wishful thinking not taking into account sea state, loading, need for constant trimming ( wife- sit down already), effect of partially rolled head sails etc.
I'm happy I can sail at 32 degrees without pinching too bad, have no issue in light air but still haven't figured out heaving to. We've tried it in 35-45. Boat heads up in the strong gusts then falls off when the gust goes by and fore reaches. Do 1-2 knots. Can brake helm and turn off AP. but I'm a wimp and still feel the need to have someone at the wheel. Perhaps with more experience will gain confidence.
Have found actually more comfortable to just go to 60-65 degrees after reefing to handkerchiefs and keep sailing. Helm remains very light ( one finger). Have yet to deploy jsd in anger. But have dragged a line on windward stern quarter with good effect downwind.
Think this behavior is common in bulb fin with balance spade boats.
4 Days Ago 11:00 PM
smackdaddy
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
3 of the most important criteria in a boat suitable for extended voyaging for me are:

1) Ability to heave-to easily and comfortably...

2) Ability to make decent progress to weather when necessary, i.e the classic ability "to claw off a lee shore"...

3) The ability to be 'nimble' in light airs, to be able to keep moving thru the light stuff... And, to have the ability to sail out of a jam in light air and close quarters, to deal effectively with the sort of situation smackdaddy found himself in recently, for example...
I've hove to in Dawn Treader, but only in about 15 knots of wind on the bay, with full sail. She was very stable - but we had no sea state to speak of. I'll try again next time we're offshore. I'm a big fan of heaving to.

As for 2 and 3, we faced both of those in the shipping channel. Fortunately when the engine died, we had the SSE wind at our back and could pick it up quickly with the genny. But as you can see by the angle of the ship channel, we had to pinch very tight to that SSE to get back toward the marina to pick up our tow (right at the southerly dog leg).



Our Hunter can point very close to the wind if I have the right amount of sail up. Of course, as everyone knows, it really has a lot to do with the skipper and crew and how awesome they are.
4 Days Ago 07:06 PM
chall03
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
I'm gonna guess my personal notion of what constitutes the mythical "Blue Water Boat" might be quite different from some :-)

3 of the most important criteria in a boat suitable for extended voyaging for me are:

1) Ability to heave-to easily and comfortably...

2) Ability to make decent progress to weather when necessary, i.e the classic ability "to claw off a lee shore"...

3) The ability to be 'nimble' in light airs, to be able to keep moving thru the light stuff... And, to have the ability to sail out of a jam in light air and close quarters, to deal effectively with the sort of situation smackdaddy found himself in recently, for example...

Problem is, most boats only manage to combine 2 of these 3 attributes in one package ;-)

Many modern boats will resist heaving-to with ease or without constant management from the crew, or might be very punishing to both man and machine while sailing to weather... While many more traditional/heavier boats might struggle to keep off a lee shore, or require the assist of the engine to complete a tack in light air...

Choosing a boat is in many respects little different than ordering from a Chinese menu...:-)

'Moderation' in all proportions and design elements would seem to offer the best chance of winding up with a balanced meal...
Thanks Jon, as always good advice, well put.

Our current boat does well at 1, reasonably at 2 and poorly at 3. Like you alluded ticking all 3 boxes is difficult.

Nonetheless we will try to get as close as we can with the next boat.

Meanwhile I am suddenly craving spring rolls and Peking Duck
4 Days Ago 04:07 PM
miatapaul
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by aeventyr60 View Post
I've missed my rowing dingy...and have wanted another for a long time. Since I'm deep up a river in thailand in a shipyard with lots of talented carpenters, and we will miss the tide to get out on the 15th of July, there is some time to "mess about on boats"...could loft two dinghys..... one for Temptation one for Aeventyr...need to be less then 9 feet, row like a MOFO, look good, fast build, stable and have the ability to add a small mainmast with tiller and center board. Any ideas for this?
The D4 is pretty popular and should not take long to put together, stitch and glue and the plans are free. I think I will make one out of cheap luan plywood for fun.
Free boat plans from Bateau


But if you are deep up the creek, make sure you have some extra paddles!
4 Days Ago 10:50 AM
jerryrlitton
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

So true, Len.
4 Days Ago 10:23 AM
Capt Len
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Jerry, It's pretty obvious that "way cool' is in the eye of the beholdee, not the beholder. Sometimes ,rarely, a gaggle of onlookers will honk approval. Worth working for.
5 Days Ago 09:54 AM
UPHILL
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Jelly Bean



Might be a little tough to get it "deep up a river"
5 Days Ago 09:30 AM
aeventyr60
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
Yeah, but that's become an archaic notion, very few sailors "row away" from their boat at anchor these days...

:-)


I've missed my rowing dingy...and have wanted another for a long time. Since I'm deep up a river in thailand in a shipyard with lots of talented carpenters, and we will miss the tide to get out on the 15th of July, there is some time to "mess about on boats"...could loft two dinghys..... one for Temptation one for Aeventyr...need to be less then 9 feet, row like a MOFO, look good, fast build, stable and have the ability to add a small mainmast with tiller and center board. Any ideas for this?
5 Days Ago 08:01 AM
JonEisberg
Re: Production Boats and the Limits

Quote:
Originally Posted by chall03 View Post
I personally agree with all of this.

I was wondering though whether en mass the thinking has ever so subtlety has changed?

Like Jon E has mentioned how many modern sailors practice heaving to?
I'm gonna guess my personal notion of what constitutes the mythical "Blue Water Boat" might be quite different from some :-)

3 of the most important criteria in a boat suitable for extended voyaging for me are:

1) Ability to heave-to easily and comfortably...

2) Ability to make decent progress to weather when necessary, i.e the classic ability "to claw off a lee shore"...

3) The ability to be 'nimble' in light airs, to be able to keep moving thru the light stuff... And, to have the ability to sail out of a jam in light air and close quarters, to deal effectively with the sort of situation smackdaddy found himself in recently, for example...

Problem is, most boats only manage to combine 2 of these 3 attributes in one package ;-)

Many modern boats will resist heaving-to with ease or without constant management from the crew, or might be very punishing to both man and machine while sailing to weather... While many more traditional/heavier boats might struggle to keep off a lee shore, or require the assist of the engine to complete a tack in light air...

Choosing a boat is in many respects little different than ordering from a Chinese menu...:-)

'Moderation' in all proportions and design elements would seem to offer the best chance of winding up with a balanced meal...
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