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Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum > Broker ethics question
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Thread: Broker ethics question Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
03-11-2007 12:40 PM
camaraderie Pigs...in general the too competent or incompetent analogy holds...but in this case he has used the surveyor before and...
The surveyor in question kept me from loosing a great deal of money on a fin keel 30-footer that the broker told me "It's normal for the keel to flex like that. The surveyor pulled up the sole and showed me how the hull itself was flexing due to the loose keel.

Sounds like a TOO competent surveyor to me!
03-11-2007 12:12 AM
pigslo I hate to be the secong guy with the real estate analogy but here goes. I have a regular home buying customer that quit using a particular home inspector when the guy said his sprinkler did not work. It belonged to the neighbor is why. Same guy said the stove would not come on and I just turned the knob and it worked. Back to the boat, the question should be, is he not wanted because he is considered incompetant or TOO competant. It could be either!
pigslo
03-10-2007 09:40 PM
cardiacpaul I don't have to 'work with' anyone except the person writing my check. my only responsiblity is to the seaworthiness of a particular vessel.

That being said, some brokers spit my name, if they mention me at all and some would buy me a beer if I drank. I find the ones that don't like me much are usually the ones that don't know what they are selling, or are a little less than forthcoming if they do have a clue.

Hey, everyone has to earn a living, and I don't begrudge anyone for doing what they have to.

But one of the only things that makes me bark like that womans dawgs, is a person trying to pull the wool over anothers eyes... pisses me right off. I'm not the nicest guy in the marina at that point.

Te little pond I'm on, theres a marina that has a "resident" surveyor..(literally) He gets ALL of that marinas' business and theres not a boat there he doesn't like. And He's not a bad surveyor! That particular brokerage doesn't like "outside people snooping around" (quote from sales manager to a prospective buyer)...ok, no sweat off my neck, my give a sh** factor" is pretty low to begin with

Anyway, some surveyors are their own worst enemy. I've seen some reports that include loose curtain brackets (and they were velcro!).. some will put down every nit-picky mud dauber nest in an effort to fill a page.

In short, if a broker "won't work" with a surveyor, ask the broker and the surveyor as to why... Ask to see some sample reports from the surveyor. Ask at other marinas about the rep of both parties.

If the brokers an ass, find another boat and tell the owners they lost a sale because of it. If the surveyors an anal retentive twit that is more interested in the size of the report than the condition of the boat, find another surveyor.
03-10-2007 06:20 PM
donrr1 Bravo I33, I was, in my own way, trying to turn on the lightbulb of the emotional buyer in my statement. As a sales consultant selling what is referred to as 'the average persons second largest expenditure', namely automobiles, you would fit in to the 1% of people I deal with. In my experience, people in general are emotional buyers. Of course the emotion runs from pure excitement to irrational anxiety, but it's emotion none the less.

Don
03-10-2007 06:05 PM
RickBowman I agree with Cam, if your paying for the survey, you decide who will be the surveyor. It's that simple.
03-10-2007 05:55 PM
I33
Emotion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by donrr1
And then there is the real world of the need to wiegh all of the possible outcomes and then let the emotion of the buyer make the decision.

Don
Huh--not exactly! I've walked away from lots of boats I thought I loved until I got to see the real story. The surveyor in question kept me from loosing a great deal of money on a fin keel 30-footer that the broker told me "It's normal for the keel to flex like that. The surveyor pulled up the sole and showed me how the hull itself was flexing due to the loose keel. When we got it out of the water you could wiggle the keel back and forth 6" with your hands. On the way back to the slip the broker asked if I wanted to take the helm--I told him "No thanks, I'm not interested."
03-10-2007 05:31 PM
donrr1 And then there is the real world of the need to wiegh all of the possible outcomes and then let the emotion of the buyer make the decision.

Don
03-10-2007 02:51 PM
sailingfool
Doctor Doom

Quote:
Originally Posted by I33
I've never run into this before, have any of you?

I made an offer on a boat "subject to satisfactory survey." When I was arranging for the survey and proposed the name of a well-known accredited and thorough surveyor, the broker said "I won't work with him." This immediately raised a flag in my mind that maybe there is something about this boat he is trying to hide.

I believe that since I am paying for the survey the choice of surveyor is MINE.
This situation reminds me of a home insector that I discovered a number of years ago, who was know as Doctor Doom by the home brokers because his inspections killed so many deals. Not too surprisingly none of them wanted to work with him! He was a degreed engineer and meticulous about detail. I used him five times, including two deals that we walked away from the property due to hidden issues he found (.i.e. no occupany permit on file for a 20 year old home) that I doubt the run-of-the-mill inspectors would have found. He saved our asses in each case, I only wish he had been around to survey my last boat purchase.

Bottom line is, absolutely go with your inspector, and push come to shove, the broker is going to have to shut up and deal.
03-10-2007 12:39 PM
Valdare I had an experience with my current boat where I knew the broker (bought two other boats from him) and their was a competent surveyor that they bared from the marina. This surveyor was also commonly employed by an major insurance company, so his "surveyor credentials" were not in question.
There was an offer on my present boat and the potential buyer forced the yard to let this surveyor perform the survey. When all was said and done, the surveyor did his "normal" thing and supposedly found many items that eventually killed the deal. When I made my offer I had a surveyor who was familiar with the boat and also the "other" surveyor. My broker shared with us the outcome of the previous inspection and the issues. My surveyor paid particular attention to them while he completed his survey. His familiarity with the boat model however allowed him to explain to me why the other surveyor was incorrect in his concerns. In the final analysis the boat was pronounced sound, I purchased it and have been happy for the past 5 years.

My surveyor hinted that the surveyor in question killed allot of very good deals through out the area. Some because he thought his job was to find as many things wrong with the boat as to impress his customer and offer areas of renegotiation (which is a half truism). Some areas he would voice concerns saying a "possible major problems" with little or no experience to back up his promise of doom. Further investigation seemed to prove that this surveyor was never happy with a boat over a certain age and under a certain price, therefore he was bared from the marina, and as my broker latter confesses it was to save the customer the cost of a survey that they new no matter the condition of the boat, the buyer would end up with more doubts then were necessary. My broker even offered to pay for a second survey for the potential buyer of my boat to prove the boats worthiness but by then there were so many questions the deal die. Thank goodness.

My advise is, if you trust the broker find out his concerns.. if you don't and you really want the boat your surveying plan on a second survey. therefore if the first does have issues you can confirm them.

Like others have said if you don't trust someone in the deal... probably better to walk away.

I think your broker was at least honest to say out right he would not deal with this surveyor. He could have just made it inconvenient and tried to steer you to another.

Good Luck
03-10-2007 12:07 PM
capttb
Say What?

Cam is right on the money, don't know what would make a broker think he had the option of not "working" with your surveyor.
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