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Go Back   SailNet Community > Boat Builders Row > Catalina > 1984 C30 hull construction
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Thread: 1984 C30 hull construction Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
02-07-2008 09:36 AM
mxmunger catalina yachts did not supply sails for the early boats and perhaps not until the later MK II model. certainly they do today. Most MK I and II owners purchased separate sails.

Sails depend on where you sail. Light air calls for 155 and full mains. medium needs a 135 and heavy areas can max out with 110s and flat mains. A 100 jib and main reefs is useful in vitrually all areas for the gusty spring and fall seasons. and of course there are light , med and heavy chutes to choose from.

BTW suggest you switch to catalina30@ yahoo.com for much more advice on C30.
02-06-2008 09:57 AM
sailhog GBurton,
I believe the C30s originally came with 135% foresails. My C30TR has a 110%, and that's usually enough. If and when I upgrade, I'll go to a 135%. I think a 150% might be a bit much.
01-10-2008 09:51 AM
Maine Sail
Max..

Max,

Unfortunately I did not take any photos of my C-30 keel re-set but I can tell you with 100% certainty there was NO WHERE near 1" of solid glass in my keel stub.

Here are a few pictures of a Pearson 26 keel that snapped off so folks will get and understand why plywood should NOT be in a keel joint.

These pictures are NOT a C-30 but simply to show the construction technique. The fiberglass laminates on my C-30 were "slightly" more robust, but not a lot more, and certainly no where near an an inch! the bottom skin on my C-30 was roughly 3/8 of an inch thick if that...

If you have plywood in your keel stub I say replace it! Remember though what you paid for my advice..



The Boat:

The Layup:

The Sinking Keel Bolts:

The Bilge Side:

The Keel Side:
01-03-2008 01:52 PM
alaska67
i had

i had to remove the plywood in my keel sump to. this was a very cheesy and bogus way to build a boat. look at most late 80's and 90's cats and you don't see the smile like you do on the plywood models. my wood was rotted and my keel bolts werre sinking in also and the fiberglass was to thin.
09-20-2007 09:35 AM
maxmunger I don't mean to be contrary or arguementative. I want good info distributed among the owners.
But the fact is the hull of C30 is over an inch thick of solid glass along the hull bottom and in the bilge areas. The cosmetic "cover" of glass over the wood is 1/4 or less and the amount called for recovering by Catalina is even less. The 4500# keel would never stay attached if there was only 1/4 under the bottom of the wood.

Since we both know the bolts do not stretch, then (IF) your bolts were "sinking", the only result would be that the lead keel was separated from the hull by an equal distance. And the bolt hole(s) had to be open to sea water which of course allowed water into the wood area.
Your keel was severely damaged somehow and the PO or surveyor should have noted this as a condition of sale.

As I said in the first email "Only the worst cases of grounding the keel would result in movement of the bolts causing any leaks.".
09-19-2007 06:41 PM
Maine Sail
Ah Max..

Having seen the inside of the keel stub during the process I think I speak from experience. The bottom layer of glass was barely perhaps 3/8 thick and the bilge side covering the plywood not even a 1/4 inch. Trust me my keel bolts were sinking into the bilge as the plywood compressed..
09-19-2007 11:25 AM
maxmunger And with all due respect I can say as technical editor and owner for 26 years, no C30 has ever lost its keel by falling off. The wood was added back when boats were "overbuilt". yes the wood was a bad idea, but thousands of C30s are still out there with no bilge problems. it all depends on the PO care and maintenance and operation.
The bolts and washers do not sink into the bilge. They don;t even move! Only if the owner keeps tightening down the nuts, against all of our advice, will any depression form.
I see you have not perused the web site as yet. The Catalina "fix" is online there. We are well aware of it. If you look at the Catalina fix, it only calls for a couple layers of glass to reform and smooth the removed bilge area. It is NOT adding back any strength to the keel area.
The keel is 'glued" on at the factory and the keelbolts only align it during curing and movement around the shop. removing a keel usually involves a chain saw to cut the seam! The keel will not flex or bend due to loose keelbolts from the rotting wood.
The smile is caused by "banana-ing" the boat on shore by improper blocking.

Did you know the lead keel is also filled with bricks?
09-18-2007 02:47 PM
Maine Sail
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmunger View Post
Firsy of all, go to www.catalina30.com to learn all about the C30. And Join the association too!
Specifically, no the hull is not cored at all. Most all Catalinas are all solid glass.
Bolts do not stretch!
The "smile" is almost always due to improper blocking while ashore. The keel bottom actually tapers downward from front to rear and has quite a "rake" to it. Blocking must be as far forward as possible and a "nose" stand is desirable. However, the weight of the boat should never be on the stands.
The smile can occur either in front or back and is simply cosmetic. The overlaid glass and filler covering the joint can be broken by excessive flexing of the hull (accident or blocking). Most owners recover the joint when ad if it appears.

Only the worst cases of grounding the keel would result in movement of the bolts causing any leaks.

Max,

With all due respect improper blocking is not always the case. All Catalina 30's through 1987 had plywood laminated into the keel stub to save $$$, time and the expense of making the keel stub a solid block of fiberglass like it should be. Catalina was not the only manufacturer to cut corners like this Pearson and many, many others did this too. The problem is that when the plywood gets wet it begins to flex and separate from the two skins. The keel bolt washers also sink into bilge as the plywood rots giving the false sense that the bolts are stretching. The bolts are not stretching but the keel stub is compressing and giving you the Catalina smile.

I have been on the receiving end of the yard bill to remove the plywood and re-laminate the keel stub per Catalina's instructions. It's not a cheap job and involves removal of the motor on the 30. I will never ever buy a boat with plywood in the keel stub again! This was a very frugal and short sided attempt to save money but cost owners big time. My plywood was so rotted and keel bolts so corroded, from crevice corrosion, my boat yard was surprised I had not lost my keel! I'm sure I may have had I hit something.

Sorry but I have to disagree that the Catalina smile is a non issue because I've seen how thick the outer and inner skins are once the plywood was removed. Call Catalina they will send you the instructions on how to remove the plywood and the lamination schedule for rebuilding the keel stub!!
09-01-2007 09:33 AM
maxmunger The coast of Oregon is pretty rough. best you survey every system and make then right including the lights! Why cut wires when there was a connector?

Are the "plastic" valves really black - Forespar Marelon are great valves - no maintenance.

But the pipes need replace with (Marelon) thru hulls, so you may as well replace the transducer while the boat is out of water.
08-31-2007 02:58 PM
GBurton Hi Max -

Well I made an offer and it was accepted.

Now trying to determine what needs done first.

The PO had a transport company move the boat to its present location - when they took the mast down they cut all the wires. He had not bothered to reconnect them as he only uses the boat in an estuary.

Also - the depth transducer is bad according to the PO. Any way to ohm it out (what should the readings be) Do I have to haul the boat to replace it?

The seacocks are some kind of plastic ball valve - grey in color. It has the original glassed in nipples for through hulls.

The boat will be used off the Oregon coast - 5 - 35 knot conditions, so will need a hank on jib for this.....could you make a recommendation?

Thanks for your help
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