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sundance weekender 20

25K views 57 replies 23 participants last post by  cargo747 
#1 ·
In August, I picked up hull number 39 of the Sundance made by Elmar boat co of Michigan in 1974. I am attaching a link to my website, but I would like to hear from ANYONE who knows somebody or has seen or owns this model of boat. I understand from limited findings on the net that this boat was only in production for about 2 years. I also understand that it has the following specs, but would like those that are marked with a "?" confirmed.
LOA 20
LWL 16
Beam 6' 10"
Disp 1300# ?
Draft 16" to 4'?
Keel weight 275# ?
Designer unknown? http://groups.msn.com/RogerConrad/sundaance20.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=219

 
#2 ·
Sundance 20 new purchase.

As of today, I am purchasing hull number 2 of the sundance 20's. it's a 1972/73 and in immaculate condition. it's got about half the cabin that yours has - I'll ask the previous owner if he's interested in talking to you about what he knows abou the boat.

I hear it's wicked fast, do ya like it?
 
#3 ·
sundance 20

Those look like fast little suckers....just bought a 1983 Hunter 20 so had to comment....mine is slow but roomy enough for me and my two young boys.I wanted a project and I picked it up in decent shape for 200.00....wish my Hunter had the kind of speed you should get from that hull-shape...the Hunter 20 weighs 1700 lbs....400 lb in the keel. I hope you let us know how she sails and anything else about her production.
 
#4 ·
Guys-

Considering that was roger's last post on Sailnet and almost two years old...it is pretty unlikely that he is going to reply any time soon. Welcome to sailnet. I'd highly recommend both of you read the post in my signature. :)
 
#7 ·
update on the sundance 20 weekender

Other than yadusky and another boat I saw boat I saw on the net around the time I was buying mine, I have heard of not others.

In the meantime, I have published an the equivalent of an APB in not only on a variety of forums but in Good Old Boat magazine this past month. I have had no replies, which likely means I have a very rare boat.

At any rate, regarding a previous poster's question querying speed, I have been able to wring 7.7 knots out of her with the rail buried and (at one point) taking green water into the cockpit. Average speed most days is 3.2 kts however.
 
#8 ·
pace

Roger,

a couple of months ago, in a thunderstorm over otherwise pretty smoothe water, we went "zero-freeboard" with a crew of four hiked what I suspect was a bit above that pace (in fact, maybe up around 10-12kts)...and then turned out of it because the wind was too unstable to bet on ourselves any further..

I think with better trimming and stable wind, it could cruise at 10 if there was enough counter balance - we had about 650 lbs windward and didn't feel like we could hold it 2 more seconds. I fault the captain (me) for too much sail, and perhaps some centerboard/rudder anemia, but it was fun while it lasted!

My estimate is not scientific, per se, but we were cruising faster than I could ever sprint on land (about 12 mph).

on a windless day, we can do 2 knots (somehow). On a breezy day, perhaps 5. On a day of wind, well, well see...but I'm more pleasure than adrenaline driven, so it may be a while
 
#10 ·
Speed

Chris, the hull is pretty well shaped - fast bow, great lines at about 10-15 degrees, the size is great for one man sailing, you just need a block set for stepping the mast...I could imagine an 8m or 9m boat would be a lot of fun as well, since anything over 16' is really a lot easier with 2 people anyway...
 
#11 ·
I'm going to pipe in here, as I'm buying a Sundance 23 (1979). I have very little information on her. She's currently trailered close to my house and I'm going to launch her May 2010. She has new sails, rigging, a rebuilt 9.5 hp transom- mounted Evinrude. All in all, pretty darned good shape. Any information I can get would be very much appreciated.

Thanks.
 
#12 ·
sundance 20

Well interesting that suddenly there seems to be more information on the internet regarding Sundance sailboats. We bought ours in the early 90s but could find very little information about her background over the years. Looks like there are more still out there than maybe first thought. We had an absolute ball with our Sundance 20 over the years with a growing family sailing on smaller lakes in Ontario. I love this little sailboat and even though we now mostly boat on the great lakes I will not part with her ... too many great memories and too much fun! Attached is a pic from several years back.... she is still in great shape but needs a good polish and bottom paint.

Hopefully more Sundance owners out there will see these posts and acknowledge. I am not sure how many made but our serial number is ELM000510576, which I believe means hull # 51 made in May 1976. I am sure there are more out there. Great little daysailing boat!
 

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#18 ·
i also have the 20 sundance sailboat pls help

i know little about my sailboat can u help me u r the only person i can find that owns the same 20' sundance

Well interesting that suddenly there seems to be more information on the internet regarding Sundance sailboats. We bought ours in the early 90s but could find very little information about her background over the years. Looks like there are more still out there than maybe first thought. We had an absolute ball with our Sundance 20 over the years with a growing family sailing on smaller lakes in Ontario. I love this little sailboat and even though we now mostly boat on the great lakes I will not part with her ... too many great memories and too much fun! Attached is a pic from several years back.... she is still in great shape but needs a good polish and bottom paint.

Hopefully more Sundance owners out there will see these posts and acknowledge. I am not sure how many made but our serial number is ELM000510576, which I believe means hull # 51 made in May 1976. I am sure there are more out there. Great little daysailing boat!
 
#14 ·
Dwlunn

DWLUNN, thanks for that picture - it looks to be the same style as mine, yellow and all, (although my mast may be a bit beefier).
Though the temperature is hardly above freezing, I've already been solicited by several "friends" to take them out.
It means something that is has that kind of magnetism 35 years later!
 
#16 ·
sundance

Looks like the 23 has much more room inside than the 20. That gives you alot more options for overnights. We only really used our cabin for storage (on the20) even though you could possibly fit couple of people in there - but pretty snug. However the cockpit is large which gives plenty of room for daysailing with small crew. It is definitely a quick hull - when you brought it way over the boat tracked really well and we actually won several club races before we really knew much about sailing...our little boat did all the work. And if we ran a good straight tailwind we would hoist the genny and 3/4 crank up the swing keel and the boat would just fly - we just had to watch out for any sudden wind change to tip us with less ballast. It was like our secret weapon in a race....lots of fun for sure!
 
#17 · (Edited)
Looks like the 23 has much more room inside than the 20.
Yes, but you sure make up for it with your cockpit. Very nice. My cockpit would be comfortable for 2 folks. And, 3 feet isn't that much more room. :) Please post a picture of your boat's interior, when and if you get a chance.

That gives you alot more options for overnights. We only really used our cabin for storage (on the20) even though you could possibly fit couple of people in there - but pretty snug. However the cockpit is large which gives plenty of room for daysailing with small crew.
My main area of interest - cruising every weekend. There's lots of storage on this well-made boat for gear. The berth is very cozy; have to sleep in fetal position, so I plan on sleeping aft on port or starboard cushions (accomplished once before while trailered). I'm going to keep it in the water year round. I'm hoping to get a marina close enough to home, where I can sail after work.

It is definitely a quick hull - when you brought it way over the boat tracked really well and we actually won several club races before we really knew much about sailing...our little boat did all the work. And if we ran a good straight tailwind we would hoist the genny and 3/4 crank up the swing keel and the boat would just fly - we just had to watch out for any sudden wind change to tip us with less ballast. It was like our secret weapon in a race....lots of fun ...
Now, that's exciting to hear. I might race some day, after much learning. Lots of exploring to do this summer.

So, now, if my count is correct, there are four actual Sundance boat owners I/we know about. Started out with just Roger. Please keep in touch folks. I'm gathering data on my boat as fast as I can. I'd appreciate to hear about your boats as well. Roger, I owe you an email in response to yours.

yadusky, glad you piped in. These Sundance boats, although relatively unknown, are nicely done boats.

My Hull # is GFL23026M79H. GFL, no idea, 23 for length, 26 ft mast, Year 1979. H ? Just a guesstimate as to what the number really means.
 
#20 · (Edited)
Wow another Sundance surfaces. If Roger doesn't key in, I'll email him for you.
Looks like I have the biggest boat. El Mar Boat Company was allegedly the manufacturer, but my hull number contradicts this. It's clearly marked Sundance 23 on the side. My hull number indicates Great Lakes Boat Company, but they responded that they knew nothing about these sailboats. Mystery or not, I sure love my little boat. Very well built. Spent first night on her last Saturday, after putting around exploring a bit.

Wish I had more information for you. With my luck, the crane's weight scale was broken, so I couldn't log in a weight. Now that it's in the water, I'll have to lower the centerboard, and dive down with a tape measure to get an idea how far down it goes. Frustrating to not have any specs.

 
#23 ·
Any info on a Sundance 13, anyone?

I just inherited a Sundance 13 sloop...looking on the web for ANY information, but am finding nothing. Does anyone know anything about this boat? The sails are in excellent shape and the boat has been in a garage on a trailer for the past 15 years or so. Hull looks great, but am told there is kind of an issue with a centerboard trunk leak. Also need a spreader re-riveted to the mast.

I'm really surprised by the total lack of information about Sundance sailboats and the manufacturer (now defunct El Mar Boat of Roseville) especially since they are local here in Michigan.
 
#24 ·
thanks for your tolerance, I have been away

Glad to hear that there are getting to be a few Sundance 20's out there. I spend much of my time on the TSSB, trailer sailor bulletin board, but occasionally visit here. I will reply to private e-mail as well if you connect with me at roger dott conrad att mts dott net

I have many pics of my sundance 20 that I would be happy to share with you. I also have some limited source information on this Michigan based company that appears to only have been in business for a few years; not untypical for the mid 80's.
 
#26 · (Edited)
I'm really surprised by the total lack of information about Sundance sailboats and the manufacturer (now defunct El Mar Boat of Roseville) especially since they are local here in Michigan.
Found another Sundance 23 in Michigan through another sailing forum. Guy gave me some specs, has more information, when he gets off the road. Boat's for sale, 1974 model.

Looks like the other 23 owner posted once and disappeared. :(

Well-built little boats. Yes, and the deck space sucks!!!! Lots of sailboat owner friends comment positively on my boat, which makes me feel pretty good about her. :)

Wendy0, got any pics?
 
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