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Go Back   SailNet Community > On Board > Boat Review and Purchase Forum > Refitting Interiors
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Topic Review (Newest First)
08-18-2010 10:31 AM
zboss
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capnblu View Post
It is always hard to believe a refit can cost as much as it has. Then as you pass that point, it is hard to believe it could cost more,... Eventually you may wonder how you ever did everything, as you begin again. Trust me go sailing, it is way more fun than thinking about it while you work.
Awesome... great philosophy.

Right now I am in head check mode. Working out what works for our budget. So, what I am getting from this thread is that I should either (a) buy a super cheap boat that has an excellent hull/deck and then plan on replacing everything as a matter of course, or (b) just spend the majority of the money I was budgeting for a refit and buy a better boat that doesn't require all that refit.

Option a would allow us to customize the boat with equipment that is best for us but option b would allow us to get going sooner.

Our biggest issue is that we are going to have to live on that boat for at least a year at a marina before we head out, so the boat needs to be relatively comfortable for my wife as she needs to dress nicely for work and what not.
08-16-2010 12:18 PM
Capnblu It is always hard to believe a refit can cost as much as it has. Then as you pass that point, it is hard to believe it could cost more,... Eventually you may wonder how you ever did everything, as you begin again. Trust me go sailing, it is way more fun than thinking about it while you work.
08-15-2010 10:12 PM
blt2ski zboss,

Frankly, I spent 22K for my boat, I would bet another 40K easy in cushions, sails, running rigging, interior, complete change of deck gear, head redo, I am sure I am missing some things too!........... And I have a 30'r, I would not hazard a guess what a bigger boat would be!

marty
08-15-2010 08:27 PM
mitiempo Number for refit? There is no answer without knowing the boat, her equipment and condition, and your expectations (as well as your wife's fabric choices ).
You mention not needing running rigging - hardly an issue as it is not expensive to change if necessary. But standing rigging should be changed on an older boat - at least before going offshore. And it is more expensive than running rigging.
As Chris posted above, the prices are high if the work is hired out. Hourly rates of upto $100 and the fact that all jobs are "custom", in other words different from the last and the next. But there are no jobs on a boat with the exception of welding, engine work, and commercial swaging that can not be learned quite easily if you are at all handy with tools and can read. The money you save even after buying the proper tools is substantial. And you know your boat better and are better equipped to repair/replace items in out of the way places where the language is a barrier as well as not knowing which tradesman to trust.
If one were to buy a new boat of the size you are looking for I think you could easily spend 20k for extra equipment.
08-15-2010 06:25 PM
chris_gee I am not sure that you can eliminate the things you mention entirely, though they might be specific known items you avoid. Like teak decks replacement say 25K.
Even with a near new motor it cost me about $4k for a new prop and shaft in part because of difficulty removing the old one and access.
Even a new holding tank worked out very expensive like 3.5K because the thru hulls and seacocks needed replacement, plus a few very expensive bits for the head, plus access was very poor making labour cost high.
New anchor chain and warp say 1000, plus windlass at 1700, then modify anchor well and do base for windlass plus stem fitting plus wiring say another 3000. Thats not adding haul out and hard stand charges.
The boatbuilder's advice to me was whatever you think it will cost multiply it by 3 or was it 4?
Even on a very good boat you could well spend 10-20k without there being any major issues, simply because of age wear and substantial costs of everything and boats being hard to work on so labour time and costs are high.
Specifically redoing the interior. I had a quote to redo the laminate roughly a square metre on a u shaped galley $2000. There is a way of repainting it for much less. With some of these things one can learn to do it oneself but there is an issue say in having the tools because of complications like fiddles etc apart from learning the skills of a variety of trades.
At a guess I would think having the interior done could cost a bomb like 20k+ without headlining and upholstery. You might get it for less with veneer and judicious painting.
It really doesnt work to add say 40% to purchase cost because for a near perfect boat it might be 5% for another 100%. The other approach is what is the top price for such a boat? I looked at one in very good shape asking 90k. Sold 81K. Known cost of redecking 25K. One might add 8k for incidentals. Total cost 114K value then 100K. Real value of boat then is 67-75K but that would be considered a bargain.
My figures are NZ $ and costs but it seems like the US figures would be much the same. In short boats cost heaps and much more than you think. Sure the costs are less if you do as much as possible yourself. That involves learning a lot of skills and many times the amount of time you estimate, like 4 days to remove the varnish from a cabin sole. Just saying.
08-15-2010 04:57 PM
zboss
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitiempo View Post
I would suggest that any boat between 35' and 40' in your price range is going to need more than a new head, laminates, and headliner. Unless it has been replaced recently (not likely at the prices you are thinking of) the rigging will need replacing and probably turnbuckles as well. If the electrical is original ditto. And there are items like soft decks which most boats have somewhere. Your 10k won't go far. Better to look for a boat that is newer and in better shape for more money that needs less.
Again, good information. What IS a good number for refit? If I can budget it, it can be done. This is not a boat I am running out and buying this year or next. So, if the average refit is 20K, 30K or whatever (which I find hard to believe) I need to know.

BTW - this original topic was just about refitting the interior and had specified the boat has having good bones, i.e., not requiring engine replacement, not needing new running rigging, not needing new decks, or any combination thereof.

When buying this boat I can wait as long as necessary to find the right one but when that time comes I don't want to flake out because the wife doesn't like the cushions.
08-15-2010 03:37 PM
mitiempo Headlinings are quite easy to install. I would not put in the automotive type with fabric from one end to the other. Epoxy in strips of plywood from side to side about every 18" and small panels covered with whatever you choose for looks. I am using laminate covered 1/8" ply. The panel seams are covered by hardwood attached with screws. This allows for removal of only a small section for accessing deck hardware or wiring. You can insulate as well with 1/2" closed cell foam easily. Here's a link to an interior redo of a Nicholson 31 from Atom's site and a pic from the same site below.
Atom Voyages | Nicholson 31 Refit
08-15-2010 02:51 PM
TQA
Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post

I am not too concerned about the headliners. While looks are fairly important to me I believe that accessibility will prove more important in an older boat. So, with that said, while I might be handy enough to pull off wood strips of bamboo, I think that my inclination to sand and paint the cabin top white and be done with it.
The interior of the cabin top will be incredibly rough on many boats, mine certainly is. Not impossible to fill and fair but a totally miserable job to do as it will fill the boat with dust even using an extraction system.

Boats with headlinings often run the cables up there too.

However not all boats are rough as the CSYs I looked at had tops that were pretty fair and painted up nicely; one even had 'trompe l'oeil' art work everwhere.
08-15-2010 02:43 PM
puddinlegs
Quote:
Originally Posted by blt2ski View Post
puddinglegs

Yes everything is ran to a clutch vs a cam cleat or equal. I personally found teh spinlocks I am using to be the better/best bang for the buck, and makes sure things stay locked in place. The only real issue I have, is the ones for the main and jib I use the most, seem to be starting to slip, so not sure if it is inside the mechanism, and need to get a recam kit and fix, or go to the next higher lb ability clutch for those high lb/strength needed items.

I mostly sail out of edmonds, will be at shilshoal for the styc fall/winter ragatta in Oct. Boat will probably sail in FWB, I'll be on RC as PRO.

Marty

Sorry everyone for the small hijack...

Yeah, doesn't seem like there's a clutch made that will hold a main or jib halyard well over time. Have this problem on our boat and another boat I sail on regularly. On the other boat, we're thinking about using two clutches in line on the jib halyard. Maybe we'll see you out at the styc fall race day!
08-15-2010 12:09 PM
mitiempo I would suggest that any boat between 35' and 40' in your price range is going to need more than a new head, laminates, and headliner. Unless it has been replaced recently (not likely at the prices you are thinking of) the rigging will need replacing and probably turnbuckles as well. If the electrical is original ditto. And there are items like soft decks which most boats have somewhere. Your 10k won't go far. Better to look for a boat that is newer and in better shape for more money that needs less.
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