SailNet Community banner
  • SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!

Sailboat perishes off Hatteras, USCG rescues crew

31K views 159 replies 54 participants last post by  chef2sail 
#1 ·
Here is a more detailed article about the rescue of Andante II off Hatteras, during the Nor'easter in early March. Two experienced delivery captains ended up calling for a USCG rescue after rebuffed attempts to reach Pamlico Sound through Ocracoke, Hatteras, and Oregon Inlet.

Sailboat knocked down, lost diesel engine power, amidst 30 foot waves and gale conditions. Anyone know what kind of boat this is?

Survivors of March 6 shipwreck say they stand by the choices they made. - Page 3 - baltimoresun.com
 
#12 ·
The boat seemed fine to me and it doesn't sound like it was sinking.

Thirty-eight hours later, a Coast Guard helicopter rescued them off Cape Lookout, N.C., amid pounding rain, 55-knot winds, 30-foot waves and the sensation, Southward said, that the ocean was tossing their 15-ton craft, Andante II, "like a cork in a hot tub."
How many boats would you want to be in those conditions in? How many would still be floating?

Sounds like they abandoned to reduce the risk, which wasn't a bad decision, but the fact the boat was still floating, had her rig, and hadn't capsized speaks highly of her, IMO anyway.
 
#11 ·
That's very confusing: they were experienced deliver skippers and went out of port with a not good forecast with half a tank of fuel, enough to reach destination if the boat could make 6K??????

And then it seems they started to run out of fuel because they could not make that speed motoring???? What about sailing? They don't talk about huge winds 40mph???? The boat is bouncing around because it is not stabilized and tied to a side by small storm sails. Very confusing all that.
 
#14 ·
Waiting to see if jon or Dave know these delivery skippers. S/V Audsicious might as he is from Annapolis.

I dont have their experinece but I question anyones judgement to run Oregon Inlet even on a calm day. The other two Hatteras and Okrakoke are extremely dangerous also and have shifting bouys. I have gone out Okrakoke once in a large power boat and would never attempt it in a sailboat in any weather.

March,,,the season on Noreeasters.....passing around Hatterass.... storm potentiallly in a day.........not sound judgement IMHO.

I am glad they are alive.
 
  • Like
Reactions: smurphny
#28 ·
Wow... just, WOW... Where does one even begin?

Waiting to see if jon or Dave know these delivery skippers.
Nope, not me... I would remember if I had ever seen a yacht delivery captain who weighed 300 pounds...

Actually, one of the most surprising aspect of this sorry saga, is that these fools bypassed the legendary 32 oz. Prime Rib dinner at Coinjock Marina, in favor of the much longer route out around Hatteras...

They were professionals....just doing the job that only professionals can do.
Sorry, but nothing could be further from the truth... Rarely does one see an example of a more profound ignorance and dismissal of the risks of rounding Cape Hatteras in the winter. The fact that they even considered any of those inlets as viable bail-out options conclusively eliminates the possibility that they were anything remotely akin to "experienced East coast delivery captains". Despite the fact they may have possessed some sort of ticket from the Merchant Marine Academy, doesn't make some reporter's description accurate... ANYONE can say they are a 'delivery captain', after all, plenty of folks out there making such a claim...

Also need to add they depended on their IPOD for weather forecast while at sea.
Yeah, yet another example of an "advances in technology (that) only enhance safety, increase abilities and add enjoyment... And mean an increase in "seamanship" ..." (grin)

"The storm went off-******", he said.
Yeah, don't you just hate it when that happens? Who'd a thunk THAT could ever occur? "Hey, although a serious winter storm was drawing a bead on Hatteras before we would make it around Cape Lookout and cack into Morehead, my iPhone told me the 'waves' would be 'bumpy, but manageable'..."

Again, absolutely mind-boggling that a 'professsional mariner' would expect the most powerful winter storm of 2013 to that point, to behave precisely as forecast in the vicinity of Cape Hatteras...

By 10 a.m. they'd pulled within a mile and a half - they could see the beach houses of Hatteras village.

"In our minds, this is almost over," Schoenberger said. "In an hour, we'll be standing on the deck with a cold drink."
One really has to wonder whether these clowns have ever run an East coast inlet... To be off Hatteras Inlet in a developing winter storm, and assume a safe entry is a done deal, or virtually guaranteed, well... Seriously?

The choices were now two: eight hours north with a following sea to Oregon Inlet, or 12 hours into gale-force winds to Morehead City.

They headed north, the waves 14 feet high and breaking at the crests. An hour later came another call: "Andante, we have to tell you that Oregon Inlet has been closed to navigation."

"That hit me like a punch in the throat," Southward said.

Now there was no option but to turn south and push into the Gulf Stream...
Actually, there may have been another option - to have run off to the north, and back towards Cape Henry and the Chesapeake Entrance...

Why did they not just put the sails up and head out to open water instead of risking the CG's lives in a dangerous night rescue. They say they are sailors- then sail......

The conditions do not look that bad, paper says 40 knot wind and 10 foot seas. That is a day sail. Why does the sailor say he was lifted 30 feet but when you see video, you do not see anything rising and falling 30 feet?
Actually, after viewing the degree to which that boat is laid over on her ear by some of the gusts by the windage of the rig and freeboard/pilothouse alone, not sure unfurling any sail in those conditions on that thing would have been a particularly good idea... (grin)

Plus, I am fairly certain their lines were not led back to the cockpit!:rolleyes:
The first IP SP Kroozer I saw at the boat show a few years ago remains the only 'sailboat' I've ever seen with jib sheets led thru rope clutches in the aft cockpit... Not exactly the sort of rig I'd choose to attempt to beat a major winter storm out around Hatteras...

I could go on, and I no doubt will... (grin) Sure would love to hear their rationale for undertaking such a voyage, in such a boat that was ICW-capable, in the face of such weather, via a route offshore that was far longer than going south to Morehead inside on The Ditch... I'm sorry, but placing the lives of CG Rescue Swimmers and helo crews in such danger by the willful excercise of such stupidity, well... if it does not verge on the criminal, it certainly qualifies as amoral, in my book...
 
#15 ·
They were professionals....just doing the job that only professionals can do.

Let's see, the owner is out of a nice boat....half a million dollars. Or, perhaps it's the insurance company, which will increase rates the rest of us have to pay to cover their losses on such situations.

I wonder if the "professionals" will bill the owner for their services? And whether they will pay the Coast Guard for the rescue? And how much will the rescue swimmer get?

Now, I don't know much about blue water sailing, being just an inshore sailor, but from their own description, these professionals didn't seem very professional. Kind of stupid, actually. What was the urgency to sail with the forcast they had, why didn't they go inside down the ICW, how about fuel arrangements, and securing the boat so that things don't fly around?
 
#70 ·
They were professionals....just doing the job that only professionals can do.
There's a lot of delivery skipper bravado these days. Doesn't matter the weather we can do it, we're delivery skippers.

Like its something totally different from being a cruisng skipper? Like the weather abates, or the seas arnt as rough? Or delivery skippers make better decisions?

And why the word "delivery"? does that make you stronger, tougher than the word "passage", or "cruise"?

Its not been a good 12 months for the so called "professionals" what with the Bounty et al...

Mark
 
#17 · (Edited)
Why did they not just put the sails up and head out to open water instead of risking the CG's lives in a dangerous night rescue. They say they are sailors- then sail......


The conditions do not look that bad, paper says 40 knot wind and 10 foot seas. That is a day sail. Why does the sailor say he was lifted 30 feet but when you see video, you do not see anything rising and falling 30 feet?
 
#27 ·
Why did they not just put the sails up and head out to open water instead of risking the CG's lives in a dangerous night rescue. They say they are sailors- then sail......

The conditions do not look that bad, paper says 40 knot wind and 10 foot seas. That is a day sail. Why does the sailor say he was lifted 30 feet but when you see video, you do not see anything rising and falling 30 feet?
I wonder if they really knew much about sailboats. We had a captain for my agency who moved a sailboat we had seized. He was doing fine, motoring it in, until he put it in reverse, and couldn't understand why a 40 HP motor could stop a 20 ton vessel going six knots, in twenty feet. (Hey, it always worked when their was 1000 horsepower).

The concrete dock stopped it, only taking a medium sized chunk out of the bow. :D
 
  • Like
Reactions: jameswilson29
#20 ·
Clowns!

*Decided to sail with a questionable forecast (nor'easter in March!!?!) into the gulf stream and into the graveyard of the Atlantic.

*Motored. Didn't sail, hove to or try to ride out the storm in open water.

*Tried to enter an inlet during a storm. And the inlets mentioned aren't even recommended under calm conditions for a sailboat.

*Could have easily taken a different route with little loss of time. The ICW is right there. Many sailors take it to Beaufort and then pop out to the ocean, even when they could safely transit via the ocean.


The captain is really a graduate of the Merchant Marine academy and an experienced delivery captain? Doesn't sound like it.

I'm not saying that I haven't made mistakes sailing. We all do. But it's this kind of ignorance that often leads to a dangerous Coast Guard rescue and loss of a half million dollar boat.

Scott
Gemini Catamaran Split Decision
 
#21 ·
Clowns!

*Decided to sail with a questionable forecast (nor'easter in March!!?!) into the gulf stream and into the graveyard of the Atlantic.

*Motored. Didn't sail, hove to or try to ride out the storm in open water.

*Tried to enter an inlet during a storm. And the inlets mentioned aren't even recommended under calm conditions for a sailboat.

*Could have easily taken a different route with little loss of time. The ICW is right there. Many sailors take it to Beaufort and then pop out to the ocean, even when they could safely transit via the ocean.

The captain is really a graduate of the Merchant Marine academy and an experienced delivery captain? Doesn't sound like it.

I'm not saying that I haven't made mistakes sailing. We all do. But it's this kind of ignorance that often leads to a dangerous Coast Guard rescue and loss of a half million dollar boat.

Scott
Gemini Catamaran Split Decision
Also need to add they depended on their IPOD for weather forecast while at sea.
 
#23 ·
No need for lines, looks like they were motoring.

Why did they not top off the fuel tanks prior to departure? Looks like they planned to motor most of the time. Would help to not loose fuel suction and they are lucky the rough weather did not churn up the crud in the tanks and clog the fuel filters.
 
#26 ·
From Sun Paper:
"Even my father has said, 'Why go out in those conditions? Why not wait a few days?'" recalled Southward.

"As professionals, our job is to deliver the vessel as quickly and safely as possible," Schoenberger said.

Looks like they are no longer professionals.
 
#30 ·
Jon, don't hold back, tell us what you really think about this. Seriously, to describe these guys as 'professionals' is ludicrous. Just so many bad decisions. They are extremely lucky to be alive.
 
#31 ·
I sat at the docks at Great Bridge on the south side of the lock during this storm and watched the water drop over two feet due to the wind. Even inland, it was nasty. A delivery captain who chooses to go around Hatteras rather than take the ICW to Beaufort is not very bright in the first place, and in the face of that forecast - and that storm was forecast well in advance - needs to be examined for an IQ deficiency.
The article says "4 - 6 foot seas". No way. I took a sound recording of that forecast for my blog - the forecast was for 22 foot plus seas. No idea where they got their forecast from, unless they were mistakenly listening to the Albermarle Sound forecast, or the lower Chesapeake Bay. Even Pamlico sound was forecast 4 - 6 feet, so maybe that was it.
And as noted here, anyone who knows anything about that stretch of coast knows those are not sailboat inlets along there - the smart move was south to the Beaufort inlet or north back to the Chesapeake.
This guy may have some experience, but he seems to lack good sense.
 
#33 ·
I'd be curious to see what references these guys provide, if they advertise their services online or somewhere else. Seems they haven't had much experience with this kind of delivery. Had they even done an offshore delivery before? It seems pretty obvious that they've never sailed and only done power boats, where they may have had the benefit of greater power (and a hull designed to be more stable under power) to muscle their boat through difficult conditions.
 
#34 ·
Is it possible that the owner offered a fixed amount for delivering the boat to FL?
Say an amount like $3 - $5K. Is this kind of arrangement ever used for deliveries or is it almost always a per diem?

Sheer speculation but if it were a lump sum our intrepid yah... delivery captains decide to maximize their earnings per day by trying to do it as fast as possible by going outside straight down the coast instead of winding through the ICW.

With a water draft of 3'8" (< 4') I can't quite fathom what would induce them to have gone outside instead of using the ditch. There must have been some sort of motivation, however misguided.
 
#35 ·
Sheer speculation but if it were a lump sum our intrepid yah... delivery captains decide to maximize their earnings per day by trying to do it as fast as possible by going outside straight down the coast instead of winding through the ICW.

With a water draft of 3'8" (< 4') I can't quite fathom what would induce them to have gone outside instead of using the ditch. There must have been some sort of motivation, however misguided.
I think you answered your own question, the ICW is slow and there isn't much space. If you have a crew and experience, I don't know why you wouldn't go offshore for a couple of days, weather permitting of course.

That said, I think I'd soak up the time aboard a $500k boat as much as I could :D
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top