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Looks like New England ropes is now making a synthetic coated wire lifeline replacement. I was going to use Dyneema to do it, then saw this product in the latest WM mailer. Anyone see this or use it yet? Some if the people said that fuzzy lines was an issue, since this is coated, this shouldn't be an issue.
I used Dynemma last year. I put shroud covers over the front sections of the top lines to eliminate chafe from the jib. I wonder how you spice the coated stuff?
I am interested in using Dynemma for my lifelines, but have some questions. What method did you use to splice the Dynemma? I've heard it doesn't splice securely. What fittings did you use for the gates and to tighten them?
Thanks
I used eye splices with thimbles and lashing lines on one end and eye splices with shackles on the other. I spliced in CS Johnson pelican hooks for gates. You need to make the lines about 6 or 8 inches short, as the line has some give as the strands bury. I followed the NE instructions to do the splices and stitch them.
How do you figure out if it is 6 or 8 inches?
I'm assuming you just have to guess.
Do you just make it plenty short enough and make it up in the lashing end?
David,
Your boat is a little smaller then mine (35) I'd think 6 inches would work bu you are right, you just have a longer lashing if you go shorter. It depends on how much you tension the line when you measure too.
The NER WR2 is just double-braided Dyneema, which seems like an excellent choice for lifelines. You get the strength of Dyneema and additional chafe/sun protection by having the Dyneema cover. The only issue I have with this NER offering is the largest size is 5mm, meaning the core is less than 4mm, which does not meet the OSR requirements for larger boats (I don't recall the cutoff, but somewhere in the 35' range and up is 4mm minimum). If you don't care about OSR or for a smaller boat, then this may be a moot point, but the OSR is a good guide for offshore prep even if you aren't racing.
Lancelin, a French company, makes a 6mm Dyneema double-braid with a 4mm core and the cover has reflective strands. That is the route we are taking.
The NER WR2 is just double-braided Dyneema, which seems like an excellent choice for lifelines. You get the strength of Dyneema and additional chafe/sun protection by having the Dyneema cover. The only issue I have with this NER offering is the largest size is 5mm, meaning the core is less than 4mm, which does not meet the OSR requirements for larger boats (I don't recall the cutoff, but somewhere in the 35' range and up is 4mm minimum). If you don't care about OSR or for a smaller boat, then this may be a moot point, but the OSR is a good guide for offshore prep even if you aren't racing.
Lancelin, a French company, makes a 6mm Dyneema double-braid with a 4mm core and the cover has reflective strands. That is the route we are taking.
Yes, the WR2 is 100% dyneema core and dyneema cover. It can be spliced same as any other core to core (class II) splice. Dyneema will hold a splice just fine but the burry needs to be 72 x the diameter of the rope for it to hold.
I have a sample of it and I must say the white looks very sharp. I do hope people look into it for replacing their life lines. It's not exactly cheap. If you want cheap than the single braid in 1/4" will work great for 5+ years and is easy to install. I've done it on a few boats.
With 1X19 stainless being so effective, with zero problems, and used boaters supplies being awash in the stuff for very cheap, why would you use anything else?
How so? I guess your stainless life line will hold up better if you fall against them while wearing knife covered trousers, but otherwise the strength of both materials is very similar.
But it is prone to corrosion inside fittings that can't be inspected. Everything on the dyneema life line can be inspected, making it easy to check on chafe and UV degradation.
+1, spectra is also much easier to inspect than wire. Wire basically gives very little warning that it will fail. It's looks great, then pop. You can visually see spectra breaking down over the years, hopefully motivating an owner to replace it.
I've been using good old three strand for years with no problems. I sail traditional boats so it looks great, its cheap, easy to splice and lasts forever. My current boat has no lifelines which is another option.
I've lost four freinds due to the lack of adequate lifelines on their boats. They found the boats , but not the sailors. Not having lifelines is not an option , unless one wants to be extremely foolish, and soon dead.
This is a really interesting conversation that started back when SS was starting to be used on boats, nobody believed it was safer than rope, funny how nothing ever changes that much.
I replaced my coated wire with Dyneema a couple of years ago after noticing some cracks in the swaging and some corrosion through the coating. I did not want to worry about corrosion and swages again. They are light, strong, have no meathooks, and are a see-able quantity. There's no guessing about whether swages are good or not. The best solution would probably be eye-spliced bare wire. Brion Toss has a good method of splicing 1 x 19 wire in his book and a demonstration online. Brent is right about wire being tougher. You aren't going to slit it with a sharp edge. That's my main worry about the Dyneema. Once I become proficient at doing wire splices, I may start replacing all my swaged fittings, swageless and swaged, with splices.
As far as length of Dyneema lifelines goes, I would leave 6" and use lashing. That's what I did and it has worked out well. The lashing method allows adjustment for stretch. Dyneema does stretch over time. My 6" is down to about 5" now, maybe a little less. Another plus for Dyneema is being able to easily wrap them up and stow them in a locker. I spliced around 5/16" shackles at the gate ends. The shackles act as stops so that the gates, when secured put tension on the run.
For what it's worth Brion Toss is on record saying he nor his shop will install wire lifelines anymore. They will only use dyneema. The reasoning he gives is that he considers wire dangerous, more expensive, and harder to inspect.
That's really the terrible truth about all swaged fittings--they cannot be visually inspected. There's no real way to know if water has penetrated, if corrosion has started, or for that fact, if the original crimp or installation has some sort of fault. These end terminals ALL give me the willies. My old furler has an integral Sta-Lok swageless base. I don't even like to think about it. Even all the new Suncor terminals I used when replacing the shrouds and stays don't give me the confidence that a sturdy, visible eye splice would. I would like to know what percentage of end terminals fail and for what reasons.
What if you use some of the existing hardware, such as the turnbuckles (in lieu of lashings)? I love the look of the dyneema, but I hate to get rid of all of my hardware.
You can use it if you want. Johnson makes a very nice threaded eye that fits their standard gate hardware, they just want an arm and a leg for it. I probably wouldn't keep the turnbuckles, but the over center gate hooks are still commonly used.
I need to replace my lifelines and am considering the WR2 system...any suggested resources showing the best way to implement them? In particular I am interested in the best way to manage the gate. My current wire system has the typical double rings, I assume to maintain tension when the gate is open...I wonder if this is even necessary; a long line with a thimble forward (for tensioning) and a pelican hook (with rope adaptor) at the other end would be simplest (and cheapest). Any suggestions or best practices would be appreciated!
I'm still here. Yes you can use a thimble as your 'gate tension', just make sure that when you splice the line around the thimble you can still fit it through the stanchion. You'll probably still need to find a way to adjust for constructional stretch.
It'll be a little challenging. You may need to remove a stanchion near the gate to splice the line, then pull on the stanchion and reinstall.
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