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Angry at my surveyor....

11K views 90 replies 45 participants last post by  Minnewaska 
#1 · (Edited)
:mad: I just got my survey, and I'm not happy with my surveyor. It was an insurance survey, and thus the information contained therein may be used against me by insurance lawyers in the event of a claim.

My boat is not in an unsafe or unseaworthy condition, and it even says so much at the beginning of the survey. What I am mad about, is that he has outlined 10 findings that he says need to be corrected to be in compliance with ABYC standards and I don't believe there really is a standard for 2 of them.

What I'm REALLY mad about is that he seems to have totaled up a bunch of small stuff and made the broad, general, nonspecific (and damning statement) that "The vessel is well found but needs work before any cruising is commenced."

Great. Well found, yes, but needs "work" before "any cruising" is commenced??? I'm afraid the insurance company won't read "well found" but will only read the part about "work before any cruising".

There is a very lively thread started by Brian about what cruising means. It doesn't seem like a well defined term. What about "any". Can I not take this boat back to my slip, or anchor overnight 1km from home? What most peeves me is the word "work". Surveyors, I believe are supposed to use precise language. While a couple sentences ago he says that findings 1-10 need to be done to meet abyc standards (that's precise language) "work" needing to be done is completely nebulous.

Now I know what some of you are thinking. "MedSailor's boat is a death-trap and he's blind to the real state of the hulk. He's lucky to be alive and it might sink in dry-dock tomorrow." I'll let y'all decide if that's true. Here are the 10 findings that he says are out of ABYC standard compliance, with comments in brackets by me:

1: Soft wood at the tab in a forward bulkhead. (Is a soft bulkead really an ABYC standard??? Couldn't find it if it is. They also don't provide much strength to my boat.)
2: Household wire nuts found in 3 locations. (2 are decommissioned wires and one was unknown to me)
3: Start of soft wood at the aft end of the bowsprit (been keeping an eye on this. Again, is there an ABYC standard for this?)
4: Fuel gauge wiring is bare wire and needs terminal. (gauge broken, is on the to-do list)
5: Shifting cable starting to rust through. (Just found this at haulout definitely need to replace)
6: No carbon monoxide detector aboard. (Yes, I have one but he didn't find it)
7: Engine exhaust hose single clamped (don't know how I, or my previous surveyor missed something so obvious)
8: Inverter positive wire terminal exposed (news to me. I never use it. Will fix)
9: Flares expired. (wrong. Got new ones, he only found the expired stash)
10: Fuel fill hose at deck is single clamped. (didn't know it needed double)

So tell me if I'm wrong. Is there really an ABYC standard for a soft bulkhead inside the boat or "start of soft wood" on a bowsprit? I'm not arguing that they need to be on my fix-it list, but is there really an ABYC standard that I'm not in compliance with?

Also, what do you think about the "work needs to be done before any cruising is commenced." I think that statement is too general and might prompt the insurance company to freak out.

What do you think?

MedSailor
 
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#32 ·
Yes there are good and bad surveyors just like any other business. Yes we do have standards to adhere to.
Surveyors have to be careful I when I do a per-purchase survey the buyer wants to know what is wrong and that is what he is paying for. If i miss something I will hear about it. Most of the time I save them more than my fee in reduced paying price due to the findings. Then when they buy the boat they call me and say "You wrote up so many things I cannot get insurance!" So what do we do?
For insurance surveys we have to place a value on the boat, If we miss something and the boat sinks guess who the insurance company is going to come after with a team of on staff lawyers looking to get their money back?
Most surveyors do not make enough in a year to pay all the costs we have to keep our professional credentials and pay the rent.
True professionals have to compete with the retired cop who likes boats and thinks it is fun to poke around in other peoples boats and charges half of what the pros charge.
I know we are not the most liked folks around the broker hate us because we find problems the buyer does not like us because we find problems on the boat of their dreams, the seller does not like us because we find flaws in their perfect boat and those getting insurance do not like us because we add extra expense and make them fix things.
But just last week a client paid me and extra 100 because I found a major flaw in the boat he was getting ready to buy, I saved him an easy 15k. And the guy who hired me for an insurance survey thanked me when I pointed out both the from motor mounts were broken and it was getting ready too cause him a very expensive repair. It can be a thankless job but for those of us that consider ourselves professionals we try to do the best we can while dodging law suites.
To the OP I would think a calm phone call to your surveyor would clear up the wording.
For those needing to hire a surveyor I would say when you call do not only ask how much they charge, remember you get what you pay for, ask questions ask about their background and get to know them a bit. A 5 min phone call will tell you a lot.
 
#33 · (Edited)
For what its worth I am a long time broker and love hardened surveyors. Sure I have lost many deals but its not the surveyors fault its the sellers fault. As a broker my number one duty is to find the perfect boat for my client. I personally inspect each boat before my client writes an offer so they don't waste 1500 bucks on a survey process that turns into a dead deal, after a purchase price is agreed on then we bring in a professional. I recently left my company because my standards were too high for the company and I got tired of fighting it. I got tired of haring the term your not a yacht broker your a salesman. As far as I'm concerned I'm a consultant and would never lie or hold anything back just to earn a commission. I have satisfied clients who have safely sailed their boats all over the world. One time got in a huge argument with a client when I would write an offer for him on what was clearly the wrong boat for his proposes, three years later he called me and thanked me fro mexico for finding him the perfect boat. I get paid to do a job just as an honest surveyor does. You sound like an awesome surveyor sailvayu.
 
#34 ·
A side thought... are there cases where a surveyor missed a crucial item, with an incident as a result for which he/she was actually found and held liable?
 
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#35 ·
Make mistakes? sure why not, humans make mistakes all the time. Held liable, sounds like a long shot. DO you know anybody who has gotten 100% on every test they have taken. You have to remember your not buying the space shuttle. Every boat owner needs to understand that boat need constant maintenance, and they need to do their do diligence. They survey is a starting point and gives you a fair assessment and a list to work from, that's all.
 
#36 ·
It is rare but it does happen.
More often a suit is filed and the surveyor wins but the cost to defend is enormous.
Example: surveyor surveys a boat on the Chesapeake, buyer buys the boat takes it to a inland lake and gets fined for gray water discharge. Sues the surveyor for not telling him that gray water is not allowed on the lake he took it to. surveyor wins at a cost of 3k
The only time I had a issue the buyer came back to me 2 years after he bought the boat for a problem that came up long after the survey and after more than a 2000 mile trip without problems. Wanted me to pay as if the survey was a warranty that the boat would never break. Never went to court because no lawyer would take his case as they knew it would get thrown out.
I am sure there are cases where the surveyor was negligent as I have seen some really bad surveys myself. I have seen some surveys that were so inaccurate I wondered if the survey ever really saw the boat. I know one surveyor that will do a insurance survey just from the dock never sets foot on the boat.
I will be interested to hear some other stories.
 
#37 ·
...
I will be interested to hear some other stories.
Me too... I know that the last two insurance surveys were a bit of a joke, as mentioned I mostly dictated it and payed well for that privilige. A pretty easy bit of coin - worked out to about $600/hr and I did the bulk of the 'work'.

Fact is, for most experienced owners they'll know their boat better than any drop-by surveyor will.. it does stick in my craw a bit that the insurance companies insist on these surveys, esp knowing the boat is better than when we bought it, and, perhaps to 'justify' the fee the surveyor has to 'find' something. It can also be frustrating dealing with insurance people that clearly don't understand boats and boating.

Not knocking surveyors in general, of course there are good and bad as in any field, but based on these last two insurance surveys those two were not surveyors I'd seek out for a pre purchase look-see.
 
#38 ·
Faster, sounds to me like you are knocking surveyors in general. In the above post you complain you have to tell the surveyor what is wrong and then complain the surveyor finds things just to justify his fee. So on one hand he is finding things and on the other he is not?

Honestly I often find problems the owner was not aware of you may not know your boat as well as you think. It can help to have a fresh pair of eyes sometimes and that applies to me as well as I have had to hire a surveyor to get my insurance and yes they found things I did not know about. Why? because I have not looked at that hose or in that hole in awhile.

I am guessing you shopped your last 2 insurance surveys on price alone wanting to get the cheapest report you could and of course you got what you paid for. And the time a surveyor spends on the boat is only part of the time spend doing your full report, somebody has to write the report do the comps and research the findings. Believe it or not most of us work hard it this stuff even if you only see a small part of what is done.

But i know I will not change everyones mind
 
#39 ·
Sorry, I didn't put all of that very well.. It's true price was a large factor for the insurance survey, and you're right about my 'getting what I paid for'. In the case of the last "dictated" survey there were no findings beyond a burnt out nav light. The report was a photocopy of the handwritten/hand drawn working document I watched him fill out. A far cry from the pre purchase survey we had when we bought.

Anyhow I did not intend any disrespect to the many competent surveyors, and apologize if it came out that way...
 
#41 ·
Here's an idea:

Fix the problems and quit whining. You surveyor found some problems, including indications of rot ("soft wood" = rot), because THAT WHAT S/HE WAS HIRED TO DO. Now you're whining that "soft wood" isn't part if the ABYC standards. Whether it is or not (and somehow I think that rot in the bowsprit would put your boat out of compliance with just about ANY standards) it needs to be fixed; ditto for rot in a bulkhead.
 
#42 · (Edited)
Ummm.... yeah. I'll take offense to that. :rolleyes:

Here's the point of my whining. His language can be read to say that I can't even go to the fuel dock before fixing these two issues, or not, depending on how you read it.

It's ridiculous IMO to ground the boat because of these findings (the spot in the sprit is not a load bearing location and the bulkhead isn't a structural one) and they are going to take me some time and money to fix, both of which I will have more of at the end of the summer.

I intend to call him and ask for clarification. If he truly thinks that my boat is too dangerous to sail to the fuel dock then I'll quit my "whining" and fix it here and now. I don't think that's really the case though and if I can have a little more leeway to fix it then I will take it.

There are other findings that I didn't post such as peeling paint. His survey can also be read as my needing to repaint my hull before sailing 100 yards. Ridiculous but the words he used can be read that way. I'd be willing to bet that if your insurance company told you your policy was void until you painted your boat you'd be whining too.

MedSailor

PS No surveyor hate here. I'll save that for if things go south after my phone call. ;) I really appreciate the 2 surveyors who have been willing to post to this thread. Your input has been very useful and is appreciated.
 
#43 ·
I don't see how the language could be interpreted to include moving within the harbor. If he had meant "do not operate" or "do not occupy" he would have said that. Certainly cruising means--more than simply implies--open water.
 
#44 ·
So an "independent" survey is done as required by the insurance company you choose

You are not present when they do it even though you know when it is being done
They find "X" number of things in violation or not in correct order
They write a report

You fail to call them after report or furnish them with pictures or correct the items wrong
You find fault with their "independent" language and want them to use "your" language
You have not even discussed the issues
You quibble of ACBY standards vs. obvious in sight inadequacies found at survey

Stop quibbling. Fix the issues. Send them pictures. Talk to them. Don't expect them to give up their independence by changing their language to language you want them to use
 
#45 ·
I knew there would be a bunch of "stop whining" posts. I'm just surprised they took this long.

I've tried to be clear in all my posts that I'm not mad about what he found, or what he missed. I'm mad that he's incorrectly holding me to a standard. I'm mad that his language might make me loose a good part of my sailing season or my insurance carrier. Not because (I believe) he truly thinks that the boat is unsafe but because of his sloppy choice of words. I work in a field where we get sued all the time. I know the dangers of imprecise language.

My not being present had nothing to do with his use of language on the report.

I will call him and I'll let y'all know what he says.

Medsailor
 
#50 ·
The written word has always posed communication issues because of the interpretation of the author and that of the reader. This may explain the continuous ongoings in the court of law.

If I was in the same situation as the OP, I would have a conversation with the surveyor and negotiate a rewrite whereby language can still make the meanings, but with the allowances that may not provision limited restrictions on the boat, or, have a second survey done by another person and compare the two reports to learn and negotiate once again.
 
#51 ·
But by him using imprecise wording, doesn't that give the insurance company more leeway in denying claims?

Like the OP says, what if he goes to the fuel dock and something out of his control happens, couldn't the insurer say "well you weren't supposed to leave, it says so right here"
and he doesn't get paid even though he has been paying the premiums?
 
#52 ·
It was NOT imprecise wording.

Websters says:
1: to sail about touching at a series of ports

Dictionary.com:
1: to sail about on a pleasure trip.

Nothing within a harbor could be construed to constitute cruising. IF he had meant "do not operate" he would have said that.

And of course, some of the violation are bad sitting at the dock.
 
#53 ·
Heres my problem with the surveyors I've had to deal with working at the boat yard, either they need to bring their seeing eye dog with them or stop taking bribes from the seller or brocker to not list the broblems the boats have. Not just because it makes me look like the bad guy when I need to tell the new owner that its going to need more repairs then was listed meaning more money and time in the yard but it..... ok it is because it makes me look like the bad guy because I will not ignore a problem I see, and Being a grunt I'm not looking for things to make more money, these are things I would want fixed on my boat, not just things like outdated flares that may or may not be needed but and mechanical issues that will come up shortly after the boats in the water.
I think a buyer should walk thru with the surveyor, and that the surveyor should explain the what and whys. When we had a survey done on the boat I am living aboard I was so far up the surveys a$$ I knew what he had for lunch. I even pointed out what I thought were problems. A surveyor needs to educate a buyer/owner when they can,that and in the case of Medsailor ask if there are things like new flares and co2 detectors aboard. It took us 6 months after moving aboard to find some of the stuff the PO's stashed.
 
#54 ·
MarioG, I did not have any similar kind of experience with surveyors. As I said in my earlier post, I just bought a boat and I had a pre-purchase survey performed. He made a special point of doing an inspection I specifically asked for (potential rot in the forward salon bulkhead) and reported the results to me. He also found a problem (kind of a big deal, the rudder post was deeply corroded and I had to have the rudder rebuilt) that the seller would have rathered he not find. Because I made the seller renegotiate the sales price over the rudder work. I got several recommendations for surveyors before I chose one (the boat was 700 miles from my home so I was relying on his professionalism as I did not know any surveyor in that area). I researched them on line before I chose one. I drove 700 miles to be there for the survey.
I got my monies worth. And I got my boat. And I'm using the survey to get my insurance. I saw no sign of corruption in the surveyors work or attitude. Competence and professionalism, that I did see.
A local surveyor is going to get to know the boatyards in his area, it's where he works. He is going to get to know the marina owners and dockmasters. And the local boat brokers. It does not make him corrupt or on-the-take.
 
#55 ·
I'll tell you what my broker told me about insurance surveys. He told me the insurance company may not even look at the survey. It goes in your file, and they write the policy. If/when you file a claim, then the survey gets read very closely, and coverage is denied for any issue whose cause is related to an uncorrected survey problem.

So if you are truly confident that the issues in the survey would not cause an insurance claim, you are free to ignore them. You still have coverage for anything unrelated to survey issues.

So it's entirely up to you. Nobody is stopping you from sailing now. You just won't be covered if those trivial issues cause an insurance claim.

Take my advice with a grain of salt, because free advice is worth what you paid for it, and sometimes less. :laugher
 
#56 ·
I was present during my post purchase survey. I think he did a relatively decent job.
Here's the problems I have/had:
I pointed out that I thought the galvanic isolator on my Irwin didn't look properly installed to my surveyor.
He didn't even seriously look at at it (I had to drop the panel cover to show it to him), but he commented in his report that it needed to be properly installed. Mind, he didn't KNOW it wasn't, just said it needed to be.
Now if my maxprop rots off I'll have to prove I had a qualified marine tech come in and install it.

He didn't find the air horn at the helm in the cup holder, or the flare kit (the big Orion orange one) so he dinged me on not having required safety gear.

But what really pissed me off is the 'moisture found' comments. No specific level, just moisture. He told me in a side bar conversation that moisture meters don't get real specific - they just beep more if it's a lot, less if it's a little and it depends on calibration.

He also hit me on two through hulls (engine water and sink drain) having "PVC" fittings. They are original to the boat - i.e. 26 years old. Of course they don't meet ABYC standards, there weren't any then.
 
#57 ·
I agree with BubbleheadMD, talk to your surveyor. Get him to be more specific not only about the condition but the the specific ABYC standard he is applying. If he uses the standards, he HAS to be able to specify. Repair the other items you can. There is a form space to rebut any survey claims in your insurance paperwork.

If you look for an engine survey, avoid Chris Oliver in MD at all costs.
 
#58 ·
(WAS) Angry at my surveyor....

Talked with my surveyor today. I thanked him for finding things that I didn't know about and I asked him about the 2 soft wood findings. I told him I couldn't find the ABYC standards for them and I would appreciate being pointed to them so I would know what standard to correct them to.

He avoided the ABYC question a few times and told me that they were both safety issues. I gave up trying to get him to admit that there wasn't really a standard. I asked if he thought the bulkhead was structural on a Formosa with it's thick glass hull and he said he did. I asked if he thought the "start of soft wood" at a non-load bearing spot on the spirit was a safety hazard and he did.

I asked him if he thought they were an imminent safety hazard or a brewing one. He said that I'd be find to sail around the San Juan islands but if I went offshore he thinks they might be a problem. (I'd have to agree with that!)

I then pointed him to the last line in his comments where he says "work needs to be done before any cruising." As soon as I read it to him he said "It's not specific enough is it?" I asked him to make it more specific. If he thinks these issues need correcting before I put the boat back in the water, please say so. If he thinks I can sail around the San Juans for a few months, please define the inshore/offshore issues. We then talked for a few minutes about which issues were real safety ones and which weren't.

He told me he'd correct the survey and get it to me in a couple hours. (pretty good service) I was hoping that he'd outline which issues in particular he wanted done now and which he wanted done later. He didn't do that. What he did do was add 2 words to the sentence about cruising. It now reads "...work needs to be done before cruising off shore."

I'm content enough with the resolution we achieved. The language is more precise where it needs to be and can't easily be read that I need to be pinned to the dock. I'm still miffed that he is saying that 2 items are out of ABYC compliance when they're not but only as a matter of principle. I wouldn't be mad if he said they represent a safety hazard in his opinion, but in principle I take issue with invoking a standard when it doesn't really apply. I'll let that go though as I don't think It'll affect the insurance issues.

So I'll submit the survey and see what happens. Hopefully I'll be able to take the bowsprit off at the end of the season and really "spruce" ;) it up in the shop at home as a fall/winter project.

MedSailor
 
#59 ·
Re: (WAS) Angry at my surveyor....

Talked with my surveyor today. I thanked him for finding things that I didn't know about and I asked him about the 2 soft wood findings. I told him I couldn't find the ABYC standards for them and I would appreciate being pointed to them so I would know what standard to correct them to.

He avoided the ABYC question a few times and told me that they were both safety issues. I gave up trying to get him to admit that there wasn't really a standard. I asked if he thought the bulkhead was structural on a Formosa with it's thick glass hull and he said he did. I asked if he thought the "start of soft wood" at a non-load bearing spot on the spirit was a safety hazard and he did.

I asked him if he thought they were an imminent safety hazard or a brewing one. He said that I'd be find to sail around the San Juan islands but if I went offshore he thinks they might be a problem. (I'd have to agree with that!)

I then pointed him to the last line in his comments where he says "work needs to be done before any cruising." As soon as I read it to him he said "It's not specific enough is it?" I asked him to make it more specific. If he thinks these issues need correcting before I put the boat back in the water, please say so. If he thinks I can sail around the San Juans for a few months, please define the inshore/offshore issues. We then talked for a few minutes about which issues were real safety ones and which weren't.

He told me he'd correct the survey and get it to me in a couple hours. (pretty good service) I was hoping that he'd outline which issues in particular he wanted done now and which he wanted done later. He didn't do that. What he did do was add 2 words to the sentence about cruising. It now reads "...work needs to be done before cruising off shore."

I'm content enough with the resolution we achieved. The language is more precise where it needs to be and can't easily be read that I need to be pinned to the dock. I'm still miffed that he is saying that 2 items are out of ABYC compliance when they're not but only as a matter of principle. I wouldn't be mad if he said they represent a safety hazard in his opinion, but in principle I take issue with invoking a standard when it doesn't really apply. I'll let that go though as I don't think It'll affect the insurance issues.

So I'll submit the survey and see what happens. Hopefully I'll be able to take the bowsprit off at the end of the season and really "spruce" ;) it up in the shop at home as a fall/winter project.

MedSailor
Sounds like a reasonable meeting with results which are palatable to you for the most part.

Glad you to it worked out and can continue to sail while you work on the issues

Dave
 
#60 ·
:mad: I just got my survey, and I'm not happy with my surveyor. It was an insurance survey, and thus the information contained therein may be used against me by insurance lawyers in the event of a claim.

My boat is not in an unsafe or unseaworthy condition, and it even says so much at the beginning of the survey. What I am mad about, is that he has outlined 10 findings that he says need to be corrected to be in compliance with ABYC standards and I don't believe there really is a standard for 2 of them.

What I'm REALLY mad about is that he seems to have totaled up a bunch of small stuff and made the broad, general, nonspecific (and damning statement) that "The vessel is well found but needs work before any cruising is commenced."

Great. Well found, yes, but needs "work" before "any cruising" is commenced??? I'm afraid the insurance company won't read "well found" but will only read the part about "work before any cruising".

There is a very lively thread started by Brian about what cruising means. It doesn't seem like a well defined term. What about "any". Can I not take this boat back to my slip, or anchor overnight 1km from home? What most peeves me is the word "work". Surveyors, I believe are supposed to use precise language. While a couple sentences ago he says that findings 1-10 need to be done to meet abyc standards (that's precise language) "work" needing to be done is completely nebulous.

Now I know what some of you are thinking. "MedSailor's boat is a death-trap and he's blind to the real state of the hulk. He's lucky to be alive and it might sink in dry-dock tomorrow." I'll let y'all decide if that's true. Here are the 10 findings that he says are out of ABYC standard compliance, with comments in brackets by me:

1: Soft wood at the tab in a forward bulkhead. (Is a soft bulkead really an ABYC standard??? Couldn't find it if it is. They also don't provide much strength to my boat.)
2: Household wire nuts found in 3 locations. (2 are decommissioned wires and one was unknown to me)
3: Start of soft wood at the aft end of the bowsprit (been keeping an eye on this. Again, is there an ABYC standard for this?)
4: Fuel gauge wiring is bare wire and needs terminal. (gauge broken, is on the to-do list)
5: Shifting cable starting to rust through. (Just found this at haulout definitely need to replace)
6: No carbon monoxide detector aboard. (Yes, I have one but he didn't find it)
7: Engine exhaust hose single clamped (don't know how I, or my previous surveyor missed something so obvious)
8: Inverter positive wire terminal exposed (news to me. I never use it. Will fix)
9: Flares expired. (wrong. Got new ones, he only found the expired stash)
10: Fuel fill hose at deck is single clamped. (didn't know it needed double)

So tell me if I'm wrong. Is there really an ABYC standard for a soft bulkhead inside the boat or "start of soft wood" on a bowsprit? I'm not arguing that they need to be on my fix-it list, but is there really an ABYC standard that I'm not in compliance with?

Also, what do you think about the "work needs to be done before any cruising is commenced." I think that statement is too general and might prompt the insurance company to freak out.

What do you think?

MedSailor
Hey MS,

I didn't read through all the comments, but I too would have been frustrated. I think I would go back to him and have him amend it to be more specific and discuss the things that are really critical. Then I would make sure my insurance company signs off on it.

Brian
 
#61 ·
I have followed this thread for awhile, and can appreciate and even commiserate with many of the posters. Probably don't need to add my opinion, but I have observed the following from the several pages of posts:
1. Surveys are typically a pain in the rear. I have had a couple of surveys, and been present for each one. learned a lot from all of them, and found them very valuable, but also frustrating. Remember, what is being surveyed is typically a 15, 20, 30, or more old sea-going vessel that has spent most of it's life in a hostile (to the boat material) environment - there are ALWAYS going to be problems.
2. Being present at a survey is essential. The last survey for my current boat, I drove 6 hours one way around Lake Huron to be there and follow the surveyor - invaluable.
3. Boating is not like medical malpractice (for Med sailor). I would challenge anyone to find a boat in perfect condition with no problems. That's different than saying a boat is not seaworthy (which, by the way, is on opinion, not a factual finding). In medicine (yes, I'm a physician too) we try to get everything right and always need to cover our asses, but with sailing, we try to do the best we can to keep the boat in as good a shape as possible and sail as safely as possible.
4. All the surveyors I have worked with have been professional, but it is there job to identify as many flaws or imperfections as possible, and then to document them.
5. Sailing for most of us is recreation or past-time (though sometimes full time as well). It makes sense to enjoy it, worry about the big stuff, and fix as much of the small stuff as we can. Anyone out their have a boat project task list without anything left unchecked? I don't.​

So get out and sail, have fun, and let the insurance company try an prove that whatever problem you had must have come from some minor fault found on a survey of an old boat.
 
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#63 ·
I just had a survey done and was very pleased with the results. If there are problems, I want to know it. Safety always comes first; fix accordingly. However, I am curious about the application of ABYC standards in general. If you have a boat that was not required to be built to those standards, is there a rule that says it must be upgraded to meet them? Sort of like driving an old car that was built before air bags were required.
 
#67 ·
...However, I am curious about the application of ABYC standards in general. If you have a boat that was not required to be built to those standards, is there a rule that says it must be upgraded to meet them? Sort of like driving an old car that was built before air bags were required.
I'd have to say that boats SHOULD be up to the new standard where ABCY is concerned. ABCY, IMHO is a very good set of standards that are largely safety oriented.

When my 1925-built house was inspected they found some knob and tube wiring. Standard at the time? Yup. Fire hazard? You bet! Less houses burn down these days and that's largely due to the application of good standards and building codes.

MedSailor
 
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