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  Topic Review (Newest First)
01-17-2002 10:12 PM
Newbie question


Please disregard BigRed''s comments about "elitist,shallow" sailors. BigRed has never spent more than $1,000 on anything (unless you count that night in Vegas in 1972).

If you are fit and don''t mind getting wet, BigRed''s low budget plan would seem to be very rewarding. Although I wouldn''t recommend restoring a leaf catcher if you know nothing about boats! But keep in mind, plenty of competent sailors have started out in low budget keelboats.

There are a couple of very large lake (reservoirs) on the Columbia, so you shouldn''t have problem finding other sailors.
I would expect their recommendations to be very helpful.

Also, you can probably get plenty of free lessons if you know how to stock a cooler properly.


01-17-2002 05:34 PM
Newbie question

Ahoy Jeff if your answer to the gentlemans question was off base for his area why go on with the same old drivel. My point was he could learn a lot over the next 15 years in the small venues that are available to him. In addition his area has a lack of vessels to chose from so anything might just have to do for now. For the last time fixed keel boats should not be considered as easy or desirable to trailer. Period. Rigging any vessel of this size is impractical at ramps and dammed hard if the rig is of good size. Period. The man needs some down time don''t keep him dreaming his life away. The best dreamed are those realised for what they are, GO SAILING ! GO SAILING ON ANYTHING !, LEARN EVERYTHING ABOUT SAILING BY DOING IT!. To say what you''ve said about nice boats (money) justs proves my point and although your right not everyone turns out that way but you have. To insult every sailboat owner not up to your standards is the very definition of arrogance. Junkers as you call them number in the hundreds of thousands probably millions by your own standards. But thats just my opinion. Big Red 56 Pirate of Pine Island.
01-17-2002 11:49 AM
Newbie question


We own a Morgan 384 docked at Toledo Beach Marina on Western Lk. Erie. Use to Live in Oak Harbor, live in Detroit now. Lots of opportunity to learn. Do you belong to a sail club? I believe there is one in Pt. Clinton, sailors are always willing to teach those who want to learn.
E-mail me at and we can discuss some options. ASA sailing classes are great. I am sure there are places in Ohio that offer classes, if not I know a few in the area.

01-17-2002 04:43 AM
Newbie question

Talk about "elitist, arrogant, and shallow", "ludicrous and expensive". I too have owned quite a few boat that I bought for well under $1000 dollars, but generally after long periods of hard work and a lot of ''new'' and used gear, I have ended up with as much money in these bargains as I could have bought a fully operational and several times more expensive boat for and I have gnerally made out better financially when I have bought boats that were well maintained by prior owners (but perhaps in need of minor cosmetics) than when I have bought boats that were somewhat abandoned. I do agree with your ''covered in leaves sitting in someone''s yard'' point.

The original poster is new to sailing. He wants to learn to sail. There will be plenty of time for him to learn to restore old junkers later.

I also disagree with your wholesale condemnation of up to 25 foot keel boats. Most of the larger adult oriented sailing schools that I know of use 22 to 26 foot keel boats quite effectively to teach sailing. Obviously in this person''s case, there are not adequate facilities where they will be sailing for that solution to work, but is an excellent way to learn to sail in many venues around the country.

Boats like J-24''s can be bought as cheaply as $3500 in non-racing condition and are easy enough to sail, and have so much literature on how to sail one available, and have such a surplus of good used J-24 gear available that I think J-24''s can make an excellent, low cost starter boat for someone who thinks that they might be interested in learning performance sailing. Literally thousands of people have learned to sail on J-24''s or have owned J-24''s as first boats.

Lastly, learning to sail on performance oriented boats, does not automatically make "elitist, arrogant, and shallow sailors" any more than learning to sail on junkers automatically makes people who can''t be tolerant of people prefer to sail or recommend that others sail on nice boats.

01-17-2002 04:17 AM
Newbie question

We are looking for someone willing/qualified to give my family some sailing instruction. "We" includes myself, my wife, our 13 yr old and our 26 yr old if he can find the time. We bought our 23'' Paceship last May and went out several times w/ experienced sailors who helped us learn how to make the boat go. We also sailed by ourselves whenever we could but there are lots of basic things and finer points I still have questions about...anchoring, emergencies, etc. I am reluctant to practice such things w/o being shown the proper actions first. We dock on Lake Erie at Port Clinton, OH. We don''t expect it to be free, but hope it would be reasonable for a family group. Am I dreaming?
01-17-2002 03:37 AM
Newbie question

Ahoy Joe 206, Big Red 56 here, I reccomend you buy anything you can get your hands on including a project boat that required you to work on it before you sail. Nothing is going to prepare you except experience. I suggest you start small and trailer what ever you buy. Centerboard is just fine however considering your age and marital status I suggest something two people can enjoy. Any sailing dinghy 16'' and up ought to do. Highlanders are nice, many small boats that are poor sailers by other people standards are just fine to start out with. The point is buy anything now and get started. I do not reccomend any thing as big as 25 + feet or any fixed keel boat because the problems and limitations in your travel restrictions will make the whole pross to cumbersome and less enjoyable.( Time and prep and expense) I have never spent more than One thousand dollars for any of the boats I own and there are plenty more where they come from. If you see something sitting in a yard covered with leaves stop and ask.You''d be suprised what great deals are just sitting there for the asking. To place anyone in your position in a "J" or similar racing class boat is ludicrous and expensive. You will be a poor sailor for the simple fact is you don''t know the difference and you''ll never learn starting off at the top. What you will become is another elitist arrogant and shallow sailor. If your plans for the future are sailing take my advise , otherwise you''d better have plenty of money to buy ,maintain and sail your dream. Big Red the Pirate of Pine Island.
01-16-2002 06:58 AM
Newbie question

Thanks We always thought sailing was way too expensive for us even though we really wanted to start and then just playing around on the internet we found that it really isn''t. So instead of looking at getting a boat in 10 or 15 years we are looking at getting one in maybe a year or two. I''m trying to soak up all the information I can right now. Do you have any good books in mind that I should read? We are already looking into a week vacation and taking sailing lessons. So far the internet has been a great help to me. All the people I meet online at the sailing places are great and very helpful. Although I''m still trying to get all the termanology down.

01-16-2002 06:40 AM
Newbie question

My Wife and I just got into Sailing this last summer, we went for a short ride, and got hooked! We found a Chrysler 22'', at a very good price. Do a lot of "book learning", and follow up with practice. I have found that other sailors are very glad to share their knowledge and experience. Good luck!!
01-15-2002 08:29 PM
Newbie question

Thanks for the advice! I don''t know of any hoists in this area. I was fully intending to stay far away from the favored powerboat areas. They''re too darn noisy anyways, but thanks for letting me know about the wakes. I had never heard that before.
01-15-2002 02:26 PM
Newbie question

One of the J/Boats weeklong sessions (or a similar one) in the Caribbean or Florida would probably be a good thing for you to learn with, and a fun time as well. Jeff forgot to mention the J/24 as a possible option. There are a lot of them around, generally, and they can be had for less than $10,000 if you''re just looking for one to learn on. You really would need a hoist to get it in & out though. FYI most sailors avoid lakes that are heavily frequented by powerboats because the wakes shake the wind from the sails and can stop you dead in the water.
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