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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > Sailboat ready to cruise?
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Topic Review (Newest First)
08-08-2013 08:34 AM
JonEisberg
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aeventyr60 View Post
The guy can't be a cruiser, no water jugs lashed to the deck..
Nah, if I were a Real Cruiser, I'd have a watermaker, and said jugs on deck would be filled with diesel... :-)
08-07-2013 07:13 PM
aeventyr60
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

The guy can't be a cruiser, no water jugs lashed to the deck..
08-07-2013 02:41 PM
Cruisingdad
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
True, but not nearly as well...

Furthermore, the working sailplan of most production sailboats is sized to drive the boat in the condition you see it at the boat show... By the time the massive amount of additional crap that most of us cruisers carry is brought aboard, and the additional windage created by the addition of canvas and jungle gyms, with all the assorted gear is factored in, most boats will be woefully underpowered under their working sails alone... Hence, the reason why cruising sailors need a good light air sail inventory even more than any other type of sailor - if they'd prefer to sail instead of motor, that is... Why more cruisers don't appear to appreciate that, I'll just never understand...



Nah, I think you're overstating that to a degree, I'd say the breeze is only on the nose a mere 90% of the time, or thereabouts... :-)

Actually, if you sail with the seasons, one can improve those odds considerably... One of the reasons the trip south and back north along the East coast makes for such a ideal winter's cruise, the prevalence of good NW-NE sailing breezes on the way down, and then SW-SE on the way back up... Sometimes one has to wait a bit for them to materialize, but when you're able to hitch a ride behind the passage of a cold front headed south in the fall, for example, sailing generally doesn't get much better than that...


Good post Jon.

Brian
08-06-2013 08:43 PM
JonEisberg
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruisingdad View Post
Jon,

You can still go downwind without a kite. I must admit though, I do miss flying a cruising chute. I enjoyed it.
True, but not nearly as well...

Furthermore, the working sailplan of most production sailboats is sized to drive the boat in the condition you see it at the boat show... By the time the massive amount of additional crap that most of us cruisers carry is brought aboard, and the additional windage created by the addition of canvas and jungle gyms, with all the assorted gear is factored in, most boats will be woefully underpowered under their working sails alone... Hence, the reason why cruising sailors need a good light air sail inventory even more than any other type of sailor - if they'd prefer to sail instead of motor, that is... Why more cruisers don't appear to appreciate that, I'll just never understand...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruisingdad View Post
Besides, it is now obvious to me that you have NEVER cruised. I am shocked, given all the great advice you have shown here. Want to know how I came to this conclusion? Because no matter where you plan to go, you inevitably are always heading the exact direction of the wind. Thus, the spi would be worthless!!!

Brian
Nah, I think you're overstating that to a degree, I'd say the breeze is only on the nose a mere 90% of the time, or thereabouts... :-)

Actually, if you sail with the seasons, one can improve those odds considerably... One of the reasons the trip south and back north along the East coast makes for such a ideal winter's cruise, the prevalence of good NW-NE sailing breezes on the way down, and then SW-SE on the way back up... Sometimes one has to wait a bit for them to materialize, but when you're able to hitch a ride behind the passage of a cold front headed south in the fall, for example, sailing generally doesn't get much better than that...


08-06-2013 04:19 PM
Cruisingdad
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonEisberg View Post
You know, diesel fuel is expensive, too... I'll bet if you removed some of those 10 gallon jerry jugs, you'd manage to squeeze a spinnaker in there... :-)

For a cruiser, no other piece of gear comes remotely close to reducing one's dependency on foreign oil, than does a free flying light air sail inventory of a spinnaker, gennaker, Code 0, or whatever...

I'm reminded of those acquaintances of yours whose spinnaker is stored in their rental storage unit, because they don't have the room for it aboard... Damn, if that's not a sad sign of the times, I don't know what is... :-)
Jon,

You can still go downwind without a kite. I must admit though, I do miss flying a cruising chute. I enjoyed it.

Besides, it is now obvious to me that you have NEVER cruised. I am shocked, given all the great advice you have shown here. Want to know how I came to this conclusion? Because no matter where you plan to go, you inevitably are always heading the exact direction of the wind. Thus, the spi would be worthless!!!

Brian
08-06-2013 04:10 PM
JonEisberg
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruisingdad View Post
Right now, in my lazarette, I have ***Lots of Stuff, including*** 10g spare diesel cans...

A Spinnaker would be nice, but you can do without it (and its expensive and takes up a lot of room).
You know, diesel fuel is expensive, too... I'll bet if you removed some of those 10 gallon jerry jugs, you'd manage to squeeze a spinnaker in there... :-)

For a cruiser, no other piece of gear comes remotely close to reducing one's dependency on foreign oil, than does a free flying light air sail inventory of a spinnaker, gennaker, Code 0, or whatever...

I'm reminded of those acquaintances of yours whose spinnaker is stored in their rental storage unit, because they don't have the room for it aboard... Damn, if that's not a sad sign of the times, I don't know what is... :-)
08-06-2013 03:41 PM
sailpower
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_H View Post
Yes, I am familiar with the earlier Pearson 36 that was a similar but larger version in the design series which included the Pearson 26, 30, and 10M. These boats really sailed very well for their era. The bad news on the 10M and 36 was that build quaility was not as good as it should be (crummy hull to deck joint, and formica covered plywood interiors), and the strange keel designs which always seemed vulnerable to all kinds of maladies.
Donít forget the garish colors used in the interior counters and exterior decks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff_H View Post
But with regards to the 365, I do not like the earliest versions with the formica covered plywood bulkheads. These boats had a smaller sail plan and frankly were undercanvassed. But in the 1980 upgrade, the sloop/cutter rig seemed to include a little more sail area and better hardware. Like you, this is the version that I like if shoal draft is a priority.

Jeff
Yes, I would say, like you, that the 1980-1983 Pearson 365ís and 367ís are the way to go and offer a lot for the dollar.

If money is tight and you can live with the formica interior, the 1976-1979 Pearson 365ís still have the great layout and tankage.

One thing about all year 365ís vs 367ís is the lack of a traveler in the 365ís.

Nothing is 100%!
08-06-2013 03:20 PM
Jeff_H
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailpower View Post
Jeff, when you mention the early 36 models are you thinking the 1972-1975 36? If so, that is not a 365 and has a different hull. It is a version of the 26 and 30 models. It did have pilot berths port and starboard.

The 365 was built from 1976-1983. It came in sloop and ketch versions and had the 4.6 draft. The 76-79 boats were laminate interiors and a teak interior option was available in 1980 which often included a teak rubrail.. This is the version I like if you need the shoal draft. Also built on this hull was a pilothouse model starting in 1980.

The 367 cutter came out in late 79 and, as you say, was the ďperformanceĒ model of the 365/367 boats with a 5.5 draft, also with a teak interior.

In 1985, yet another version was introduced which might be the tall rig you are thinking of? That boat was also completely different again and had fixed keel and centerboard versions. It is mostly known as the 36 II.
Yes, I am familiar with the earlier Pearson 36 that was a similar but larger version in the design series which included the Pearson 26, 30, and 10M. These boats really sailed very well for their era. The bad news on the 10M and 36 was that build quaility was not as good as it should be (crummy hull to deck joint, and formica covered plywood interiors), and the strange keel designs which always seemed vulnerable to all kinds of maladies.

But with regards to the 365, I do not like the earliest versions with the formica covered plywood bulkheads. These boats had a smaller sail plan and frankly were undercanvassed. But in the 1980 upgrade, the sloop/cutter rig seemed to include a little more sail area and better hardware. Like you, this is the version that I like if shoal draft is a priority.

I was not thinking of the 36-2. 36-2 has never appealed to me. The last Pearsons always seems like a 'hail Mary pass' rather than well concieved designs. What I dislike most was that most 36-2's had wing keels and I would never recommend a wing keel because of the difficulty freeing them from a grounding.

Jeff
08-05-2013 08:54 PM
sailpower
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

Jeff, when you mention the early 36 models are you thinking the 1972-1975 36? If so, that is not a 365 and has a different hull. It is a version of the 26 and 30 models. It did have pilot berths port and starboard.

The 365 was built from 1976-1983. It came in sloop and ketch versions and had the 4.6 draft. The 76-79 boats were laminate interiors and a teak interior option was available in 1980 which often included a teak rubrail.. This is the version I like if you need the shoal draft. Also built on this hull was a pilothouse model starting in 1980.

The 367 cutter came out in late 79 and, as you say, was the “performance” model of the 365/367 boats with a 5.5 draft, also with a teak interior.

In 1985, yet another version was introduced which might be the tall rig you are thinking of? That boat was also completely different again and had fixed keel and centerboard versions. It is mostly known as the 36 II.

So, for anyone who is still reading:

Pearson 36

Pearson 365

Pearson 36 Cutter

Pearson 36 Pilot House

Pearson 36-2
08-05-2013 06:17 PM
Jeff_H
Re: Sailboat ready to cruise?

There are a number of items that I would like to touch on above...
First to Laura's questions "..is all that teak on deck just for show? Are there any useful purposes for it? The maintenance seems like a big job with lots of hard labor."

By and large, the teak that you see on these boats do have a function. Depending on the specific boat, they have teak grab rails to hold onto, teak toerails to brace your feet against, and teak rubrails with stainless steel caps to reduce the chance of damaging the topsides. Teak in this form can be low maintenance if allowed to weather out to a grey oxydation. It does shorten the life of the teak, but you are unlikely to own the boat long enough to see its lifespan end. You can sand and vanish the teak, which is a fair amount of maintenance or oil the teak which is easier to do and lengthens the life of the teak, but which should be done more frequently than varnish. Or you can do as many cruisers do, and commit the sacrilege of priming and painting the teak, a one time maintenance which should last for perhaps 6-8 years and is easy to redo when necessary.

There was a valid point about the various iterations of the Pearson 36, 365, and 367. This design was produced for a reasonably long time and in a number of forms. There was a major redo in the early 1980's in which a taller sloop rig was introduced and the cabin layout modernized. One of the 365's that I showed was that updated sloop/cutter version. Then there was a major rework around 1982 or so which included some interior changes and a taller rig. That version was offered as both a shoal and deeper keel version. You sometimes see this deep draft version listed as a 367 and would be the version that I personally would lean towards. But that's because I tend to prefer a bit more performance. I would not necessarily say that it is a better choice for Laura, but I would think that they would want the taller rig sloop in their sailing venue since they can get by with smaller overlaps on their headsails and fewer sail changes. (I know Brian does not believe in sail changes, but his boat starts out with more sail area relative it its weight and drag and so can get by with a single headsail and mainsail, reefing down in rough conditions. That is not an option in this price range, and the early 365's had an SA/D around 14-15 and so needed very large overlapping jibs to sail at a reasonable speed even in a moderate breeze. That large overlapping jib is a pain to tack and cannot be reefed down enough and still maintain flat enough shape to useful in a heavier breeze.)

I think that Chuck's suggestion of an Irwin 38 is a good one for a variety of reasons. Certainly the Irwins 38's offer a lot of room for the dollar. But an Irwin 38 in decent shape generally sells for well outside the price range that Laura has available.

The Irwin 37's would be within Laura's price range, but Irwin had a checkered history when it came to equipage and quality control. The Irwin 38 Mk II's were reasonably well built but the Irwin 37 and 38 Mk I's had a poor reputation. My step-father rebuilt a I-37 and my sense is that the Irwin 37's just were not all that well built, employing skip tabbing and other cost cutting measure.

To quote Jack Horner's review of these boats: "Problems commonly found on examination of Irwin 37's include deteriorated deck core resulting from poorly bedded deck fittings, damage to the lightly constructed deck to hull joint.." While core problems are not all that unusual for boats of that era, noting hull to deck problems is a much more serious issue and one that suggests more extensive issues as well.

My other concerns with the Irwins are purely personal. I really dislike galleys in the passage way. They tend to be hot and its tough on the galley crew to work in that tightly confined space separated from everyone else. (Not so good for keeping an eye on young kids either). I also do not like athrwartships berths since they can't be used underway, not that vee berths are all that great underway.

Jeff
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