substitute 'any' for 'open'Luck and skill...sometimes work together. ;-)
It would have been very unlucky to have been anywhere near the phillipines this week in an open boat
Yes but neither the sea is different as probably the sailors are less experienced. Minimum safety standards should apply yo all organised offshore events.Smack, rallies are not races except that they may cross the same hunk of ocean. The vessels are different, the crews are different and the intentions of the trip are different.
.....
Is that this incident?If you are from the UK you know for certain the outcome of that incident where a racing boat was rammed by a cargo ship on a race? The sailor was condemned to pay a HUGE fine.
Exactly, some of these folks should never have been offshore, given their general physical condition. I have been severely seasick twice to the point of vomiting and nauseated at least half a dozen times to the point where it affected my performance. Scary stuff. Lack of sleep, anxiety and dehydration definitely contribute to mal de mer. In those conditions, you might not want to be outside, looking at the horizon or steering.I went to the saltydawg rally web site and listened to the daily radio logs they have recorded. The Morgan 416 that requested rescue was on the recording. They reported taking on water beyond the capacity of their pumps and at least one crew member seasick to the point of uncontrollably vomiting blood.
Seems to be well beyond queasy.
And before anyone beats up the forecasters, the weather was quite odd. We don't often see cold fronts pushed along in front of a high instead of dragged along by a low. The high stalled and the cold front intensified over Tidewater Virginia and then drifted offshore to pound the boats out there. It was all very flaky. I don't think anyone got it right.I'm inclined to believe the conditions that the boats offshore saw might have been considerably more impressive than what's being reported... Our sail down the Bay yesterday and last night was fantastic, but featured a lot more breeze behind that front than was forecast...
Are you on Utopia?btw, for those that haven't had the pleasure, a CR 42 on a broad reach in 30 knots of November breeze, it's like sailing a freight train, what a sweet ride...
If in such a dire state of health I got to wonder why medical treatment was refused once ashore.They reported taking on water beyond the capacity of their pumps and at least one crew member seasick to the point of uncontrollably vomiting blood.
Seems to be well beyond queasy.
Couldn't have said it any better myself.I personally think as group sailors contribute enough to society, but this is the kind of wonderfully emotive topic that get's people all angry and righteous everytime some poor bastard punches his eprib.
Without getting political- I think you will find that the money spent rescuing sailors is insignificant compared to the money governments spend dealing with things like self imposed health issues, crime, etc etc. When everyone receives a bill for their burden on society then I will be open to sailors paying more.
This is a sailing forum these kind of the things are the fodder for discussion. That is what forums are for.This thread would have to be the biggest heap of stinking armchair excrement I have seen on Sailnet in a while.
Two boats we know very little about have gotten in trouble offshore in circumstances we know very little about. Thats the story. That and they were part of a rally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy
You can have the best weather router in the world - but weather changes - as you've just pointed out. Then it comes down to the preparedness of the participants. If they aren't prepared - you have a serious problem.
Why not hold rallies to the same safety standards as races? It really makes little sense not to.
Standards??? Regulation??? From Mr BFS.......
Bite me.
Because cruising is not racing.
I go cruising to escape bureaucratic morons trying to tell me what to do. Thankyou very much but I will not be asking them to inspect my boat and grant me permission to take my boat offshore.
Two words.
Skippers Responsibility.
It begins and ends there.
Rallies can be fun. I didn't think they would be our cup of tea, but they have helped us build confidence, not because we expected other experienced boats to bail us out offshore, but because we got to chat with those guys before we went and we learn't a thing or two and when we got there those guys were also there to raise a glass and toast the fact that we had conquered challenges.
If any one let's a rally make decisions for them and follows blindly then they are an idiot and need to read the two words above. However if being in a rally every now and then makes us bad, irresponsible silly sailors then......
Bite me.
As for PCP charging us all, taxing and licensing sailors to the hilt......
Bite me.
That conversation annoy me and i have had it several times.
Perhaps I went A bit far with that line. I had read through the entire thread and that was the first thing thought that popped into my head. I really have an issue ( you may have noticed) with further regulation and interference into what is my life.I agree with a lot of what you said but the tone was a bit much in my opinion.
Personally, I learn a lot from threads that discuss situations such as this. You have the people who have been out there and done it sharing with those who have not or hope to. It's how people learn. It's part of why this forum exists. After some time being in the forum you identify the sailors with the actual experience and those who haven't left the couch and you sort through the information provided so that you can add to your own bag of sailing tools to become a better sailor.
Obviously, a few of these big boat owners should have hired an experienced pro
Now that I sail boats over 30 ft. I should stay inshore or can I still go out in the ocean safely ?Many of these big boat sailors might be better suited to being safely inside on the ICW, instead of 200 miles off Hatteras...
Sorry, you need a minimum of 40 ft. to go in the ocean safely, soon to be required by regulation. Plus, you must have completed all the ASA courses, including the Blue Water Sailing course (only $1,999 for a limited time) and crewed on someone else's 40+ foot boat in the ocean. Sailing is an esoteric art, limited to a few initiates, not every slob who can afford a boat...sailing is rocket science, after all!Now that I sail boats over 30 ft. I should stay inshore or can I still go out in the ocean safely ?
If you feel you are about to vomit, please immediately activate your EPIRB while you can still operate it. You might also consider attaching it to the vomit bucket so you can have it handy before vomiting. One of our sponsors is having a 2 EPRIBs for the price of 1 special! (you can never have enough EPIRBS, particularly if one of the crew locks himself in the head with one.)I've never vomited on a boat, from seasickness.
Again, I would ask why the person refused medical treatment once ashore. That is what piqued my curiosity along with saying they were taking on water rather then sinking. Could be bad reporting I don't know but it does makes me wonder.Vomiting blood, is not any seasickness I've heard of. Maybe ulcer, perforated something, but not seasickness. My crew was vomiting blood, especially bright red, I'd get him to med services ASAP.
These unappreciative Monday Night Armchair Sailors make me sick!Bottom line, is if any boats were in the Gulf Stream in that kind of weather, boats will break without good seamanship, crews will get sick and injuries will happen. I just hope those that are Monday Night Armchair Sailing have been out in these kinds of seas and winds... Let have a discussion based on facts not Armchair Sailing.