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  Topic Review (Newest First)
04-03-2007 06:45 PM
sailingdog Just to be agreeable, I agree, you're both asses full of crap..

There have been a few good articles in the sailing magazines about the benefits of a tuned rig. A boat's performance will generally improve when the rig is properly tuned. It is also less likely to lose its mast if the rig is properly tuned. Considering what the replacement costs and dangers are if you drop a mast... spending some time to tune the rig is a cheap investment in the boat's performance and safety.
04-03-2007 05:47 PM
tenuki Obviously me too! That post was due to a full moon and too much wine. Instead of editing it I'm gonna leave it up there in all it's glory so everyone can see I'm an ass full of crap.
04-03-2007 05:46 PM
soul searcher There is, no argueing it, Im a sloppy Thinking Ass full of crap.

04-03-2007 01:20 AM
tenuki Ok, some skin off my back. I hate bad arguments. It isn't a chicken and egg problem. I just can't let that stand... Look at the answers to these two questions and think for a minute.

How do you know the standing rigging is out of tune?
How do you know the sail shape is wrong?

The sail shape is an absolute, ie there is a proper sail shape that optimizes/maximizes the boat speed and balance. Right? It arises from proper rig tuning, but the opposite isn't true, ie proper rig tune does not happen as a result of sail shape. Hence no origination paradox (chicken and egg problem).

Argue with me, fine, but keep your sloppy thinking to yourself. ;P

The shape is created by two things under your control. The standing rigging/mast/boom/boat and the running rigging.

Of those two thing the running rigging is the most readily adjustable, and is in fact the 'controls' presented to the operator of the sailboat.

The standing rigging and such is also adjustable but not to the degree as the running rigging and certainly it's not common for standing rigging to have controls led back to the cockpit (with the exception of backstay tensioning).

There is no chicken and egg. There are two sets of controls who's intent is to create the ideal sail shape.

The running rigging has the gross control of sail shape. You can make a sail flop, make it curve, bag, everything in between with those controls. Way more control than the standing rigging, right?

The standing rigging is the fine tuning, it has adjustments, but they don't have controls that lead back to the cockpit and they have a smaller effect on the shape than the running rigging does. I'm assuming that you 'adjust' them far less frequently than you do the running rigging, right? I mean, think of the scale of the effect....

My point, and only point was that if you didn't have a grasp of how to use the gross controls of the running rigging, that playing around with the fine controls of the standing rigging wouldn't do you much good.

Anyone who disagrees with that statement is obviously an ass and full of crap!!!

I'm impressed with all of you and think you are obviously amazing sailors to be fiddling with those stainless steel thingys up there in the middle of the boat, but come on, chicken and egg? that is just lame.
04-03-2007 12:53 AM
tenuki ok, you keep fiddling with your rigging, no skin off my back.
04-02-2007 11:46 PM
soul searcher
Well, I believe I made myself clear.
I,m not critisizing
But the two go hand in hand
You can't look for a canutin bearing unless you know what a canutin bearing looks like.
04-02-2007 10:50 PM
Originally Posted by tenuki
I hear the riggers around here all 'hate' Brian Toss. I think it's the beard and curly hair, or maybe the fact that customers keep saying things like 'Brian couldn't do it till next year, so I'm coming to you, are you any good?'
That's right.. you're up in the Seattle area... his neck of the woods...
04-02-2007 10:50 PM
sailingdog Well, without the rigging tensioned properly, playing with the sheets and halyards is likely to be a bit futile IMHO. You'll get some sail shape, but will it be a proper sail shape.. probably not.
04-02-2007 10:47 PM
Originally Posted by sailingdog
Brian Toss's book, The Complete Rigger's Apprentice, is an excellent one to keep aboard.
I hear the riggers around here all 'hate' Brian Toss. I think it's the beard and curly hair, or maybe the fact that customers keep saying things like 'Brian couldn't do it till next year, so I'm coming to you, are you any good?'
04-02-2007 10:39 PM
Originally Posted by soul searcher
which came first the chicken or the egg
If the rig is out o wack how can you achieve proper sail shape?
Well, I believe I made myself clear. If you don't know what proper sail shape and trim is you have no chance of finding it by tuning the rigging.
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