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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > Help me settle a bet!
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Thread: Help me settle a bet! Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
08-01-2002 07:46 PM
dhartdallas
Help me settle a bet!

Ahoy, Tormand. Re: Your July 14th.
Don''t get out there and have to remember something. Especially if you''ve been thinking. Think of lee as leeeeve. If you wanted to leave something, you would go away from it. Lee is away from the wind, or downwind. If there were a storm and I wanted to get into it, I would go toward it. Toward the weather. To weather. The weather leeves the boat to lee, over the leeward rail. The weather comes aboard over the first rail it hits. That rail is where the weather is. It is the weather rail. But out there, just put your back square to the wind and if you can see it, it is leeward. If you are facing the wind square and can see it, it is to weather.
07-17-2002 05:19 AM
colehankins
Help me settle a bet!

I stand corrected. Who''d a thunk it?
07-17-2002 03:28 AM
DuaneIsing
Help me settle a bet!

Well, colehankins, you are helping to prove my earlier point that this concept leads to some justifiable confusion.

First, the definition of "lee shore" was established to be any shore that is on the leeward side of a body of water (as Jeff stated). In your example, the west sides of both islands would be lee shores (with the wind out of the west, as you implied).

With your boat in between the islands, yes, you would also be "in the lee" of the island to your west. And if you ran east out of the lee of the first island, you would be running onto the lee shore of the second island.

Your last point is where I always see the trouble: people standing on the side of the island where the wind is blowing from will not think of that as a lee shore. To them it is the windward shore, and I don''t blame them for thinking that.

I attribute the confusion to the peculiarities of the jargon. In this case, the exact phrase you use ("in the lee" or "lee shore") mean opposite things.

Duane
07-16-2002 01:07 PM
colehankins
Help me settle a bet!

WAIT A MINUTE! what if the two shores happen to be Islands? and your boat is between them? Wouldnt the "lee" of the westerly island be on your left and the "windward" island be on your right? Of course the boat would have the usual wind and lee sides. Now lets say you are standing on the island on the boats right, You are now on a windward shore, Correct? I think the words to lee or to wind work here. How do you suppose the coconuts got there?
07-15-2002 09:48 AM
DuaneIsing
Help me settle a bet!

Yeah, but who''s on first?

That was a good follow-up, Jeff. Fair winds.

Duane
07-15-2002 09:42 AM
Jeff_H
Help me settle a bet!

This isn''t all that complicated, but you are right that it is easy to see why folks can become confused. A lee shore is always a shore that is downwind so that the wind is blowing onto that shore. It does not matter if a boat is there or not.

The leeward side of an island is to leeward of the island but the shore on the Leeward side of the island would be a windward shore that afforded a vessel a safe lee. Got that? Glad one of us did. 8^)

Regards
Jeff
07-15-2002 07:40 AM
DuaneIsing
Help me settle a bet!

Hi Jeff,

I agree completely with your statement, but I want to "defend" my take on this:

I could be wrong, but I believe the term "lee shore" is purely nautical in origin and use. I don''t believe non-boaters standing on land would describe the shore onto which the wind is blowing and the waves are crashing as "lee" anything. In fact, people I know who live on islands (and are not boaters) will often talk about visiting the windward side of the island and seeing the waves crashing. To them (on the island) the side where the wind is coming from is the windward side. When you think about it, they are simply applying the same convention we boaters use while aboard.

I just did a Google search of the term "lee shore" and "windward shore" and found numerous examples of usage describing the two sides of island coastlines (even more with the terms "lee coast" and "lee side") where the leeward shore is the calm side and the windward shore is the rough side. [yes, I know that finding numerous examples of usage does not necessarily make it correct]

My points are simply that (1) it is easy to understand why there is confusion, and (2) the non-boating public appears to be applying the frame-of-reference definition.

Duane
07-15-2002 04:28 AM
Manateee Gene
Help me settle a bet!

Jeff its good to see your still here; keeping everyone well informed!
07-15-2002 03:54 AM
Jeff_H
Help me settle a bet!

Actually, whether a boat is present or not, the shore that is downwind of a body of water is still the leeshore.

Jeff
07-15-2002 03:31 AM
DuaneIsing
Help me settle a bet!

I had to defend that (correct) position a few months ago while taking a boating course. I finally convinced the group (and instructor - yikes!) that it comes down to a matter of your frame of reference. If you''re standing on the shore with the wind and waves beating you up, you don''t think of it as the "lee shore", but when you''re in a boat to windward of that shore, then it becomes the "lee shore" to you.

Glad you won your bet!
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