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SF Bay oil spill

10K views 99 replies 22 participants last post by  sailingdog 
#1 ·
#3 ·
Was it petroleum or petroleum jelly that spilled?

GySgt, I like that Churchill quote. Years ago I had a chance to visit Chartwell. Apparently he had all manner of livestock there -- ducks, pigs, goats, sheep, dairy cows. There were little barns with conical-shaped roofs dating back to the Middle Ages there. Louis Carrol (sp), the guy who wrote Jabberwocky and Alice in Wonderland, lived down the street. Crazy place. You're right. Pigs are very sexy. Very, very, very sexy. Very sexy. MmmmMmmmm...
 
#4 · (Edited)
Was it petroleum or petroleum jelly that spilled?

GySgt, I like that Churchill quote. Years ago I had a chance to visit Chartwell. Apparently he had all manner of livestock there -- ducks, pigs, goats, sheep, dairy cows. There were little barns with conical-shaped roofs dating back to the Middle Ages there. Louis Carrol (sp), the guy who wrote Jabberwocky and Alice in Wonderland, lived down the street. Crazy place. You're right. Pigs are very sexy. Very, very, very sexy. Very sexy. MmmmMmmmm...
LOL, you are one sick Pirate, but I agree, gotta love those pigs.

It was fuel oil, the thick tar like stuff that used to be in it's fuel tank before he peeled the hull like a can opener. The pilot left the boat right after like the cheese eating surrender monkey he is. It took the CG 22 hours to hunt him down.

CG says the pilot was tested with in 2 hours, which is different than initial news reports
 
#6 ·
US I believe. The Captain gives control of his vessel about 10 miles out golden gate to a "certified" pilot, and only the rent-a-pilot can navigate the bay. When they go under that bridge there is only about 100 ft on each side with some nasty currents at times.
 
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#7 ·
Unfortunately, it wasn't crude... IIRC, it was bunker oil, which is heavier than normal light crude, and some of it may sink, and coat the bay's bottom, killing a wide swath of life on the seafloor.
 
#8 · (Edited)
According to the report I read the USCG tested the pilot as well as the crew for alcohol within two hours of the incident. The pilot has a degree of responsibility, but the ultimate responsibility lies with the Master.

There are various grades of fuel oil burned in ship's diesel engines. HFO or heavy fuel oil is generally burned at sea. It may be blended with IFO or intermediate fuel oil for manoeuvering the engine, or IFO alone may be used in those evolutions. Both products are heated within the side tanks they are carried in, in container ships. At ambient temperature they are unpumpable and are not the diesel fuel most mariners are familiar with.

Contact with ambient conditions may cause certain paraffin fractions ot congeal and possibly sink, but most of the oil will float although will have the dark heavy appearance of crude oil, which it is not.

The key to dealing with such incidents is the availability of containment systems. While bunkering (taking on fuel oil for main engines or boilers) in Europoort we experienced the bunker barge's hose rupturing, discharging a couple hundred barrels (42 gal) of HFO into the harbor. Within the hour the spill tug and floating containment booms were alongside and the oil was vacuumed up to the extent we sailed within six hours. Europoort does not have the tidal considerations of SF Bay and the incident occured alonside a sheltered wharf.

There may well be proceedings against the pilot's license, but the Master and company are screwed. Whether the Master will retain his license will be dependant upon the issueing nation's maritime board. It's quite possible the license is Liberian or Panamanian issued and he'll retain it. It's much more likely the pilot will be terminated by the SF Bay Pilot's Assosciation than that the CG will suspend or revoke his license. The pilot is on board as an "advisor" even though his presence is required by law. The responsibility for the vessel remains with the Master, and ultimately the company.

Be prepared for much wringing of hands and wild accusations flying about. A cursory examination of the data will reveal that merchant ship operations, particularly out of the very busy Middle harbor Terminal at Oakland, are very safe. Not far away, the Chevron refinery located at the Richmond Long Wharf, averages about one 70,000 ton tanker per day discharging millions of barrels of Alaskan residium per day without incident. Most residents, and fewer reporters, have any conception of the sheer volume of ships and cargo that move through the port daily, and quite safely. In terms of maritime accidents this one was rather minor, although the effects of wind and tide will make it seem much worse. One account I read headlined with "dead duck" found. No doubt an exhaustive accounting will be forthcoming.

An update on the plans of the Looney Left to seperate citizens and shippers from their future monies can be found below. Be prepared for suggestions ranging all the way up to eliminating commercial traffic. The last thing that will be suggested, and the one with the ability to prevent the most future damage, is an expansion of spill containment and clean-up resources. It's much easier to blame the evil corporate ship owners.

Note that your tax payer funded USCG resources are allocated to the rapid response of CG personnel to ensure the ship's baker was sober. Just an outgrowth of the Valdez incident which increased the bureaucracy while doing little to address maritime safety in practise. Being California, I fully expect this to assume proportions last seen with the Torrey Canyon grounding!

http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2007/11/08/18459201.php
 
#10 ·
Sailaway-

From what I was told... bunker oil is heavier than light crude because it is what is leftover after the lighter, more desirable, components of crude oil are taken away in the distillation process. It is almost asphalt or tar-like in appearance and has the consistency of honey or thick corn syrup at 50˚F. As it ages, it becomes heavier, as the remaining volatiles evaporate off. It is used in some large marine diesel power plants, as well as steam generating power plants.
 
#11 ·
Light crude has nothing to do with it's specific gravity per se. Light crude is low sulpher crude as found in the middle east. Heavy crude is high sulpher crude as found in Alaska and the US Gulf.

The consistency you describe is correct for HFO, much less so for IFO, the oil in question. You are correct in that there are many fractions remaining in these "diesel" fuels, although they are "lighter" than the residium aforementioned commonly burned in Californian power plants. Nevertheless, they are a somewhat refined product and will produce much less bottom damage via sinkage than actual crude would. A bit of a Hobbeson's choice admittedly. Most of the spillage will remain on the surface where it will emulsify. The lighter fractions you mention will have already been removed at the refining process, for the most part, as they are the more valuable constituents of crude oil. The 'heavier" fractions are removed and used in shore side power plants. On the west coast, that level of refining is accomplished in Alaska. Further refining of Alaskan crude is accomplished almost solely within the US Gulf. Californian refining is almost exclusively set up for Arabian light sweet crude oil, a little known fact. SoCal sailors will testify to the ubiquitous lightering operations off the Channel islands; the importing of Arabian crude.
 
#12 ·
Whether bunker oil sinks in largely dependent on temp and salinity moreso than anything else notwithstanding the currents which can exert physical forces in any direction.
Funny - most people think in terms of the Exxon Valdez; been a while since I heard anyone reference the Torry Canyon.
Not sure many of us would argue the value of funding the CG's spill response resources. They may not be cost-effective but it certainly beats the oil company's spill cooperatives resources and capability.
 
#13 ·
While I feel your pain (imagine: Up to six months for some of us here in the Great Lakes): Screw that. You will sail in the Bay again. The oil will clean off your hulls. No, the potential disaster here is the potential impact on the wildlife and the environment :(.

Jim
 
#15 ·
You should see the boat down the dock from me. He sailed through it, poor bastard. I'll get a photo to post tomorrow. Whatever it is, it floats. Wait till you see.

Gunny, No sailing OR surfing. I am going nuts gardening!
 
#16 ·
STOP whining....will ya....

This bastard sank off the coast of Portugal and Spain in galicia in 2002, it was one of the biggest oil spillages in the World, and the bastard is still leaking hundreds of kilos every day...people forget easy....20 Million gallons man....67.000 TONS!!!!!!!! TAR HE WAS CARRYING TAR!!!!

Bet you guys didn't even heard about it...

See here

The bastard

THE BASTARD AGAIN

And we had no one to help clean, it was the fisherman with nets rolled in sticks that picked up...even today, 5 years after, fishing ios dead and forbidden in Galicia...hundreds unemplyed...

Go to google and type: tanker galicia sank...
 
#21 ·
Bet you guys didn't even heard about it...
Prestige? Hell, yes, I heard about it. Tankers leak on occasion, but it's pretty rare for one to split in half. There was a nasty one off Scotland that began with the letter "B", I think, that ended up being worse than Exxon Valdez, as well.

The sinking of Prestige has contributed to my general respect for that whole coast from Ushant to Vigo...some very nasty weather goes into that pocket.
 
#17 ·
The master relies on the local pilot for advice (and the pilot is actually giving the helm and engine orders) as to where the obstructions (such as bridge piers) are, and aren't. The Master's license is subject to the flag state who issued it, meaning whichever country licensed him. The pilot carries two certificates: A Coast Guard license for coastwise US-flag ships, and a state of Calif. pilot license or commission for foreign-flag ships (which this container ship was). So it's up to the state. In some states, these are independent commissions, and in others, it's the pilots themselves. The Coast Guard can't take any action against either the state commission nor the Coast Guard-issued license of a pilot who was piloting a non-US flag ship, as here.

Regardless, you may see a movement to require engine fuel bunker tanks to be "double-skinned", similar to the cargo tanks on oil tankers. Though the damage in the photos looks as though it was deep enough to pentrate to the second skin, if that was the construction on this ship.
 
#19 ·
I agree Gunny. It is sad. Fortunately nature is far more durable and resourceful than our meager efforts. I was in SF in 1975 when the SS Idaho had a spill while in the Bethlehem yard's dry dock of all things. It was similar in scope to the one you're seeing now. The vast majority of work was done by nature. The vast majority of human effort consisted of driving around photographing it and pontificating. If we spent a mere portion of the amount we waste on bureaucracy and report filing on containment and skimmers we could actually do something really proactive towards limiting the effects of any future accidents.
 
#20 ·
I agree Gunny. It is sad. Fortunately nature is far more durable and resourceful than our meager efforts. I was in SF in 1975 when the SS Idaho had a spill while in the Bethlehem yard's dry dock of all things. It was similar in scope to the one you're seeing now. The vast majority of work was done by nature. The vast majority of human effort consisted of driving around photographing it and pontificating. If we spent a mere portion of the amount we waste on bureaucracy and report filing on containment and skimmers we could actually do something really proactive towards limiting the effects of any future accidents.
The amount we spend on spill prevention and preparedness is relatively small and has been decreasing yearly since 1991. The reality is that once the oil hits the water, it's too late for most anything we try to clean it up. Even the best skimmers and booms are only marginally effective. Knowing this fact, the bureaucracy has finally suceeded in requiring double bottoms beginning in 2009 not that this would have prevented this particular accident.
The point being that as long as people continue to want to drive around in our big BMWs and MBs, there will be oil spills.
 
#22 ·
I'm curious where k1vsk would spend additional monies on "spill prevention".

In my experience, if oil is spilled the single largest factor in limiting the spread of the slick and removal of it, within port areas, is the ready availability of containment and skimmers. Oil cooperates by remaining on the surface where it is fairly easily removed. Compared to some other cargoes shipped, oil is containable and removable. Polyvinylchloride and methylisocyanate would lead my hit parade for substances I'd like to see remain contained.
 
#27 ·
I'm curious where k1vsk would spend additional monies on "spill prevention".

In my experience, if oil is spilled the single largest factor in limiting the spread of the slick and removal of it, within port areas, is the ready availability of containment and skimmers. Oil cooperates by remaining on the surface where it is fairly easily removed. Compared to some other cargoes shipped, oil is containable and removable. Polyvinylchloride and methylisocyanate would lead my hit parade for substances I'd like to see remain contained.
Are you sure you're not confusing prevention with cleanup - what part of what I said do you disagree with?
At best, containment and cleanup is generally only marginally effective under good weather and other conditions.
 
#23 ·
I'm going to apologize in advance, but some of this is getting my ire up.

As I sit here, living about three miles from the Oakland terminal where that ship is located, my boat is covered in oil. Crissie Field, where I used to go windsurfing daily, is an Effing Disaster.

I'm tired of the Liberal Bashing. Hell, yes. Let's follow Cheney and Company, and have Hands off business, because God Knows, they do a HELLUVA job being proactive, policing themselves. Whether we're talking shipping, or emissions, or Haliburton, or Blackwater, or Detroit, I am sick of this constant, full-court defense, this constant aversion to looking at things from the other side. At even considering options.

Hell no. It's long live the status quo. Oversight is lunacy. The Press asking questions, unpatriotic. Wrap yourself in the flag, make everything about 9/11, because apparently, only the GOP cares about Protecting America. What a joke, were it not such an insult.

I love this ahole who is our vp. "Conservation may be a personal virtue, but it has no place in our national energy policy." This is like the only knucklehead who can't figure out that energy independence would actually improve our national security. Of course, this is also the fine national defense team who squandered all the good will we built up on 9/12. Who blw off Bin Laden, to get us into Iraq. With no plans for the aftermath, and half the troops needed.

That kind of National Security, I do not need.

Back to the tree-hugging. To clear up some facts: the channel is over 2,000 feet wide. The ship, I think, is 130 feet wide.

I have a friend who's in the know, can't say where he works, says he's been on the bridge, many times, and all old school pilots and masters eschew GPSs (as it's more of a technological assumption....it thinks you are here, which means, the objects in front of you must be here...)

Radar is relied upon, but the containers on deck block the signal, preventing their effective use to between 3 and 9 miles. Not super useful, then.

The XO is placed on the bow, and reports back via radio. In dense fog, given the momentum, by the time they saw they were off course, they were doomed. Visibility was about 500'

That boat should never have left the dock. The Pilot blew it.

As did the coast guard, for opening their mouths with any facts, when it was almost certain that they would be wrong. I read it was 26 hours until the Pilot was screened. Perhaps that is wrong.

This mess was predictable. We get hundreds of ships a week in the bay. We should have the infrastructure in place to do a better job, when the inevitable struck.

I'm pissed. In 100 years, we've managed to really screw up this planet. I'm chagrinned to have to leave this, for my son.

btw, this isn't a Nimby thing. I'm disgusted with the US response to New Orleans. Disgusted.
 
#24 ·
I crossed the bridge that fateful wednesday morning. It wasn't even that bad of a fog. I wouldn't have sailed it without radar, but you could still see 300 to 500 yards. You would have to be a blind idiot to hit the bridge. Have you noticed that it is still sitting there, fully loaded, no containment around it last I looked.
 
#25 ·
G126

Sorry about your boat. Yes, there should be a better infrastructure in place to cope with such events. I hope you feel better after the rant.

However, in your rant, are you saying that this is the fault of Cheney? Come on. You point out the short comings of practices of Masters and Pilots in local waters. Must have somehow been Don Rumsfeld’s fault be cause he was in charge of the CG? Why was the ship allowed to leave? Can the harbor Master stop traffic or does that come from the Office of the Vice President?

About New Orleans, what disgusts you? The problem in the situation in New Orleans was primarily the fault of the lack of proper response from the local and state government. Evacuation is a local responsibility. School buses that could have moved people sat and flooded. Louisiana is the most corrupt state in the country. Back when we had an independent US oil business, I worked in it. The standing joke was “it is good that La was not a foreign country as we would be subject to the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act doing business there.” The legacy of Huey Long and Edwin Edwards live on in William Jefferson and many others.

The problems of prevention with more substantial sea walls go back many years over many administrations.

Same with energy independence. Many years of neglect on both sides. We need a balanced program that includes drilling in Alaska. Florida and costal California, nuclear power and development of alternative power sources as well as conservation. (BTW, Texas (home of Halliburton) passed California in wind power generation this year.)

I do hope you feel better and the bay is back to somewhat normal soon. I was sailing there last month and loved it. Big change from my usual lake meanderings.

Oh, I case you have not noticed, not much news is coming in from Iraq these days. Hard to report on a lack of violence?
 
#34 ·
However, in your rant, are you saying that this is the fault of Cheney?
it makes as much sense to blame Dick Cheney as it does to believe anything else. (g)
Now it's conservatives fault that an oil tanker hit the bridge...
Gotta go with camaraderie and a couple of the others on this on, Geary. While I agree with many of your points, I hardly see what they have to do with what will in all likelihood turn out to have been a screw-up.
Jeezus kee-rhyst! Are you people illiterate? Sombody post a quote where Geary126 actually blames Evil Dick (or anybody from the conservative side of things) for the SF oil spill. You can't. Why? Because it never happened!
 
#26 ·
I failed to log in and thus wasted a post on the subject of large vessel navigation in restricted waters. I share geary's disappointment in the events transpired. I would encourage him to await the issueance of the NTSB report on the events. We do not know at all what transpired. We will know when the NTSB issues the authoritative report.

In brief, since i lost the long version, your knowledge of GPS and radar use appears to be limited. Be assured that the pilot's and the Master's was not. GPS is wholly inappropriate for navigation in such circumstances while radar is an excellent and indispensable tool to the mariner.

Consider the fact that there are any number of factors, all of which might be out of direct control of the pilot or master that could have resulted in this allision. and once something the approximate size of the Trans-America building experiences one of those things the end result of it contacting an immovable object is going to be considerable. if I get the energy and the point continues to need addressing I'll describe what may be necessary to pilot a large ship through SF Bay, having done it a few times myself. (g)

Until the NTSB actually issues it's report nothing truly definitive will be known and so it makes as much sense to blame Dick Cheney as it does to believe anything else. (g)
 
#28 ·
well said Geary. :)
 
#29 ·
Lordy Dog! What part of what geary said was well said? The political rant or the marine navigation portion?

k1vsk,
I was inarticulately asking for what measures regarding prevention that you seemed to feel were lacking funding or effort. Did I misunderstand you?
 
#30 · (Edited)
What the hell are you guys arguing about? Accountability, funding, birds???? What gives? This was obvious human error, just plain and simple. Several people all doing anything but what they were supposed to be doing all at the same time. No money, training, electronics, or administration is going to fix that. End of story.
 
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