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?bigger boat

6K views 31 replies 13 participants last post by  JohnRPollard 
#1 ·
I'm wondering if anyone has any input on my dilemma. We have a Cal 22, nice daysailer but really not big enough for me, my wife and two small children to spend a day cruising on or overnite. We're thinking about going up to 30' in an older catalina/pearson/? until I came across sailtime. A nice alternative but still seems to be alot more expensive than buying an older boat that's in good shape. We didn't get out alot last year but as our kids get older are hoping to get out at least once a week. thoughts?
 
#2 ·
Pearsons and Catalinas are excellent family cruisers that will really let you enjoy and use your boat a lot more with the family. If you can afford the slip fees and maintenance of a larger boat...it is the way to go. Lots to choose from on the market...hunt for a good one!
 
#3 ·
Loualfr,

I have to be honest with you, I don't know for sure what "sailtime" is. But if it's one of those timeshare boat club arrangements, I have to say I'm not particularly keen on them for family sailing. At one point we considered similar offerings in our area, but after reflecting how we use our boat we realized it wouldn't be a good fit for us.

As you know, when sailing with kids there are a lot of concessions that have to be made with respect to safety and comfort. We concluded that we needed to be able to set-up our boat in whatever way we deemed fit to accommodate our kids, including safety features and gear (toys, games, dinghies, kayaks, etc). We wouldn't have been able to do that in a time-share arrangement, or if we could have it would have meant schlepping heaps of stuff back and forth for each sail. Equals= not much sailing.

Just something to think about.
 
#15 ·
Loualfr,

I have to be honest with you, I don't know for sure what "sailtime" is. But if it's one of those timeshare boat club arrangements, I have to say I'm not particularly keen on them for family sailing. At one point we considered similar offerings in our area, but after reflecting how we use our boat we realized it wouldn't be a good fit for us.

As you know, when sailing with kids there are a lot of concessions that have to be made with respect to safety and comfort. We concluded that we needed to be able to set-up our boat in whatever way we deemed fit to accommodate our kids, including safety features and gear (toys, games, dinghies, kayaks, etc). We wouldn't have been able to do that in a time-share arrangement, or if we could have it would have meant schlepping heaps of stuff back and forth for each sail. Equals= not much sailing.

Just something to think about.
Good point John, the other thing I have seen with time share, is that people go out when they shouldn't be.
I see it all the time. A group or family comes down to the boat. Its blowing like stink and the lake is a nasty mess, but it's thier time to be on the water and the next time they are scheduled to have the boat could be weeks away. So, they go out when the prudent boater is probably going to sit it out in the harbor.
With the time share, your going to use the boat no matter what, not always the safest decision.
 
#4 · (Edited)
I recently had an older Hunter 25.5 which I loved and moved up to a 321 Beneteau Oceanis. I also am married with 2 small children. For me and my family it the perfect sized boat. It allows me to take the family and still sail alone with out being to big, docking that is. She's 9700 lbs. If you plan on sailing solo at all I wouldn't go much larger. I find this to be at the end of my comfort level when docking in most conditions alone. You may think different.
Catalina Pearson Morgan all good choices. I also like a diesel your Cal 22 had a kicker I'm sure one more thing to consider. PEACE good Luck
 
#5 ·
I had a 23' boat trailerable until I retired from the Army. Almost every brand of boat has fans and hecklers. I own a Hunter because I have always liked the product Hunter offers.

Slip fees seem to be an issue almost everywhere. Here in New Jersey the local yacht clubs are less than one seventh of the cost of the marinas. They offer wonderful people who use the boats they own and willingly help launch, recover, teach and assist members of the club.

I have found you can reduce the cost of boat ownership significantly by doing your own work, learning new skills (diesel maint. course for example) and trading your skills for the services you need (woodwork for welding, ect.)

That said...there is no substitute for having your significant other, and your children, together and away from all the other distractions of home. When I compare the costs against the memories...I have money to spare.
 
#6 ·
Loualfr - I'm married with three children ages 10 and under. We've considered Sailtime in the past but note that, in addition to the concerns identified by JohnRPollard, synching up appropriate sailing weather for my wife and kids with scheduled time on the boat is often a challenge. If there is a nice day with 15 kts of breeze, we want to get out there (with kids). That may not be a scheduled day with Sailtime. The flip side is that you may find that on your scheduled day with Sailtime it is blowing 30 kts with 8 to 10' seas. Less than ideal for three kids.

We sail a Beneteau First 265. We bought it used 3 years ago and have been happy with it for its intended purpose. It has a diesel and modest accomodations. We've done weekends aboard without complaints as to size and space. I don't think you need too large of boat to accomplish your goals and, as such, believe you're on the right track thinking about a well-maintained but used catalina/pearson in the 30' range. I suspect that with the right boat, your full year's cost of ownership will be less than the $5,000/season they get around my area for a Sailtime share.
 
#16 ·
Loualfr - I'm married with three children ages 10 and under. We've considered Sailtime in the past but note that, in addition to the concerns identified by JohnRPollard, synching up appropriate sailing weather for my wife and kids with scheduled time on the boat is often a challenge. If there is a nice day with 15 kts of breeze, we want to get out there (with kids). That may not be a scheduled day with Sailtime. The flip side is that you may find that on your scheduled day with Sailtime it is blowing 30 kts with 8 to 10' seas. Less than ideal for three kids.
See, my point exactly.
An expert in the area of sailtime who agrees with me.
This has got to be a first.
 
#7 ·
You might want to look at Cat 27's as well especially if you can find one of the ones with a larger beam...I was kinda amazed at the amount of room a 1990 Cat 27 has versus my 1980 one....and may give you a break versus going 30 and accomplish everything you want....Don't to the timeshare thing...it is like leasing a car versus purchasing but without the tax incentives / breaks (in some scenarios)....there will be so many restrictions and naturally any damage is out of your pocket in most cases at higher than norm rates....
 
#8 ·
Cruising with your family can be a wonderful experience for you all. Our family of four upgraded to a Catalina 30 from a Catalina 22, and that really opened the possibilities for us.

We had a hard time spending weekends on the C22, but we're good for over a week on the C30.

One way I justified the added expense was that we consider sailing our vacation, instead of taking a big trip somewhere. We spent a total of almost three weeks on the boat last year, which more than justifies the expense, I keep telling myself.

This month's Practical Sailor has an article on the sort of boat you are looking for, featuring the Catalina 30, Pearson 30, and Tartan 30. You can get a lot of boat for the money.

One thing also to keep in mind is that an older boat won't depreciate much more...

Your family will grow up fast! Get the boat if you can!
 
#12 ·
Cam - No it's not. It's the best boat for most things.

Practical Sailor is doing a review of 30ish boats from the 70's, all the ones mentioned here are in there. If you don't subscribe - get it (february and March) it's a two parter and they do 6 boats per month.

Pearson and Catalina are in Feb's - and like most boats they are all compromises ( the compromise on my boat is I have to put up with halfboats saying my boat isn't a boat).

My buddy had a Catalina 22, I learned to sail on it; then I went to Hunter31 while he went to a Catalina 30 (both 1986's). Personally, for my tastes, sailing area, uses - Hunter31 kicked the Catalina to the road side in all important aspects.
 
#13 ·
What's your budget? I've shopped the $10k-$15k 25'-30' segment a bit over the last couple of years. My favorites in that category for two adults and two kids for cruising are: Catalina 27, Sabre 28, Islander 28.

For whatever reason, it seems 30' or more gives a substantial price jump for intial costs, slip fees, upkeep, upgrades, etc. The 27/28 footers I mentioned above seem to have very similar layouts to their ~30' counterparts.
 
#14 ·
Looks like the folks on Sailnet are ready to help... We could help you determine a realistic budget for your adventure and guide you in a general direction.

Some further information from you would be helpful:

1) Where are you planning on sailing?
2) How old are your children?
3) What are your repair/maintenance skills? (Electrical, Engines, General Mechanical)
4) What is your approximate budget?
 
#19 ·
thanks for all the replies, was what I was thinking overall. my kids are 3 year old twins, dtr is much more adventurous than my son right now. I really want to get them used to the boat and water. The cal is a fun boat but very tender, we keep it in a mooring and do mostly river daysailing. I'd like to get into something we can cruise for a day, something with a head on it and also I'd like both my wife and myself to get used to handling a larger boat. I think I'll start looking for a Catalina 30 or slightly smaller Pearson or Hunter. I'm partial to the Tartan's/Pearsons/ Sabres but seems like the Catalina might be more kid friendly and more for the money. does not appear that the increase in cost for mooring fee and maintenance is as much as the fee for sailtime.
 
#23 ·
I had a Catalina 250 before upgrading to a Catalina 310. Catalina has pulled the line to concentrate on the 309. From what I've seen, the 309 is a good overall replacement for the Catalina 30 and 310 - something to consider. Decent price, good systems, and enough room above and below for four people to tolerate each other for a weekend.
 
#24 ·
I have two kids 2yrs and 8 yrs, and the Catalina 30 has been great because it has a lot of space for a 30 and has been easy to sail. We went from a 25' to a 30' and have not regretted it. While it is not a high performance boat, I can singlehand with little difficulty and the family has a lot of fun on it.
 
#25 ·
A Catalina or Pearson 30 is a good boat for what you want to do. I wouldn't go with fractional ownership myself, since it really leaves you at the mercy of the other owners...who may or may not trash the boat when they use it. Also, on a fractionally owned boat, you can't leave things on the boat, so you're prep time to go sailing is a lot greater... instead of being able to hop on the boat and go out for an afternoon sail, you might have to spend an hour getting the boat ready to go, and then only get in an evening sail. Also, you might not be able to schedule the boat for the days you want, since the other owners may well want those days as well. Holiday weekends, like the Fourth of July would be particularly difficult. Owning your own boat, even if it is an older one, makes far more sense, especially since you also have to fit the kids schedules into the sailing.
 
#26 ·
If I had to choose a boat in this size and price range I would strongly recommend the Tartan 30 over your other choices. The Tartan 30 was far better built, came far better equipped as standard, and was a far superior sailing boat in all conditions as compared to Pearsons, Catalinas etc being surggested.

I also want to echo the suggestion that if you can afford it, you will probably come out way ahead in the long run buying a boat vs timeshare. Time share really only works well for people with very limited time to sail and who do not want the responsibilities of maintenance and ownership. To this day, I truly value the time that I shared growing up with my family sailing on my family's boat, and time working beside my Dad maintaining the family boats. The days spent together on the boat forged a strong bond; a bond that held through my teenage years and has held to this day 46 years after we began sailing.

Good luck,
Jeff
 
#29 ·
If I had to choose a boat in this size and price range I would strongly recommend the Tartan 30 over your other choices. The Tartan 30 was far better built, came far better equipped as standard, and was a far superior sailing boat in all conditions as compared to Pearsons, Catalinas etc being surggested.
I also like those Tartan 30s. As I recall, there is more than one interior layout, and one in particular that I think would be very family friendly. It's the one with the port and starboard quarter-berths. It's nice to push the kids out to the corners of the boat in their own bunks, leaving the main salon open for adults after bed time. Our boat has a nice interior layout, but with three kids at least one of them ends up bunking on one of the settees in the main salon, which relegates the adults to the cockpit after bedtime.
 
#27 ·
OP has twins.........hmmmmm........I'm sorry, it does get easier as they get older! Just remember twins are two time the work, and four times the fun. Even when 9 months old, both have the trots, and you go thru 500+ diapers that week!

There are MANY boats in the 28-32' range, that cn be had for $15-25K and will work well. Ericson, Islander, jeanneaus,Benateaus, Hunters, Catilinas, Cal, Pearson, J boat, san juan,........list can go on and on. It will depend on ho well they are kept up, "ran hard, put away wet!" ie raced, vs cruised/day sailed. I found an older 85 Jeanneau Arcadia, 30' long, original owner, well taken care of overall. I have done a bunch of up grading, but overall, a fairly roomy boat for being a small 30' boat. Along with being reasonably fast for her size. I ws not looking initially at Jenneau's, but saw one locally on the local yachtworld equal, looked at her, spouse fell in love, boat was ours a few weeks later.

So now I have a weekend project if you will, while she plays in the yard, and we both take afternoons to sail and race, my mostly with my 19 yr old daughter, and 21 yr old twin sons, along with tenuki upon occason. Still trying to get 15 yr old daughter out there. Enjoy your time with the kids, they do grow up fast!

marty
 
#31 ·
David,

Boats with three bedrooms/cabins if you will, can be had in as small as 32-33' depending upon the brand. 35' is a shoe in for a 3 cabin in most brands. With two kids, and parents, a 2 cabin will work fine for OP's needs. Those of use with 3 or 4 in my case, a triple cabin is nicer. Altho with 3 oer 18.........not that big a deal!

Not sure if anyone mentioned the older C&C's. a reasonable fast and well built boat too.

Marty
 
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