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What do YOU look for

7K views 41 replies 22 participants last post by  cardiacpaul 
#1 ·
I'm gonna take another stab at lookin' at a boat. This time The Admiral is going to join me.:) This one is a later model Pearson 36 that's been on the hard all winter.

I would like to know what YOU look for when viewing a boat for the first time. Comments and suggestions greatly appreciated!

First thing that I will check out is what the broker described as "some water leakage around the stanchions.":eek: This scares me, but assuming that that is OK, what else would you look for?

I intend to get a surveyor to go over this professionally, and more thouroughly, but I want to figure out if this is worth his time (and my money) before I engage one. (Right CP:) ) Also I assume that the sails and all lines will be stowed for the winter, so I will have the surveyor check them out if it goes that far.

Here is my current checklist:
  • Bottom Paint: (New / Smooth < > Old / Flaking off)
  • Topsides: (Smooth / Clean < > Crazed / Dirty)
  • Deck: (Solid / no soft spots / good nonskid)
  • Stanchions and Lifelines (New < Frayed Rusting)
  • Rigging (New < > Frayed Rusting)
  • Chainplates (Clean / Solid < > Rusting / Loose)
  • Dodger (Custom < > Mail Order)
  • Traveller (Condition and ease of use)
  • Bilge: (Clean / Dry < > Gross / Wet)
  • Batteries: Age and Brand
  • Through Hulls: Material (Bronze / Stainless / Marelon / Brass) Flanged or not)
  • Ground Tackle: Size and type of Anchor and Chain
  • Holding Tank and Waste Plumbing: Condition? Discharge valve?
  • General condition of interior: (Clean / Dry < > Gross / Wet)
  • Woodwork condition:
  • Galley - The Admiral will be the harshest critic here
  • Electronics - Based on a conversation with the broker I am not banking on anything being there, and will factor this into any offer.

What am I forgetting?

Thanks!!!

Ed
 
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#5 ·
eherlihy,

Not specific to what you should look at (although leaking stanchions would be a red flag:( ), but if you decide to purchase this boat, it might be worthwhile to let the owner re-commission it. Yes, take a good look at it while it's out of the water, but let the owner do the work to get it back in sailing trim. Otherwise you are stuck having to get the act together before you even can do a sea-trial.

Others may disagree with this advice, but having been "stuck" with the commissioning work myself (including shoveling snow of the deck so we could launch for sea-trial), I would not do it again. You pay for the survey and launching for sea-trial, but the owner should present the boat ready to show and trial. If he/she is an absentee and can't do this for whatever reason, take your hassle off the price of the boat.
 
#8 ·
eherlihy,

... but if you decide to purchase this boat, it might be worthwhile to let the owner re-commission it. Yes, take a good look at it while it's out of the water, but let the owner do the work to get it back in sailing trim. Otherwise you are stuck having to get the act together before you even can do a sea-trial.
ABSOLUTELY! Any offer that I make would be contingent on the boat being relaunched, and passing a sea trial with a genuine surveyor.

As for the engine:eek: Yup, I plan to check both the engine and transmission oil, and the belts, and look for a spare impeller.

Also, I will give an overall look at the interior plumbing for cracked / broken hoses, and to see that there is antifreeze in the system.

Thanks already!
 
#10 · (Edited)
I think the first thing would be the lines. think to yourself. what what you think of someone who pulled into port on it? what would be your first thought? ...
I gotta say that I drive a station wagon (Mfr calls it an "Avant"), because I like station wagons... Practical yet sporty... IMHO, One of the best looking cars EVER was the Volvo P1800 ES.

Pearsons have been called the "chevy" of sailboats. Practical, yet sporty. I have to say that I like the lines of them Pearsons.
 
#7 ·
I hear you blt2ski.....but to me.....the galley means food!....Eats...Groceries!...I can do without a smooth bottom, a solid deck, a dry bilge and some electronics........but food..........No can negotiate..........Gotta Eat!
my Admiral will be absent so I'm also Chief Cook and Bottle Washer........the Galley is, to me, second only to a sound hull.....
 
#9 ·
also, look at the maintenance log---you can tell a lot by how well someone keeps records--generally, a well kept log is a good indication of a well kept boat--
 
#11 ·
buckeye,

I am swag'ing, you would put the galley issue further up the list he made? I was pointing out it was on the list, granted 2nd from bottom. Not sure if OP's list was in order of preference or not...........hence probably both of our points being off base to a degree.

I am glad OP likes the pearsons, personally, their look etc does nothing for me, hence why I add in "Ambiance" etc to the boat being looked at. Altho, the folks that do own Pearson's, "like them" In the end, that is what matters! Not what I like or someone else likes!:D:D:D:D

Marty
 
#12 · (Edited)
Not sure if OP's list was in order of preference or not...........
These were not arranged in order of priority, but in the likeley order of inspection... ie. Start outside and work your way inside... although in that case, I should have moved the Anchor/Chain further up the list...
:eek:
 
#13 ·
A leaky deck is a huge red flag, because it might involve balsa coring, rotten knees or rotted stringers if it's frozen and thawed in the bottom of the boat for a few years.

These things can be remedied, but it takes commitment, expertise and some skill. Also, might as well shave your head, because epoxy with stick in your hair otherwise.

Anyway, let's assume by some miracle the boat passes survey. Lots of boats do. So what? What is more important (particularly given that boats are coming down in price) is what you intend to do with it (daysail, coastal cruising, gunkholing, club racing) and how (do you intend on spending many nights aboard? Do you intend to do longer passages?)

Just as the type of software you use should dictate your choice of computer and operating system (most people are GROSSLY "overpowered" for browsing, mail and word processing), so should the type of sailing lifestyle dictate your boat choice.

A Pearson 36 is about as middle of the road a chunk of classic plastic as I can imagine. Next to 1980s Catalinas, it's about as close to average in all respects as I can imagine. It's not a racer, but it's not a slug. It's not roomy, nor is it cramped. You get the picture.

On the other hand, it is unlikely to surprise you with bad habits, nor will casual weekends on it be anything but a hoot, as it is well equipped, as are the vast majority of production boats, for coastal hops.

So decide if you want that...and if you do, that's great. Because trying to turn it into an ocean crosser, a racer or a liveaboard would lead to a lot of frustration. That's not what boats of this type were designed to do. They were designed to be messed about in.
 
#14 ·
I'd also check the condition of the interior of the lockers and such. Often, the outer areas are "cleaned up" for sale, but the nooks and crannies will tell you what the real condition of the boat normally was.
 
#22 ·
Great stuff!



'Dog - that is a GREAT suggestion!:cool: And, if The Admiral is impressed, will hire a surveyor for round 2.

Val - yes, a leaky deck is a red flag (meaning "stop") to me too, but I have only talked to the broker once about this, and we all know about brokers... Specificaly, I plan to inspect around the stancions on the deck, looking for crazing around them, step around them, to tap around with a plastic hammer, and then (even though it's on stands) to jump on the deck looking for flex. Also I am very familliar with the sailing characteristics of, and room on this model Pearson.

Ahab - The magnum is a yet-to-be classic. Too bad that Chrysler stopped producing them this year. If you are into car collecting, I'd advise taking good care of it.

Tejas - great book reccomendations, but inspection is set for this weekend. I can't read that fast.

TB - you're just lookin for trouble from 'Dog, aren't you... IIRC, 0 < 1 yes?:D

Thanks to all!

-Ed
 
#15 ·
Another thing too - run your bare fingers across whatever you can. If a boat is being shown then problem areas will be quickly addressed prior to you getting there if they are not establishing the issues prior to.

I always ask the broker / seller - What are the known issues and what is the history of the boat - they tell alot about you can expect...

. Running your fingers around seals, in exposed areas where you know their can be water ingress - moisture is still left and there is sometimes more that you can tell....Stomping on the deck and going below and seeing rust dust under areas - etc... all can be indicators... In other words inspect like you were doing a white glove inspection of a military barracks.

No one is gonna slow you down, and the extra attention to actually find everything you can - is simply mere prudence and a negotiation leverage you will have establishing a price before having the surveyors input...
 
#16 ·
I start on the inside. Look at the inner skin of the hull - everywhere. Look for stains, repairs, differences in colour, cracks, rust, etc. Look in the sump. Look under everything. Lift the sole, the cushions, the battery boxes if possible. Then look at the exterior.

If you find things that worry you, but you like the boat, then spend some time finding out about the construction. For instance, if you have leaky stanchions, and if the bolts are not going through any core material, it's no big deal. Stanchions need to be sealed and fastened periodically, and if they aren't, they will start to leak. If they are bolted on through the deck core however, and if the leak has been there for a while, there could be extensive damage...
 
#17 ·
Basically, your inspection of the boat is really just to see if the boat is worth even making an offer on and still should have a full-survey done.
 
#18 · (Edited)
1800 Es

Hi, off topic but I had a 73 1800ES and it was silver laquer painted with black leather and grey carpetted. What a classic machine. I drive a silver Magnum just to have a car that gives me the same feel behind the wheel. But, to get back to buying a new boat. I bought a 83 24 C@C inthe late fall in the water and found the windows leak. So, check them, too as these were screwed on as an afterthought without any aluminum trim and a ***** to reseal. Good luck.
 
#19 ·
Keep in mind also that it is VERY difficult, if not impossible, to find a good surveyor that will really go over a boat. If you don't do it yourself, it ain't going to get done. Bring along a couple of knowledgable friends and a little hammer (to check for delamination) and go at it.
 
#25 ·
I'm just waiting for this to come and bite TB on his A$$.. I can see it happening... his wife hates sailboats because they heel, and she's going to want to buy a catamaran... then what is TB gonna say. :) :) :) :D
 
#23 · (Edited)
The bast advice I can give is that you NEED to buy your own moisture meter AND learn how to use one correctly..

Holland Marine Products out of Canada sells this moisture meter:



For $199.00!! Trust me it will pay for itself the FIRST time you use it. Getting a surveyor out to a boat will cost you a minimum of about $400.00 $600.00 to tell you the thing has decks like sponges that you can;t feel.

With your own moisture meter, and some studying, about proper use, you can eliminate ten boats a day until you find one with dry decks, that you like, and are then willing to commit to a survey on..

Click on the words Holland Marine Products above then scroll down the main page a bit to see the moisture meter..

You can be penny wise and not buy one but TRUST me it will pay for itself during the first use if used properly. I think every boat buyer looking at 30+ foot boats should own one and take the time to learn how to properly use one. Don Casey's book on surveying is also a MUST..

My personal feeling is that if every boat buyer had a moisture meter brokers would smarten up and be a LOT more honest!!! Many brokers have moisture meters and do check decks before listing a boat but then WON'T admit any problems and force you to hire a surveyor $$$$ to find out for yourself.. It's like they are in coo hoots together..

The savvy boat purchaser always comes prepared and owning a moisture meter is the number one thing you can do other than reading and studying books on boat surveying and construction ...

The Pearson 36 is a great boat but not immune to the perils of age..

You did forget one thing though; electrical and wiring (condition, gauge, corrosion, terminations etc.)
 
#36 · (Edited)
Halekai was RIGHT

The bast advice I can give is that you NEED to buy your own moisture meter AND learn how to use one correctly....Getting a surveyor out to a boat will cost you a minimum of about $400.00 $600.00 to tell you the thing has decks like sponges that you can;t feel.

With your own moisture meter, and some studying, about proper use, you can eliminate ten boats a day until you find one with dry decks, that you like, and are then willing to commit to a survey on..
As it turns out the BROKER brought this model Moisture meter with him, and showed me how to use it. All I can say is WOW were you right!
At one time, I actually considered buying one of these. However, I am not a surveyor, nor do I have any experience using one. So, the cost of buying one did not seem to be worth it to me. Then I wondered how they worked, so I started researching them a little. I found two great article about the limitations of them here and here. My research led me to believe that unless I was using it ALL THE TIME, it would likeley be a lightweight "doorstop" (reference to the second link) in my hands.
What bone head said that? (Oh, it was me:eek: )

Here is the image that caught my attention:


As I was poking around this spot, rather suspiciously, the broker showed up with the moisture meter, showed me how to use it, and started checking the deck for me. The moistrure meter worked similarly to the way that a stud finder works. You put it on a likely good portion of the deck, and slide it around to investigate other sections. The needle swings right to indicate moisture present.

Here he is checking the deck:

(Yes, that really is the broker!:cool: ) Note the needle is way right... The area highlighted in yellow showed a lot of water on the meter. In essence it penetrated at the front starboard stanchon, and worked it's way back along the toe rail, to the starboard gate. There was water intrusion on the port side as well.

Needless to say this looks like a project that I do not want to finance.

Thanks Halekai for great advice.

Ed
 
#24 ·
Aaahhh, the Moisture meter...

At one time, I actually considered buying one of these. However, I am not a surveyor, nor do I have any experience using one. So, the cost of buying one did not seem to be worth it to me. Then I wondered how they worked, so I started researching them a little. I found two great article about the limitations of them here and here. My research led me to believe that unless I was using it ALL THE TIME, it would likeley be a lightweight "doorstop" (reference to the second link) in my hands.

I believe that a better inspection for moisture is to use infrared imaging. There is a good site, showing some great images of an infrared camera used in conjunction with a moisture meter, from a surveyor that uses this technique here. When (if) I contact a surveyor, this will be something that I will look for.
 
#27 ·
Ergonomics should be on the list, too.

If the cockpit isn't comfortable or you won't be able to sleep in the berths, there's no need to worry about the moisture meter. If the dodger is exactly at eye level, there will be a cost involved even if it's new and custom.

With everything else that's on the list to check out, it could be easy to forget to climb into the berth or stretch out in the cockpit or imagine steering for a long time. Think about what fit you and your wife, and what didn't fit on OPBs.
 
#28 ·
WR's got a good point... if you can't lie down in the berths... you shouldn't even consider the boat...
 
#29 ·
Good suggestions..

I did not see any mention of electrical wiring (sorry if I missed it..)
Before turning anything on, (AC unplugged..) I would open up the back of the panel(s) and check for general condition.. neat and tidy? or a rats nest? indicating the owner's creativity in electricity 101.. Assuming that is in good condition, I would turn on both DC and AC if possible and go through all the lights, plugs, radios, water pressure, Refrg. etc...

As a side note .. After I bought my Caliber, I realized my very well known, highly recommended surveyor in Annapolis missed the 4 extension cords black-taped together to power the water pump..

Good Luck
 
#30 ·
Thanks guys,

As I said earlier in this thread, my wife and I are familliar with this model Pearson.

Also Jody makes a good point too. Feel all the seals.

My wife will do the white glove test(believe me!):rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
#31 ·
The 'ooooo' factor. Does she 'wow' you or not. All the positive attributes in the world won't matter if you don't think she's 'pretty' - however you measure that.
 
#32 ·
My Checklist

Hello,

When I was in the market I would bring this list and fill it out:

Sailboat Checklist:

Date: Location: Broker:
Boat:

Hull condition _____ Nicks, gouges, holes, blisters, bottom paint

Keel
depth and configuration (fin / wing / centerboard)
Condition

Deck / Sail handing

Main sheet end boom / Companionway / Cabintop
Winches: Number ____ Self tailing Y / N
Lines led aft? Y / N
Steering Wheel / Tiller Autopilot Y / N Rudder Condition
Gauges Compass depth Wind Speed Wind Direction

Sails
Main Year ___ Condition
Reefing / Furling
Roller Furling Y / N
Head Year ___ Size ___ Condition
Head Year ___ Size ___ Condition
Head Year ___ Size ___ Condition

Engine
Fuel G / D FWC / RWC HP __ Appearance
Prop 2 / 3 / folding

Interior
Clean Y / N Leaks Y / N Cushions OK Y / N
Sole
Berth # and Config

Galley
Stove Fuel A / P Pressure water Y / N Hot water Y / N Type:

Head
Shower Y / N Drain Y / N Hot water Y / N

Extras / Misc. / Overall

==

After you look at 3-4 boats it's east to forget them. Take a digital camera and take lots of pics. Then, when you are at home, you can review the pictures and the notes.

Good luck,
Barry
 
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