|Topic Review (Newest First)|
|09-06-2008 02:51 AM|
I have read in more than one "how to sail around the universe" style book that using a length of 3/32" TIG welding wire, or tapping the hole and screwing in a small machine screw are superior to cotter pins or rings. I haven't tried either of these methods yet.... I have been using a mix if cotter or split rings. It depends on whatever seems to fit the hole "best." The shroud turnbuckles always end up getting a dose if rigging tape, which isn't applied directly to any of the stainless parts so it shouldn't be a problem.
In any event, rings, cotter pins, TIG wire or even nothing at all is superior to those jam-nuts I see every now and then. What a bad idea that was!
|09-05-2008 11:40 PM|
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
I still don't feel comfortable with them on the clevis pins after that Pearson experience and BTW the pin was the right size for the hole. As I said I suspect a slack rig under downwind loads and too long of a pin were also contributing factors...
|09-05-2008 09:16 PM|
|sailaway21||John Rousmaniere has also advocated the use of cotter pins over ring-dings elsewhere on sailnet as well. He was not expansive on his reasoning other than he'd had ring-dings fail in some way.|
|09-03-2008 10:31 PM|
Originally Posted by SEMIJim View Post
There are some people, my partner being one of them, who run their rigs so loose that they actually have slack.
He claims that he is able to fine tune the rig while racing. I can't argue with his results because he usually wins. However, it's not a tactic that I would recommend to any of my customers.
In my opinion, your standing rigging should never, under normal conditions, be allowed to slacken to to point that your clevis pins move around freely.
There is a certain amount of movement on a headstay, but with the use of toggles for articulation, your clevis pins should never, under normal conditions, move around in it's hole.
Having a key ring work it's way off is really not the same thing as your standing rigging.
Still, as I showed in the picture, I use circular rings to lock the turnbuckle and a straight cotter pin for the clevis.
|09-03-2008 10:16 PM|
Originally Posted by halekai36 View Post
This thread does remind me of an incident this spring. We were stepping the mast when one of our lower shroud's clevis pins fell out of its fork, bounced off the deck and *plonk* - into the drink it went. They all had had ringdings on them. So that's another case I've seen personally of ringdings working themselves off hardware. Related: Twice I've had a split ring on my keys manage to work itself off.
I think next time we're out at the boat I'm going to throw a bit of tape around all the ringdings.
|09-03-2008 09:59 PM|
Originally Posted by lsusailing View Post
Not too long ago, one of my customers lost his rig during a race.
It was determined that a cotter pin was lost, allowing one of the upper shrouds to detach itself from the chainplate.
There was some intimation that perhaps the cotter pin hadn't been opened enough. I was concerned because I was the last rigger to do any real work on the boat.
The thing was though, the boat was raced regularly and I had done the re-rig over 11 months prior to the accident.
I don't know how many people inspect their clevis pins and cotter pins everytime they sail but If you are racing, then you sure better check it once in a while. Heck, thats what all those deck monkeys should be doing as you motor out to the start.
BTW, If a pin had fallen out aloft, I probably would have replaced that rig at my expense. But there is no excuse for not inspecting one's chain plates and turnbuckles before racing.
I will reiterate. You can find circular pins as stout, (thick), as you would ever desire. Maybe not at your local WM. But like I said SailNet certainly can get you rings as strong as you want.
Check out the CSJ online catalog.
|09-03-2008 08:32 PM|
Simple post and 13 really good responses, that what makes SN, and its members, special.
Halekai brought up a good point, it appears that most cotter rings I have seen are very thin and are not robust enough to handle the clevis pin hole. Never thought about it before but sizing is critical.
Sounds like if the cotter is off good quality, the right size, and inspected each time you sail, then it minimizes the chances of failure. Rings are easier to handle but it seems that regular pins are more robust.
Thanks for the info...........
|09-03-2008 08:29 PM|
|camaraderie||Thanks Knotty...nice to know I wasn't completely crazy...at least I have company!|
|09-03-2008 07:54 PM|
Originally Posted by halekai36 View Post
However, I have been using circular pins for many years and have never had anything happen that could be remotely attributed to a properly used circular pin.
I come across clevis pins now and then with holes so small that you need a tiny little cotter pin. I toss em.
I like a heavy duty pin or ring but not a tight one. I install stuff with the thought in mind that I am going to be the one having to take it apart again.
The problem with close tolerances with cotter pins is that sometimes it's a real pain to get them straight enough to remove. I've even had them gall and ruin clevis pins.
C. Sherman Johnson, (csjohnson . com), has just about every conceivable clevis pin, cotter pin or circular pin that you would likely ever have a need for.
And I bet SailNet is still a dealer for them.
This is pretty much how I always pin a turnbuckle.
The three circular pins on the right in the picture below are pretty much all I have ever had a need for. They are from smallest to largest the CSJ R-2, R-3, and R-5. The R-5 is so stout that it's tough to open with a thumb nail. I usually have to use my Leatherman to get it over the body of the turnbuckle.
The one on the left has a little pig-tail. Which in my opinion kinda defeats the purpose if you are looking for something that won't snag. I won't use those. However many products such as blocks come with them new. I don't usually remove them.
I also agree that it is not smart to reuse a deformed pin, straight or circular.
|09-03-2008 02:57 PM|
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