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Second Thoughts

4K views 25 replies 20 participants last post by  Stillraining 
#1 ·
Hello Sailnetters,

Well the boat arrived at my shop today. I spent the afternoon trying to clean the interior and after several hours and a sore back I arrived at the conclusion that sailing may not be my bag. Not to mention this boat is in worse shape than I thought. In case some of you didn't catch my introduction post, I inherited a 27' Catalina a few months ago. It had been on the hard for 8 years. My Uncle had been in bad health for several years and the vessel seems to have suffered worse than he. After further inspection I found that quite a few things are missing. I did find the sails, however they were stored where the engine is supposed to be. I'm already in a $1000 cash with back storage and getting it hauled over here and frankly all I see is thousands and thousands of dollars worth of hard work ahead. Fact is, I'm kinda lazy and quite poor compared to some of you.

Second Thoughts? I'm having quite a few. The dream of sipping a cocktail in the cockpit during a breathtaking sunset somewhere in the Bahamas looks pretty far out of reach.
 
#2 ·
If you are already in it for a grand you need a handy friend who wants to sail with you. Take your time & look for off season bargains on parts. You will be surprised how rewarding it to work on your own boat. It is normal to get buyer’s remorse. Imagine all the babes’ who will want to sail on your yacht! Good Luck...
Ron
 
#3 ·
donate to charity and take a tax deduction. Otherwise, spend a few hundred and get a proper marine survey done. Then you'll know what you're truly looking at for repairs. Just remember: the upgrades never cease!!!
 
#4 ·
Hello Sailnetters,

Well the boat arrived at my shop today. I spent the afternoon trying to clean the interior and after several hours and a sore back I arrived at the conclusion that sailing may not be my bag. Not to mention this boat is in worse shape than I thought. In case some of you didn't catch my introduction post, I inherited a 27' Catalina a few months ago. It had been on the hard for 8 years. My Uncle had been in bad health for several years and the vessel seems to have suffered worse than he. After further inspection I found that quite a few things are missing. I did find the sails, however they were stored where the engine is supposed to be. I'm already in a $1000 cash with back storage and getting it hauled over here and frankly all I see is thousands and thousands of dollars worth of hard work ahead. Fact is, I'm kinda lazy and quite poor compared to some of you.
Second Thoughts? I'm having quite a few. The dream of sipping a cocktail in the cockpit during a breathtaking sunset somewhere in the Bahamas looks pretty far out of reach.
I dont know about that Mate..Unless that Airplane your leaning against is bleeding you..;)

Its easy to get overwhelmed if you dont know what your looking at..But if your truly getting a gut check listen to it.

It would help if you posted a few pictures of the old girl for us to gander at and give some better opinions... for what their worth , pictures cant tell the whole story but its a start.
 
#5 ·
I think many of us have felt the same way. The truth is, every older boat presents challenges. Some are worth the effort, others not. Find someone who can help you answer this question first. If the hull and deck are sound, no structural issues, go to work. As the process moves forward, you'll develop a sense of pride and confidence that will make her yours. There are many Cat 27s out there so you can find help, parts, ideas. I'm in year three of my rebuild and have wanted to sink her more times than I can tell you but then I'll have that moment of joy and pride and all is forgiven.

SKywalker
 
#6 ·
I don't know. I tend to be the optimistic and encouraging sort; but in this case I think you already know the answer to your question, and you're just looking for validation.

It's not that you asked the question, because we see this question frequently; but it's the "feel" of how you asked the question.

I think the answer to your question is wrapped up in your reaction to nighteowle's response. If you're willing to throw a couple hundred at finding out what it's really gonna take; then the answer is probably yes, keep the boat because you have a true interest.

If you even think that spending the money on a survey is "throwing good money after bad", then you should cut your losses right now.

At this stage it's less about what you have invested in $; than what you have invested personally/emotionally. If you let it get to the point that your decision is based only on what yo have already invested in $$, then you're paving the road to your own personal boat-hell.

I don't know if I'm being as clear as I wanted to; but I hope I'm making myself understood.

Best of luck whichever way you go ........
 
#7 ·
Take your time, I know it all seems overwhelming at this point. But if you stick with it, it will be very rewarding in the end.

Lots of work lies ahead and your going to have to invest some money and a lot of time into it, but when all is said and done, one day, you will be sailing.

On the other hand, there are lots of boats out there probably in better condition that you could be sailing right now. They will cost you more up front, but not as much time will be needed to be on the water.

Tough choice.
 
#8 ·
Sorry to be blunt.

If you got to the point of even writing this post, you are not cut for sailing.

Donate or sell the boat, then go do your thing, whatever that maybe...painting, hunting, dancing, macrame....

In my country we have a saying:

"God gives acorns to pigs with no teeth"...

You obviously don't know what goes in the mind and soul of someone that really loves sailing and can't have a boat...you just can't imagine what the poor souls that deserve a boat, but can't have one, may think when they read your whining...

Man up, clean refurbish and go sailing and prove me wrong by posting a photo of you sailing, then I'll eat my words....or get rid of it and go do whatever...

Sorry for being blunt, but you deserve it.
 
#9 · (Edited)
dayum, a cat27.. Smack, didcha see that?

ok, engine... any idea what was in it? You should be able to tell by whats "left", fuel tank, etc. Probably an "Atomic-4 gas flathead" available used or rebuildable for less than 2000.00

Is the prop and shaft still there?

i remember a boat boneyard up there in Alabama somewhere, they bought a lot of the Katrina boats, you may be able to find some pieces-parts there.

Cleaning...
invest in a long handled nylon floor brush about 6 to 8" wide. Wander in to your local dollar general and buy some clabber girl scouring powder. lots of it.
Hand the powder to a kid prone to fits, or a chick with MS. (the neuromuscular tremors help distribute the powder)
Wet the deck, strew the stuff all over, and scrub away. About 4 hours of time. For the first layer of crud. It'll cost ya 3.00 for the scrubbing stuff, 4.00 for the brush, 20.00 for the kid, and dinner for the chick.
Inside? throw the cushions outside, put a... oh, 10%... phhhft, live on the edge, 1/2 and 1/2 solution of bleach and water in a bucket, and go nuts with the brush. It ain't that hard. (it'll really put your jeans in a pickle though)
This comes from a Lazy, Broke, AND crippled former Cat27 owner.
(oh yeah, get a survey first)
 
#11 · (Edited)
dayum, a cat27.. Smack, didcha see that?

ok, engine...
This comes from a Lazy, Broke, AND crippled former Cat27 owner.
(oh yeah, get a survey first)
Oh man - that's funny. I had no idea you were a "C27 Man" like myself. Yeah I noticed - and went through just about everything you mentioned with mine. But it had just been neglected for couple years - not 8. Regardless Salt - you can bring her back unless she's totally busted. And if you do, you'll love her even more.

Bottom line - get her in the water as quickly as you can and take her out - even if you only have a towel as a mainsail. That's the only way you'll stick with it. I remember this one guy that never got the stairs off his beautiful boat...

Anyway - as Giu said, if you don't have the fire in your gut, chuck it and go play dominoes.

PS - CP can also give you some great advice on nubbin waxing and the Purina lines of various chows.
 
#10 · (Edited)
I know the Cat 27 well.
What exactly do you have?
A 20 year old Cat 27 in ready to go condition with everything you need can be purchased for about $15,000.
You got a (almost) free boat so the question is what exactly do you have.
Is the hull and deck sound? I'll give you a simple list. The numbers next to the items are what we paid or researched for a friends boat that is for sale.
Do you have standing rigging, mast,
Boom (500) Real
Engine (12,000 diesel, 3,000 outboard) (Guesses)
shaft and cutlass (2,000) Real
Roller furling
Running Rigging ($400 replaced ourself)
Chart Plotter (600)
Steering idler wheels ($500) (guess)
Grounding causing some damage (6,000) Insurance

A sail boat is composed of lots and lots of parts. Many if not most are required for safety or comfort. If you get a free boat and have to replace too many pieces it can cost more than a boat purchased in good condition.

If you love restoring something with sentimental value the rules are different.
By the way where are you going to slip your boat? How much will that cost.

Washing it down and getting it clean is the least of your worries. The real issue is what exactly do you own and what has to be done to it to make it usable.
PS: You need fenders, dock line, Life Jackets, horn, anchor, rode charts etc.
If your boat is in perfect structural condition but just soft stuff is rotted due to sitting on the hard you could spend easy $1,000 for just misc items and 2-3 thousand for cushions.

If you are a scrounger and do-it yourself you can get stuff cheap but that takes time and interest.
 
#12 ·
It can be alot of hard work. Some like the remedial working of doing boat projects (I do to a degree but not when it involves major items like repairing de-lamination etc)...Hence why I gave up on my Catalina and will be probably just giving it away, and bought a new boat to me that had what I wanted to begin with...

Craigslist is your friend - advertise it for free, sell it for 3-4K and use that as the fund to a better maintained boat... Kudos for the post as the first step in doing any major undertaking is to actually be honest with yourself on what your desire and abilities are...
 
#13 ·
Salty, I don't want to be as blunt as Alex, but it sounds like you are in the situation you're in because you inherited the boat rather than because you had an interest in sailing.
Fixing up a neglected boat is a difficult enough prospect for someone who is motivated. It's just a form of torture for someone who isn't.

I like the idea of Craigs List. Sell her and pick up something small and ready to go.
You can always move up later if you fall in love with it.

I have seen a lot of people get totally turned off of sailing when they thought they were getting a "good deal" on a boat and then became boatbuilders instead of sailors.
 
#15 ·
Speaking as someone very new to sailing and currently undertaking a rather large project resurrecting a neglected 31' Columbia, I can offer this advice:

If you don't really want that boat and aren't willing to invest a lot of time and effort, then you'll never finish it.

I'm not even close to being wealthy, and this 31' is taking all the spare time and cash that I have.

Sailboats are members of the family. If you don't think of them as such, then you'll never be able to justify the time, effort and money that they require.

And just like the human family members... they add a wonderful and irreplacable dynamic to the family. If that's not the experience you're looking for, then perhaps owning a sailboat is not for you.
 
#16 ·
Cat 27

I bought a catalina 27 that was 5 years on the hard. Mechanicals were good, a bad water pump and jammed macerater pump, a couple of weeks of elbow grease and it was ready to sail. PO did store the sails in a dry varmit free environment and the yard owner had properly winterized the universal 18 and fuel system. Lines are a little dirty but solid. Given the cost of your acquisition if the deck and hull are sound you should get to work or sell. Stop complaining as a lot of guys would love to be in your shoes.
 
#18 ·
Sailing is something we have in our blood and the work involved is a labour of love. I am not rich by any stretch but I really wanted a sailboat and all I could afford was a MacGregor so I bought it brand spanking new. It is still a lot of work and major cost for accessories and it never stops, the time work & money invested I mean. I spend every extra penny and every extra minute I have with with my boat and have absolutely no regrets. You could not find a drug legal or illegal that can do for you what an afternoon on the water with just the sounds of the wind and water will do. The entrance fee is a passion for sailing, the rest is just stuff. If you don't have it in your heart you don't have it at all.
Go charter or rent or bum a day of sailing somewhere to discover what the end result of your efforts will be and decide from there.
 
#19 ·
If you're not a sailor, get rid of the boat... if you've never tried sailing, try it before getting rid of the boat...since you might actually be one...and just not know it. Restoring a boat is a labor of love, as is owning one.

If you don't love the boat, don't even bother trying to restore it... all you'll do is botch the restoration and make it that much harder for someone who will love the boat to fix her.
 
#20 ·
If you're not a sailor, get rid of the boat... if you've never tried sailing, try it before getting rid of the boat...since you might actually be one...and just not know it. Restoring a boat is a labor of love, as is owning one.
You really should try sailing if you haven't. If your avatar is an indication you must be a pilot, I know quite a few pilots that have become sailors. They really are very similar.

BTW What part of Alabama are you in? I might be able to help get that boat off your hands if that's the route you choose.
 
#21 ·
Well

Having owned 6 sailboats 2 of which were new ;) and having had the good fortune of being in and active 19 boat J24 fleet in the 80s i new what i was getting into

I looked at every J24 in the Northeast and past on most of them as they were overpriced because they had a 10000 dollar bottom/keel job OR they were so far gone it was not practical from a time or money standpoint as i really wanted to be sailing it in 2008 NOT 2010

It took well over 100 hours of crazy hard work this spring just to get the boat to were it was safe to put into the water and there is just no way a newbie would have realized the pool hose hacked onto the sink drain would have sunk the boat on a LONG starboard tack

Or realized if they did not put the rudder in there Bridgeport and make the tiller hole round again then went over to there lathe to make a bushing and washers that it would have failed

So i got a boat for with a FULL set of one season race sails and a FULL set of everyday sails a well as and outboard still in the box ,the PO hurt his back and the boat sat in the driveway for 4 years

A J24 friend i made this season bought one of the hulls i had passed on the sails are CRAP the hull has blisters the deck is so bad the stanchions have cracked through it leaving exposed core :eek:

The list of FUBAR is so long and his repair skills are so lacking it is a fiasco and to tell you the truth i would have just kept windsurfing or bought a used Laser before i took on that boat



So i really cant understand how you can be so hard on someone who asked advise because i can tell you right now with the missing inboard that boat is going to price OUT OF CONTROL before it ever sees the water
 
#22 ·
Hey Sailnetters, Thanks for all the great advise. And for those who thought some of these guys were being a little rough on me it's okay, I can take it.

Well, I'm not going to give up on sailing but I have given up on the C27. It left my shop on a trailer yesterday bound for Southeast Georgia. The gentleman that took it off my hands has plenty of time, money and know how to put back her in the water by spring.

Truthfully, I am thankful for the opportunity to spend a little time with the boat even though it I never seen it float. I learned a lot about the actual space there is in such a vessel as well as a small look into how sail boats are designed and function. I got my money back plus a couple hundred so I'm not out a thing. I look at it as my first lesson in the world of sailing.

For now I'll save my money continue hanging around sailnet.com. Lots to learn here.

Fair winds,

James In Alabama.
 
#24 ·
Well, I'm not going to give up on sailing but I have given up on the C27. It left my shop on a trailer yesterday bound for Southeast Georgia. The gentleman that took it off my hands has plenty of time, money and know how to put back her in the water by spring.
Sounds like you've done the right thing. I punted on a project boat a couple of years ago. Sold her to a nice old guy who said he wanted one last project before he died. I keep an eye out, hoping someday to see her sail by with a happy old guy at her helm.
 
#23 ·
Good to hear James... Let us know when you start looking for a boat of your own... :)
 
#25 ·
Well at least you didn't lose any money on the deal. It's kinda like the little Newport 16 I had my eyes on. It was only $400 but it needed a LOT of work and I just didn't have the time or the place to fix her up. Turns out someone else on here bought it and is already further then I would have been by spring. :)
Now I've got my eyes on a US Yachts 25' but it all depends on 1. the wife, and 2. whether I can find a place to keep it.
 
#26 ·
Welcome Aboard James..Glad to have you.

I second the Idea of getting out on a boat somehow..It will either hook ya or book ya.
 
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