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Big Freakin' Sails

593K views 3K replies 293 participants last post by  smackdaddy 
#1 ·
Okay - this thread is for people that ACTUALLY LIKE Big Freakin' Sails (note for morons: the verb, not the noun). BFS simply means sailing that pushes limits - whatever those limits may be. And herein lies the rub...and the reason I need to explain a couple of things so people don't start foaming at the mouth right off the bat.

There has been a tremendous amount of hubbub over this "philosophy" in another thread - but that thread apparently "came with a lot of baggage" - to the point that the topic itself got lost in the fog of war. So, this is an attempt to start cleanly.

It must be understood that the love for the adventure and excitement of hard sailing is just as valid and robust in the newbie as it is in the big-sailing old salt. The gap between the two is experience and knowledge. And the goal here is not to fill that gap by quashing the spirit of adventure and excitement with a deluge of cynicism and technicality - but to help us all learn, if and when the time comes, how to better handle that moment when mother nature starts rising beyond our sailing abilities. Because if you keep sailing - it will happen, period. And as you'll see, it can get very frightening very quickly.

For an old salt, these limits will obviously be worlds beyond those of the typical newbie. That old salt will probably snicker at the point at which the newbie becomes terrified - understandably so. Yet, there will inevitably be an even more seasoned salt that will, in turn, snicker at the snickerer when he/she soils his/her own breeches in a blow. It's all subjective and un-ownable.

Therefore, the BFS factor of a newbie experiencing a hard heel and wayward helm for the very first time is just as exciting, important, and valuable (in BFS terms) as the old salt battling a 50 knot gale. It's just about the attitude with which the exploit is approached and remembered - and taken into account as they go back out for more. There are great stories and valuable lessons in both experiences - as well as great opportunities for good hearted slams on the brave posters (which is valuable as well). That's BFS.

So, to be clear this thread is JUST AS MUCH FOR THE SAILING NEWBIE (of which I am one) as it is for the old salt. It's a place to tell your story, listen to others', learn some lessons, and discuss the merits or detractions of Big Freakin' Sails.

The following inaugural BFS stories illustrate what this thread is all about. As I said, I'm a newbie - and you see my first BFS story below. You can then compare that with the other great BFS stories thereafter (sometimes edited to protect the innocent) which I think are great tales from great sailors; they cover the spectrum of "pushing the limits". Then, hopefully, you'll throw down some BFS of your own (either your own story, stories you admire, or stories that are just flat-out lies but with great BFS value - whatever).

Now, let's have some fun...shall we?
 
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#78 · (Edited)
How big the freaking sail is depends on the boat. Three events conspired to create an "adventure". Let me set the stage.

  • Last year my friend the "Captain" bought his first boat a Catalina 27 and had sailed it only a few times around the local harbor buoys and he decided to do a day sail and "go some place".
  • I got a beat up Hobie 16 that was sailable but rough.
  • My son now twenty something and working as a rigger at a local marina used to teach sailing for several season at the local town rec facility a few years ago. He fondly remembers sailing the Hobie 16 and wanted to go sailing with us but thought the Catalina 27 would be too boring and slow and wanted to follow (lead) in the Hobie.
The course chosen was from Westbrook in CT to Truman Beach in LI about 11 miles almost straight across the Long Island Sound.
The plan was for the Captain and his daughter (10 years old and fearless) would leave the Westbrook dock at the same time as my son and I would leave the beach where we keep the Hobie about six miles away. The plan was for me to jump ship (Hobie) mid ocean (actually by Duck Island) and assist in the sailing of the C27.

The day of the big sail the wind was a brisk 15 knots at our beach. Steve, my son and I started our trip. We were sheltered a lot by the land so had a great fast sail in the Hobie. By the time we got near the rendezvous point we could not find the Captain. I tried his cell phone and got his daughter. This was one of his first times out without me and the wind had picked up to closer to 20 knots and he was thinking of canceling the trip. He had dropped the sails and was motoring looking for us. We found each other with the help of his daughter and the cell phone and I abandoned Steve, the Hobie is too wet for me.
The wind held a good 20 knots plus and we flew across the sound.

The following is a note of explanation for those who don't know how the Hobie 16 is setup. It has a trampoline about 12" off the water. The slightest ripple washes over the crew. There are no storage facilities, anything you don't want to loose you must lash down. The main halyard has a crimped on stopper that catches at the top of the mast. If you uncleat the halyard the main will not fall. You have to snap the halyard to release the catch at the top of the mast. I find this a tricky maneuver while on land. You have about 30" clearance between the tramp and the boom so even sitting is not safe from boom head collisions. It carries a whole lot of sail and flipping it over is very, very easy. It is way fun to sail.

The wind was really too much for the Hobie with only 140lbs of crew. Steve tried main up jib down, main down jib up, he was getting the snot kicked out of him. How he was even able to change sails in those conditions I don't know. We finally made it to the beach and rested up a couple hours. On the way back the wind was coming about 40 degrees off from where we wanted to go, a really hard beat. The wind picked up now 25 gusting to 30 maybe more. The Cat27 was doing fine of course but poor Steve was underwater a good share of the time. He had filled his backpack with rocks from the beach to get a little more ballast but that didn't work out because on a Hobie you need the ballast but it has to move or it will actually help tip the boat over. For about one second he considered wearing the backpack but for obvious reasons dumped the rocks. We are getting further and further ahead. A tug boat cuts across our stern blocking my view of him about a mile behind.
Now Steve is about 24 and about thee times stronger than me and has lots more time on the water than me. He can climb to the top of a 50 foot mast by just grabbing the halyard and walking up the mast (this trick is not allowed at work though). In short is more than capable of taking care of himself. But the father responsibility thing is hard to shake so yes I was worried. Now it's getting dark and starting to rain and the chop is getting worse. I see him change course to starboard and he calls me on the cell (how do you make a cell call in those conditions?) and says he is heading for the nearest land and will call me when he lands. We turn the motor on because the wind is directly from our destination and it's wet and uncomfortable and head for home.

Steve beaches the boat near Lynde Point in Old Saybrook Lynde Point Lighthouse, Old Saybrook, Connecticut.
This is an exclusive neighborhood of multi-million dollar beach homes. So just at dusk seriously beat-up Steve is trying to find a public road in the midst of all these estates. A guy yells at him "Hey what are you doing this is private property you are trespassing". Steve yells back, "I'm not trespassing I'm shipwrecked". Apparently they don't get too many shipwrecked mariners on their private beaches any more. The guy was cool however, and gives Steve a lift to the public road where his girl friend picked him up.
Of course now I'm missing one Hobie 16.

The next morning I take my truck and trailer and drop it off at the boat launch about three miles up the Connecticut River. The Captain takes the two of us in his car looking for the Hobie. If you are going to "park" your boat someplace at night, next to a light house is a good choice. After traveling several wrong driveways and telling our story to very suspicious wealthy homeowners. "Just why are you prowling around my driveway again". We finally find the boat. Steve and I sail the somewhat mangled boat, jib traveler tore up etc, to the ramp and hauled her home.

So the same conditions were:
  • A little scary but ok for a new captain.
  • Lots of fun for a slightly more experienced sailor
  • Big worry for a dad
  • A fun outing for 10 year old girl
  • A major struggle to stay on deck for an experienced sailor in a small boat
 
#80 ·
It's all about perspective. I've been out in stuff on Oh Joy that I wouldn't dream of sailing in on the V-21, no way, no how. The same air that would put Oh Joy's rail right to the water and make 7.5 knots of fun, would be 1.5 knots slower and much more comfortable and boring on ccam's Hans Christian 33. Of course, I carry 200 sq ft more sail and have half his displacement. Which would I rather sail in the shyte? Either would work for me cause I know what Oh Joy can handle and it looks like the HC 33 would do nicely as well.
 
#84 ·
Not enough catamaran's on this thread, and trust me folks with 690 sq ft (no spin, just fore and main) of sail up on a 33.5 ft boat, 10000 pound boat, I got your BFS.
I don't have the fancy Photoshop skills so I can't draw lines and such to show the angle of heel that almost spilled my drink, but I assure your that the 6 inch chop whipped up by the 10kt breeze I had to endure was sufficient to spill the sacred Rum and get one of my rails damp. The other rail was definitely wet with condensation - at the same time. Water transportation Sailing Sail Boat Vehicle


Later, the wind picked up to an absolutely whistling 12knts (true mind you, so add boat speed of three zillion knots, do the vector math and it at least 13 kts apparent) I was on a beam under full sail with serious BFS up and the characteristic twin wake throwing a plume behind me when I decided it was time to fall off and run from the obvious storm chasing my wake so I deployed my sea anchor's to slow me down to a manageable speed: Water transportation Water Waterway Recreation Boating


Afterwards, when the wind had died down to a more reasonable speed of 10kts I again turned to a beam heading and that my friends and fellow thrill junkies is when it hit with a vengeance
Sailing Sail Vehicle Boat Sailboat

Like I said, I can't draw lines and such - but I estimate a solid 5 degrees of heel, my rubber bottomed Newport cup actually leaned into the side of the cup holder and forced me to move it. I had to put down my book and take a walk on my back porch to see what the commotion was. Fortunately I took my camera with me and snapped this shot of my cockpit in total disarray Vehicle Room Car Wheel

Look at how my chair actually slid to port with the monster angle of heel, notice the EMPTY cup holder. Notice the Admiral is actually grasping the side of the salon table for balance, she almost had to stop reading.

My God, we were lucky that day.
 
#85 ·
Davidpm - Awesome BFS! I see your point about the size of the boat and motion of the ocean. Kind of reminded me of Jody's story - heh, heh. Just kidding.

Anyway, I'm actually liking the idea of the Hobie. It does look like a hell of a lot of fun - in tandem with a bigger boat. And I think I'm going to recommend the "rocks in a backpack" pfd to some of the guys over in AFOC. What's the rating on that device anyway?

Finally, it appears that the C27 is just plain unsinkable. If all of us greenhorn sailors around the world can repeatedly take these things out in conditions we have no business being out in - then actually bring them home every time, there must be something to them - despite the knocks they get from salts. Must be that 9 feet of freeboard Charlie.

Catalinas ROCK you full keelers!!!!
 
#87 ·
Chickles - that was the scariest damn thing I've ever seen. I still have cotton mouth from the incredible lameness of those photos. I'm just glad you're okay - and that your boat doesn't actually require anyone at the helm to float around the inlet in those harrowing conditions (kind of like the inflatable mattresses). Nice LFS dude. No MDB.
 
#89 ·
Giu - ya know, I gotta say, so far Charlie wins the award for a no-MDB photo of a truly gnarly sail. I've seen a lot of photos and videos around this dump - and that one is just freakin' big...and real. Photo - happened.

And by the way, I watched the steering without a rudder video again yesterday - since I'm sure I'll sail mine right off very soon - and those videos are really good learning tools. Kudos! However, I have to say that in that particular video, when you're releasing the traveller back to lee - your deck looks like a junkyard dude. Lines snarling all over the place - that's just plain dangerous! I could trip and fall into the ocean or something if I was slobbering drunk and trying to head to the stern for a wee.
 
#90 ·
Smack,
This is what 1500 sq ft of assym spin looks like in about 25 knts of wind. Courtesy of Giu's boat this past June, with me, my Admiral (MMR on sailnet) and one other sailnet member's Admiral (Valiente's wife, Becky) sailing Guiletta.
We put the spin in the water SEVEN times that day, and once put the carbon fiber boom three feet into the water. We averaged 10.5 kts which on his 12 meter means we were on plane most of the time.
We didn't have a white knuckle moment because we had a competent and confident skipper - Alex's son Fred.
 

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#91 · (Edited)
Wow - that is definitely one big freakin' sail! But - as Giu correctly pointed out - we're looking for the verb form. If it ain't in the photo - it just didn't happen. MDB.

Wait - on closer inspection - that horizon line does look pretty tilty. Is that photoshop?
 
#110 ·
Absolutely gorgeous. Getting the cute wet offwind is fun ain't it?

Unfortunately, we didn't have enough air to get mine wet this time and I didn't have a camera handy the one time we did.

Charlie CC,
Is that a chute or are you just happy to be sailing?
Where is the pole? Looks more like a Genaker.
 
#95 ·
Smack,
I do not own photoshop and we were all a little busy when we broached, no photo's but do have 4 sailnet members as witnesses (Alex, Fred, me, MMR).

The best part of that day was as we were coming into the port.
25+ of stink, screaming along at 11+ knts there was a freighter coming in just outside the seawall, Alex took the helm did a tack, heave to, tack and jibe in about 3 minutes and looped around astern of it as if he was on his boat with his normal 11 man race crew - mind you in 6-8 ft swell and 25+ of wind with a couple Admirals, one heel impaired catamaraner and his kid as crew

Then he pointed up and put the boat at 45 degrees of heel and close hauled thru the inlet doing 11-12 knts until we were 100 meters into the harbor, told me to take the helm and went up and dropped his seriously BFS main sail in like 20 seconds as we rounded up into the wind.

The port we went into had a regatta scheduled for that day canceled on account of too much wind. His motor didn't run except inside the harbor.

Shame there are no pictures, we were sort of busy.
 
#100 · (Edited)
Yeah - I was just kiddin' you Chuckles. But you do bring up the Achilles' Heel (or lack thereof in wimpy wind) of the whole photo/happen rule. Either you're a guy like Giu - who seems to have his own cadre of paparazzi that can chronicle his every epic sail - or you're like us normal people who have to whiteknuckle the tiller/wheel with one hand, release the straining jib sheat with the other, take a quick slug of booze, grab the Hasselblad 50MP, wait for the next set of 30' breakers to throw the boat to just right angle, focus with your pinky as you go airborne into the boom, snap the shot, look at the lcd screen to make sure it's radical enough for BFS, hit save, stow the camera back in its dry bag, take another hit of booze, then grab that jib sheat that flying sideways in the 80 knot breeze. It does take some practice.
 
#97 ·
Why it's a climbing/mountaineering implement called a piton, CP! C'mon - do you think a guy like Charlie just sails for his fun? Strap on a bosun's seat, grab some extra sheet line and take on K2 - baby! Just bring back photos or it didn't happen.
 
#101 ·
Chuckles, you've just made every super-newbie out there much more comfortable about sharing their BFS. And for those newbies, I must remind you of the title of this thread since Chuckles just defamed it...

It's NOT Big Freakin' Swans*.

(give me a break on the duck-duck-goose crap - comedic license)
 
#103 · (Edited)
Sadly - for me - my photos on Sailnet are the gnarliest I've got so far. But, hey, I'm working on it! Anyway - a good sailing story has to have a bit of the old MDB sprinkled around. It's like MSG for tale-telling.

PS - Dad, I just noticed your sticky about Multiple "Signons" - can guys really have those? I thought they were just a myth. I mean I know some can fake them - but...maybe that one should be Off Topic.
 
#105 ·
And finally, another cool contribution from a modest sailor - but it just tells the whole BFS story, man. From a book called "A Race for Real Sailors":

"During the long thrash to windward, every vessel sailed on her lee rail, with deck buried to the hatches. Huge seas broke continually over the staunch flyers and swept the decks. The brave, laboring craft would roll under surging seas to the second and third ratlines; then would follow awful moments of suspense, as the unflinching crew, with teeth set and hands clenched, watched to see if their craft would stagger up again, or go down under her grievous load. Desperate as the chances were, not a vessel luffed or reefed, as to be the first to reef would make her the laughing stock of the town, and there was not a skipper in the fleet who would not carry away both sticks rather than be branded as a coward."

Of course, all of this took place in a duck pond with Chuckles at the "helm" (read remote control) - so it's complete MDB.
 
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