SailNet Community - Reply to Topic

   Search Sailnet:

 forums  store  


Quick Menu
Forums           
Articles          
Galleries        
Boat Reviews  
Classifieds     
Search SailNet 
Boat Search (new)

Shop the
SailNet Store
Anchor Locker
Boatbuilding & Repair
Charts
Clothing
Electrical
Electronics
Engine
Hatches and Portlights
Interior And Galley
Maintenance
Marine Electronics
Navigation
Other Items
Plumbing and Pumps
Rigging
Safety
Sailing Hardware
Trailer & Watersports
Clearance Items

Advertise Here






Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Cruising & Liveaboard Forum > newbie
 Not a Member? 


Thread: newbie Reply to Thread
Title:
  

By choosing to post the reply below you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Message:
Trackback:
Send Trackbacks to (Separate multiple URLs with spaces) :
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Click here to view the posting rules you are bound to when clicking the
'Submit Reply' button below


Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

Click here to view the posting rules you are bound to when clicking the
'Submit Reply' button below


Topic Review (Newest First)
09-03-2005 08:56 AM
mjrm316
newbie

Eliduc,
where was the Columbia 34 you went to see that was in terrible condition? I am currently looking at one located in DR. Is it possibly the same one? If so, I would really appreciate hearing what you did not like about it.

Thanks,
Matt
07-18-2005 07:11 AM
camaraderie
newbie

Notwithstanding the coments above which are all quite reasonable, I think you can get the experience you need along the way if you just take your time and do it step by step. You and motor & sail down the Hudson after doing your lake sailing...they do some short day hops in settled weather along the Jersey coast. Then bash up the Delaware and cruise the Chesapeake Bay and get some experience in wider open spaces and squalls. (Also a good place to make repairs ad further outfit your boat as you discover what is needed!). From there you can head down the ICW to Florida and the Keys or make your first "Ocean" passage over to the Bahamas as you feel more comfortable with your skills. Passages south of the Bahamas or out to sea tend to be a bit more challenging (or downright scary) but can be undertaken once you really know your capabilities are up to it.
Go for it...but not all at once!!
07-07-2005 08:22 PM
Gex
newbie

I know it will be experince I''ll need the most however since I''m located in Montreal I''m not going to get to practice on blue water. Should I move to a coastal city and practice there or can I use what I learn on the lakes and take it to the sea?
07-07-2005 03:47 PM
JeffC_
newbie

Still, as the old Chinese proverb says, "A journey of a thousand nautical miles is begun with a single tack."
07-07-2005 11:59 AM
PCL
newbie

I would write a contrasting viewpoint to Jeff C''s, but he''s dead on. The biggest consideration in cruising is not whether or not you have a good handle on the basics of sailing, but rather are you prepared for the unexpected? Having cruised Mexico and the South Pacific, I found the YEARS of preparation, shakedown cruises, intentional beats to strong weather, etc., only moderately prepared us for the conditions we faced. Time on the water is essential, in all types of conditions, because that is the only thing that can prepare you for unexpected, and often unwanted, eventualities. Cruising isn''t all mai tai''s and sunsets, but with proper preparation, you definitely can work in a bit of both!
07-05-2005 08:00 PM
Gex
newbie

Wow excellent slap in the face for those of us who want to do the same thing. Now that I''m back into reality time to get started.

Courses start on the 23th and hopefully I''ll find a nice trailerable spring of next year. I can''t wait!

Thanks Jeff
07-01-2005 06:10 PM
JeffC_
newbie

Andy posted:
<blockquote>Would it be impractical/unsafe after much reading and the above classes to jump on a boat and take off for a few years?</blockquote>
Quite right: absolutely impractical and unsafe.

It''s certainly possible to buy a used boat for the price you mention, and throw in up to half as much again to fit it out properly for your purpose. No problem there.

And you''re intelligent, enthusiastic, flexible, and still young and hale. Those are all points in your favor.

However, even given the classes mentioned, and allowing for a voracious reading regimen, you will need to add enough time to your equation to allow you to gain the experience to embark on such a foray successfully, i.e., time enough to become a sailor.

Let''s assume that you complete your classes in one summer; that you purchase a boat during that first off-season; that you then spend your weekends working on it; and that you spend evenings immersing yourself in a pertinent course of study. And let''s assume you are extremely fortunate in your boat purchase, and only require two years of weekends to repair/refit your craft. (Can''t devote every dollar of your disposable income, or every hour of your weekends? I''m not a slave-driver: take four years). <b>Where will you fit in the actual sailing time that will let you gain the on-the-water experience that will allow you to lose sight of land?</b>

I''d suggest, very humbly, that a much more efficient, and emminently more practical and safe, path to your goal would be to take the classes, then as you do the reading, purchase a trailerable weekender, around twenty feet or so, that you can use to daysail and then extend your range into weekend mini-cruises. That way, you''ll be able to take all the meat of those classes and reading, and season it with salt, as it were.

After at least one season running empty halyard shackles up to the masthead and untangling the mainsheet from around your feet, begin to take a look at yachts in your local market to see what is available that will meet your requirements. This exposure will bring up all sorts of questions and reveal huge gaps in your knowlede that will steer your education from basic sailing skills to the question of what boats of what types in what age ranges and conditions of what capabilities will be suitable for your plans. It will take at least one off-season of educating yourself, sorting through these options and narrowing your choices before you can think of entering the market looking to buy. Try to shorten this time/learning step, and you may be saddled with an expensive, long-term project/money pit/nightmare/albatros hung ''round your neck, out from under which you may feel you will never wriggle. You will have solved one problem: but it will be the seller''s problem you''ve solved. <em>Caveat emptor</em>.

If you''re really sharp, and have put in 400 hours, as a bare minimum, of coastal cruising in the weekender (even giving you credit for a full 48-hr. weekend, that''s only eight weekends: better to spend two seasons) you may be ready, <em>if</em> in that 400 hours you have gotten real <u>hands-on experience</u> working with charts, and in navigation, piloting, heavy weather tactics, anchoring/mooring, and meteorology.

That will take three sailing seasons or so, or whatever the minimum time will be required to educate yourself for/purchase/repair/refit a suitable boat, and will require sacrifices in your finances and social life to accomplish.

Now that the boat is nearly finished and you know how to tie a knot and shape a course, it''s time to scrape together a cruising kitty. You want to be gone two to three years, so the question is: how much money will it take to live on and keep the boat in reasonable repair for two or three years? This figure varies for every boat and cruiser, generally growing along with one''s age and waistline, and the attendant amenities such as refrigeration or the need for a night life ashore.

For sake of argument, I''ll use a gross income of $40,000/yr. Can you save 30% of your <em>gross</em> by living frugally? Then you will have $12,000, plus a few bucks in interest. Will that last you two years? Tropical cruisers report monthly budgets ranging from a spartan $600/mo to a few who spend in excess of $1200/mo. Split the difference and estimate $900/mo. That''s thirteen months of Carribean cruising. You indicate a desire for a cruise from two to three times that duration. Given these numbers, that''s three years of saving, once the boat is repaired/refit/provisioned. You can shorten the total time if you sell off assets, like the weekender. You''ll have to work this out using specific figures of your own.

You asked for responses concerning the practicality and safety of buying a boat and setting off with minimal education and no experience. You certainly can jump into it without solid experience underneath you. Just make sure you bring a working flare gun.

These are just my thoughts. Hope this gives much food for thought, and encourages other posters to give contrasting viewpoints.
06-28-2005 03:39 PM
Eliduc
newbie

I bought a Morgan OutIsland 33 in March. The owner refurbished it with new sails, roller reefing, standing and running rigging, a new teak cabin sole, a Perkins 40 horse Diesel engine and then contracted cancer. There is no crazing in the fiberglass anywhere or apparent deck delamination. Although it is due for some deck paint the topside appears clean. I got it for $21,000. The cabin is comfortable enough for extended cruising with two or three people. The previous reply was right. Some creature comforts are missing, shower and hot water as well as electronics that were either missing or not connected. We added an auto pilot, chart plotter and new depth finder. The previous owner concentrated on the necessities before contracting cancer and deciding to sell the boat. It needed a good cleaning and organizing down below as he had not had the strength to housekeep while undergoing kemo. He had also stowed every part ever removed in a drawer or locker.Every drawer was a junk drawer. I feel I got an exceptionally good deal. I had a couple of bad experiences with brokers before buying from a private owner. I found the keel on a Kettenburg had separated 8 inches and the hull was blistered after paying for a survey. The boat had been in the broker''s slip for more than 6 months so I figured he probably knew about it. I also traveled too far to look at a Columbia 34 that was in terrible condition. The best advice I can give is to be patient and a good deal will turn up. Old is not necesarily bad. Some of these older boats are really sturdy.
04-22-2005 03:28 PM
Andy6681
newbie

Thanks for your reponse!
I know that I will be getting an older boat and don''t mind doing some of the work on it.... Don''t know anything about diesel engines, but I am willing to learn. I am currently in the IT/Electronics field so that should be pretty easy for me. I''m more concerned with the safety aspect of everything. I''ve had basic first aid training every year in the military so i''m pretty sure that I could handle the minor stuff. I don''t plan on going sailing for at least 2 years (working in Germany on a contract right now so I''m kinda stuck here for a little bit) so I have time to take classes and read everything I can get my hands on.
Thanks again
Andy
04-22-2005 03:04 PM
Irwin32
newbie

Read "advice on books for the VI" on the learning to sail forum. My opinion of your plans is summed up in my response there.

You could certainly find an appropriate boat in that price range if you are willing to go old, get dirtly, and don''t mind sanding and grinding. This would mean forgoing most luxuries - like on board showers and hot water. The old Pearson Vanguard pops into my mind and I am sure you could pick up a decent speciman in this price range. Be sure to budget for a new set of sails. Even cruisers need decent sails to sail safely.
This thread has more than 10 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

 
Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may post attachments
You may edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:22 AM.

Add to My Yahoo!         
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
(c) Marine.com LLC 2000-2012

The SailNet.com store is owned and operated by a company independent of the SailNet.com forum. You are now leaving the SailNet forum. Click OK to continue or Cancel to return to the SailNet forum.