|Topic Review (Newest First)|
|11-26-2010 08:37 AM|
|joemcdonough||I will be new to sailing Barnegat Bay this spring. I went with a 3' draft boat. There are some big sailboats on the Bay (30', at least that's big to me), BUT the Bay is a shallow water bay. Everyone I spoke to (Marina owners, boat owners) said that 4' keel was about max for someone intending to sail the Bay comfortably. Shoal draft keel with a swing centerboard would be the best all around boat to maximize sailing territory and reduce grounding. My impression was that a > 5' keel is a bad idea. Also, the inlets to the Atlantic are not for novices.|
|09-23-2010 11:22 PM|
|nasomi||I've found another, a Seidelmann 30' with 11' beam and 4'4" draft, that the man says is good in blue water. The shallow draft has it at forked river, NJ. It needs hull work though, and as a fiberglass hull, I don't know much about all that. Being in that area, it's in close vicinity of shops I know. Anything particular about this I should know to rule out right away, or to keep an eye out, that someone might know about?|
|09-23-2010 11:08 PM|
Your list of criteria is over-constrained, so something is going to have to give. If you really want to be at the shore and would like to use Barnegat Bay as your training ground, I'd suggest a wing keel or other shoal draft boat, especially since your H31 has fallen through. There are dozens of Catalina 30s on the market at any time, and Jim McGee sails one on Barnegat as I recall (though his is a much newer model than you are likely to find in your price range), and maybe he can give you some advice about outfitting one to go out in the ocean. They have lots of space, and there are good reasons why they are so popular.
Good luck. We all want more people to take up sailing, and despite the frustration that we may express over your difficult criteria, everyone wants you to find a boat that you are happy with and a place that you can sail safely.
|09-23-2010 10:45 PM|
|deniseO30||Sailboatdata.com - Search the Sailboat Database by Boat Name|
|09-23-2010 10:33 PM|
|nasomi||That's great, can you tell me where you found that? Is that sort of information available for most boats?|
|09-23-2010 10:24 PM|
Hull Type: Fin Keel Rig Type: Masthead Sloop
LOA: 31.33 LWL: 26.25 Beam: 10.92
Draft (max.) 5.30 Draft (min.) Listed SA: 468
Displacement: 9700 Ballast: 4000
Designer: Cortland Steck
Builder: Hunter Marine (USA)
Hull: FG Bal. type:
First Built: 1983 Last Built: 1987
|09-23-2010 10:18 PM|
I had ruled out Forked River/Lanoka Harbor because of the depth, I wasnt' comfortable with it. If I said Toms River, I appoligize, I must have misspoke. The only marina I had chosen that I liked was in Tuckerton, and the biggest factor was it's proximity to a friends house who also happens to be experienced on the water, albeit power boats, not sail boats.
I looked at sandy hook/raritan bay. There are a couple nice places, though the waters seem questionable at probably 70% of the marina's I was looking at. The problem with that, however, when I called the marinas there that could accommodate the boats all had at least a year waiting list.
You hit my requirements square on the head. However I have no idea if such a thing exists. If not, obivously I'll have to bend somewhere, but I thought I'd start there, and work my way down.
When I first spoke to the owner, he said that he was told 5'6" but he said he measured it himself and he said it was closer to 5'11". That's what I'm going off of, I could not find the factory specs on it. Still, if you're going to make a mistake on something like that, it's better to go up i would think.
I don't know the boats, that's why I ask. I don't know hte marina's, that's why I ask. I don't know the waters, that's why I ask. A few days ago the forerunner was in tuckerton with the 31' hunter. However, the marina could not accomidate the depth, nor could hte inlet. It was out. The boat deal didn't pan out, so I'm looking again. If I find nothing, when I re-evaluate my parameters, I'll probably increase my slip fee to $100/ft.
I'm also waiting on hearing back from two marina's, two mile landing marina in cape may being one, on both water and seasonal availability.
|09-23-2010 09:39 PM|
I'd like to be a stones throw away from the ocean because once I find a place I like, I find myself hard pressed to leave once I'm comfortable somewhere. Chesapeake and Delaware aren't that much closer, and I regularly already travel to the jersey shore in the areas I had brought up. I know the areas, the people, the shops, and even had a shop there that I shared a lot with a storage yard. The guys were real nice and let me crawl all over and look at stuff, but they had 99% power boats, I think I only ever saw one sail boat.
I love the ocean, the bays have never appealed to me. Is the bay safer and present more oppertunities to learn at a slower pace, sure. It'd be ok to rent a day sailer from, I've scooted around on it, but I just didn't like it. I've been through little egg inlet, once with a storm approaching, it was not fun, it wasn't my boat, and the guy at the helm knew what he was doing. It was still pretty shaky, running on one diesel especially because the other quit while we were out there, thus taking much longer to get back than expected and having the storm run us down.
However, nothing is set in stone, I haven't taken any leaps, I'm still planning. Why buy a boat without a marina to go to? It all takes time and all the while I'm learning many new things every day.
|09-23-2010 09:01 PM|
Let's rewind here a little:
You say you want to purchase a 31 hunter with a 5 1/2 foot keel. ( on another post I saw a 5' 11" ) All the older vintage 31 hunters that I've seen draw 5' 3" ..... So are you sure what the draft is of the vessel you want to purchase..? It's important!
So here was the criteria you presented to us.
5 1/2 foot keel
Easy ocean access
somewhere in NJ
$ 60.00 to $80.00 per foot slip fees...later amended to $90.00 per ft.
3 hour drive from KOP.
Have I been paying attention so far??
You Ruled out my suggestion of Forked river..or Lanoka Harbor...because you thought it would take you too long to get out to the ocean...through Barnaget inlet....in that case, Toms River wouldn't work because it's 20 miles north of the inlet. ( 4 hours) or is that ok?
Think of Marina locations like you would Real Estate....location, location, location....the closer you get to the inlets, the more expensive it gets...
Deep water access also costs a premium....
let's leave....sailing around in circles for 7 days in the ocean aside for now.
And focus on the task at hand.
The options that are available to you...given your criteria are extremely limited. The Best and Easiest access to the Ocean in NJ is Raritan Bay.
The closest Marina to the Ocean is The Atlantic Highlands...you'll have to check their rates. I've left out Great Kills on Staten Island.
The Hudson River Marinas are out of your price range.
The next inlet down the road is Shark River, it's a dead end..
After that is Manasquan...easy inlet, challenging bridges a canal and some of the most expensive real estate in NJ.
Next is Barnegat inlet...challenging, shifting...the best bet for your price range will be opposite Barnegat on the mainland side of the bay. you will face challenges with your draft...but the only good sailing grounds for 5 1/2 foot draft on barnaget bay is between Forked River and the Seaside (rt 37 bridge)
Even still, you will regularly hit bottom if you stray.
There are no depths charted for Barnegat inside the breakwater because as you've learned the channels shift...this is where you need to be able to read the water, your depth sounder and have some local knowledge.
Further south, the only inlets worth mentioning are Atlantic City and Cape May. Neither offer inland sailing options...so it's the ocean or nothing.
If we go around the cape..into the Delaware bay...you have a few options and prices may get better for you....Dropping down, 55 you get to Port Norris Marina...I've never stopped there so I can't speak to the controlling depths.
As I said earlier...by choosing a boat with a 5 1/2 draft...you have greatly limited your options ....given your parameters.
Do you think if you keep asking the same question you'll get a different answer?
So, with my 40 years of boating experience in NJ waters, my suggestion to you..is that you need to think about changing one or more of your criteria.
Either..increase the price your willing to pay, the distance you're willing to travel to the ocean......
Your draft will be ok...if you choose raritan bay.....but will still give you a headache in barnegat bay...
Everyone..and I mean everyone.....who owns a sailboat in NJ has gone through this...and there are a shitload of sailboats in NJ.....not to mention powerboats....you are competing for ocean access with some of the highest per capita earners in the country....you're not getting deep water, easy access to the ocean without paying top dollar.
|09-23-2010 08:58 PM|
I have looked at the harbor area up there, it looks pretty risky though. There's a clear 6' path from the ocean to the mainland during low, but that's average low, I would think there would be times it could get lower than listed, right? Also, are there charts that show high tide depth? Going to Holiday Harbor isn't something I'd be comfortable doing yet, and mooring up at HBHYC puts me on a definite time limitation to become confident enough to get in to holiday harbor. That's why I was looking for somewhere I could stay year round, so I could learn at my own pace.
rockdawg, i left my wife 3 years ago and still have no desire to re-enter the dating world, the thought of doing so sickens me. Though yes, you're probably right, if I wasn't single, I'd probably not feel the dyer need to "get away". But I'd still be interested in a sail boat because I've always been a fan.
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