|Topic Review (Newest First)|
|07-09-2011 04:13 PM|
|eddie nelson||Seat time is the key with anything. I cant wait to start learning and practicing.|
|07-07-2011 02:44 PM|
|chrondi||I would not suggest to force by all means a fixed keel 20+footer to capsize. Such boats do capsize but this is rather the result of a combination of wind and waves, i.e. a potentially dangerous situation if no other boat is nearby ready to help. The tendency of the boat to turn to windward is her designed natural defence and filling the cockpit and cabin with water doesn't cover any meaningful learning need. These skills are rather acquired by means of dinghy sailing, not with heavier boats!|
|07-05-2011 06:24 PM|
|deniseO30||When I had my H23 We were hit with a gust.. took us to starboard. sails out and boom dipping.. Wind kept us down but the boat just slowly moved into the shallows of the river. Nothing I did mattered Other then when in "doubt, let out" the boat basically saved herself! All in about maybe 2-5 minutes. I've never feared heeling since!|
|07-05-2011 04:40 PM|
20-30 degrees of heel may feel like much but your keel ballast have just started working at that point. What you have, as pointed out above, is probably an initial stability issue which will happen if your boat is not very beamy or has a round underbody. You will find that capsizing a keelboat is harder than one might think.
Even my sailing dinghy without a keel surprised me. You step on it and it feels like it will roll over on slightest imbalance. Feels much more stable when heeled under sail.
|07-05-2011 02:23 PM|
"What does it really take to capsize a boat "
One good squall, that's all.
Consider the J/24 which was considered "uncapsizeable". Squall line came through the NY/NJ area in the 90's while a fleet was out racing, put one over on her ear, water came in through the cockpit lockers and flooded the boat out below. Capsized. And that's not the only one.
Push hard enough, and anything goes over. Most stuff also rolls back upright, if you have prepared the boat. That can mean sealing lazarettes off, or at least securing their covers, and putting in the companionway boards in rough wx.
The capsize ratios give you a way to compare you boat to others, and to see how much push it will take to start it over. But as long as you don't plant the mast in the mud, you can take reasonable steps to ensure it will keep rolling right over and come back up again.
Some boats have high "initial stability" meaning, you step aboard and they don't rock. Others are tender and have more "form stability" meaning, they'lleasily roll and put a shoulder to the water, and then dig in and remain stable at that heel angle. Most are one or the other these days, very few are actually tender AND tippy AND inclined to keep rolling on over.
|07-05-2011 01:45 PM|
Welcome to Sailnet, you can learn alot here. Go to this calculator: Sail Calculator Pro v3.53 - 2500+ boats and you will find that your capsize factor is 2.17. 2.0 and lower are considered good.
It is pretty hard for the wind alone to capsize your keel boat, it may knock you down, ie put the mast head in the water, but it would take a combination of wind and wave to turn you completely over.
|07-05-2011 10:45 AM|
I'm going to take a wild guess here and say that with 1200 pounds of keel ballast underneath (by subtraction) a 2000 pound hull, you're going to have an extremely difficult time capsizing her (meaning she goes way over, mast in the water, and won't recover). She may heel way over if you are 'making' her (meaning too much sail not eased enough, or getting caught aback, or some kind of jibe-broach deal downwind, or the like) but the boat *will* recover if you will just let her (and you had your hatches closed to avoid downflooding).
What sometimes happens in the debacles mentioned above, is the crew on a lightweight boat doesn't/can't hang onto the high side, and fall to lee (or in an accidental jibe they're now suddenly on the low side), the worst possible place for them, and for the boat's stability. Crew weight placement is a big factor in boats less than, say, 7000 pounds or so.
|07-04-2011 10:45 PM|
|07-04-2011 10:25 PM|
|deniseO30||Yes, sorry I don't mean to try and sink your boat. just try and see what it takes to really get her heeled over allot.|
|07-04-2011 10:12 PM|
I had a 26' Chrysler that was pretty solid in my opinion. A storm was rolling in when we were headed to the slip one time, and the wind changed direction by 30 degrees and upped it's speed a LOT (not sure how much, but it's still the biggest gust I've seen on Lake Lanier).
When the direction and wind speed changed we were sailing pretty close to the wind on a starboard tack, with a 130% genoa and the main up.
Then BAM it hit us directly from the side and the top of my mast was _maybe_ 12' above the water, and just as quick, we were up again, but it was a very gusty wind and I let both sails go, brought them down and we motored in.
That keel will do a LOT to keep your boat from going all the way over.
I'm pretty sure I would not test it too hard though, as Denise suggested. She may be right, but I'd check the sea ratings of the boat and search for a forum dedicated to your make/model and learn from their experiences.
Have fun though, sounds like a fun boat. You may want to see if you can borrow/rent a smaller boat sometime. You can learn a lot about wind and sail trimming on them pretty quickly.
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