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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > No EPRIB and No liferaft?
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Thread: No EPRIB and No liferaft? Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
08-04-2011 05:54 PM
hellosailor Dawg, it is a matter of personal comfort level. The mythological "prudent mariner" probably is carrying an EPIRB these days, or at least a PLB. They've gotten dirt cheap in the last five years. The life raft...I'd like to see a raft OR some solid alternative plan but I can understand a greater reluctance not to invest five grand in a very disposable product. (They all rot and wind up costing serious bucks per year.)

Still, life rafts CAN be rented, and for 2000 offshore miles, "Don't worry be happy" just isn't my idea of the way to do things. I'd call it tempting the Fates, and those broads play to win.

Listen to your gut, if you don't like a situation, pass on it.
08-03-2011 03:59 PM
Henry Irla
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockDAWG View Post
Would you join the captain for off-shore sailing of a 600 to 2000 nm voyage. These are the essential for survival. The boat has a dingy but hell, it won't protect us from weather. Having an EPIRB nowadays is not expensive either.

I am unwilling to join not because these two missing items, but I don't know what other essentials are missing in the boat. What is your take on this?

WE HAVE BEEN SAILING FOR GENERATIONS WITHOUT THE SAFETY GADGETS YOU MISS. iF THE SKIPPER IS GOOD AND THE BOAT IS SOUND, WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?
bUT THEN, IN YOU HAVE TO ASK WHAT YOU ASKED, HOW COULD YOU KNOW ABOUT THE BOAT AND THE SKIPPER ANYWAY? RATHER STAY HOME...
08-02-2011 07:12 PM
jimjazzdad
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omatako View Post
...Unless of course you subscribe to the philosophy that if anything goes terminally wrong you're OK to die as a consequence. But that philosophy should be subscribed to by all persons aboard not just the skipper.
I completely agree and I think that was what the OP was getting at. If I was signing on to a delivery crew, I would expect all the modern safety equipment to be on board, including liferaft, EPIRB and Satphone or SSB. I would also want to see collision mats and plywood, extra rigging and sail mending supplies and lots of spares for the engine. When you are working for someone else, you expect workplace safety to be up to standards.

However, on my own boat, my philosophy is to have all the equipment and knowledge I can muster to come home on my own keel. The best liferaft is your own boat. Without the "magic button" to push, many sailors would learn much about their abilities and their drive to survive. There are risks in any undertaking. I not sure I want to die sailing but I am damn sure I don't want anyone else risking their life to get me out of a mess I chose to risk.
08-02-2011 06:26 PM
tdw Coastal offshore I would do without a raft, deep ocean no way.

I somewhat agree with you Andre re the EPIRB but if I sink someone is going to notice and at some point a search is going to be undertaken at considerable cost to the community at large. If S&R had the EPIRB signal that search would hopefully be shorter and less expensive.

In the case of the Hiscocks we should remember that had they gotten into trouble offshore a full scale S&R would not have been undertaken if only because without EPIRB their known position would have been hazy at best. Its also fair to say that S&R operations and equipment was nowhere near the level of sophistication we see today and finding a yacht in distress or a life raft would have been pretty much hit and miss.
08-02-2011 05:26 PM
Omatako EPIRBs are a "modern day" piece of kit and as LauderBoy asked, would you go to sea if the device never existed? Of course you would and we all did for many years. But life rafts on long voyages have been a basic component of sailors for many decades now and a decision to go to sea without a life raft is IMHO, silly.

Unless of course you subscribe to the philosophy that if anything goes terminally wrong you're OK to die as a consequence. But that philosophy should be subscribed to by all persons aboard not just the skipper.
08-02-2011 11:51 AM
funjohnson I bought an ACR Globalfix 406MHZ EPIRB w/ GPS last year new for $388. You can find new ones cheap enough if you look around and wait.
08-02-2011 11:51 AM
Minnewaska
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
OK, I'm going to play devil's advocate here. .......
The debate is always between your personal liberty to take whatever chances you choose and the cost to society for launching a six figure search and rescue. The later is what drives the criticism of improper preparation.

If you are willing and expect to go down without rescue, so be it. However,making a call from a sinking ship without a gps or epirb reference or liferaft is going to cost substantially more than a call from a dry , where time is not as critical and nearby ships may be directed to respond first.

This is why in hindsight, I don't think it was wise to have had mine delivered without these devices.
08-02-2011 11:40 AM
Minnewaska
Quote:
Originally Posted by LauderBoy View Post
......On the other hand a used epirb are going for $300-400 on ebay......
Be careful of these. The batteries are life limited and can cost hundreds to replace, bringing you close to the cost of new.
08-02-2011 10:10 AM
LauderBoy
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjazzdad View Post
There is WAY too much reliance on modern technology among underprepared sailors who figure if something goes wrong they can just push a button...
I think the main question is, would you do the trip if the device didn't exist?

If you wouldn't be comfortable sailing without an epirb, as in you don't think you could complete the trip safely, then you're probably not ready to do the trip at all. For people who "need" an item like that, it can sometimes put them into situations they normally wouldn't attempt if they were all on their own. You hear about this a lot more now with SPOT and people getting into situations they normally wouldn't attempt without one.

On the other hand a used epirb are going for $300-400 on ebay. To me it'd be silly not to have one at that price for a trip like this. Things go wrong for even the best and most prepared people and something like that is just another tool in the toolbox.
08-02-2011 09:28 AM
jimjazzdad OK, I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Another poster referred to Tim & Pauline Carr. I cite the Eric and Susan Hiscock, widely acknowledged as the first of the modern cruising sailors. They didn't even want to carry a VHF for fear they might be tempted to use it in a bind and thus inconvenience or endanger others. There is WAY too much reliance on modern technology among underprepared sailors who figure if something goes wrong they can just push a button... If the engine quits - fix it or sail. If the sails or rig are damaged, fix them or jury rig. Lose the rudder - steer with the sails or improvise. Taking on water - find the leak and plug it. If all else fails - pray and prepare to meet your Maker. If you are not willing to do all of the above, you shouldn't be out in the open ocean. Take some responsibility for your actions.
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