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Help I feel out of my depth

8K views 44 replies 35 participants last post by  rugosa 
#1 · (Edited)
I love to sail. I have loved sailing for almost twenty years. I have lived to this point with an extremely limited budget, the most expensive boat I've ever owned is a 21 ft Catalina bought used for 10k. I have finally finished law school and got a real job at the age of forty, and can afford the yacht I've always dreamed of. I've long dreamed of sailing with my wife and kids from Miami to Bimini in my very own 40-50 ft yacht, but now that I can afford it, the combination of limited time to play and my wife's love of speed is leading me to consider a power yacht. The decision of power vs sail is one my wife and I have never seen eye to eye on, but cost has allowed me to win in the past. I am loosing now, and I've got to admit she has a point. we will be buying a new boat late this summer in the 300-600k price range and plan to use it for weekend trips and 2 2 week long trips per year. how do I convince my wife to stick to sailing?
 
#2 ·
Another troll post. The clues indicating that this poster is a troll:

1. Catalina does not make a 21 foot boat.

2. Law school graduates who were previously impoverished do not start out with a salary sufficient to buy a 300-600K "yacht". In addition, few true sailors refer to "yachts" - a term usually used by non-sailors.

3. Most law school graduates are capable of spelling "losing", hypenating compound phrases "eye-to-eye", and using proper punctuation "[w]e"...., etc. This is another post that appears to be written as a text message by a pimply 13 year old.

O.K., clown, I called your bluff. Prove you are not a troll. Where did you pass the bar? Which firm are you with? What is your real name?
 
#4 ·
James I have a masters degree inpolitical science and will be attending law school in 2 years when I retire from my food career. And obviously I cannot spell....:laugher:laugher:laugher:laugher:laugher:laugher:laugher

Scratch that from the criteria. The other is sufficient

Dave
 
#6 ·
A love for speed, and wife who wants a power boat..good grief, must be a lawyer..

Ever hear about the 10,000 lawyers on the bottom of the Sea? A good start. LMFAO
 
#7 ·
Actually, at one time Catalina did produce a few 21' sailboats...
Victory 21 Sailboat History

Beyond that, it does seem odd that someone who just finished law school now thinks they can afford a 40-50 foot "yacht."

However, what I really don't get is why are we getting so many of these postings lately that seem to be looking for marriage counseling? Is it just me, or does it seem like there has been a veritable flood of these "my wife and I can't agree... please help me convince her" types of postings? (With the very rare "my husband and I..." posting tossed in now and then.)

Seriously. You come to a public internet forum, focused on sailing, to look for answers on how to communicate effectively with your spouse? I just don't get that at all.
 
#9 ·
I certainly will not give you my name or that of my employer. I never said that I came from abject poverty, only that I had been living with limited funds. I had a very successful though unfulfilling management career before attending law school. During the last six years of that career my family was living on one income while my wife attended school. For three years we only had my wife's income while I attended school. I graduated from Vanderbilt School of Law in 2009, took and passed the Bar exam at the Arlington Convention Center in July of 2009.During the two years immediately following law school any extra money went to paying off debt. As of last August we are debt free. I work for a large law firm in Houston; my wife is a nurse practitioner. Between our salaries and capital gains from investment properties we make just over three hundred thousand dollars a year. By late this summer, thanks largely to the sale of our home in Nashville, we will have two hundred thousand dollars for a down payment on a boat. I didn't share this information before because I didn't think it was relevant.
Catalina did build a twenty-one footer, The Capri 21. I've never seen another one, but I loved mine it was built in 1979 and restored by Correct Craft in 1992. I sold it to a friend and know it is currently at a marina on Watauga Lake in northeast Tennessee.
As for the bashing of my typing prowess, that post was written while slightly inebriated, at four in the morning, on a borrowed computer, over a thousand miles from home. This is a message board pertaining to a hobby, I didn't think I would be judged so harshly for grammar and spelling or I would have waited till morning.
I've got to admit that although it was not my intent to learn a great deal from this post, (my intention was to vent about my wife and maybe come in contact with other with whom to share my hobby) I did learn something. I had no idea what the term "troll" meant. Had you not called me a troll I would not have looked it up.
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[2] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[3] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[4] The noun troll may refer to the provocative message itself, as in: "That was an excellent troll you posted".(Wikipedia)
What in this post was inflammatory? How could my post provoke an emotional response?
I will not post here in the future, and I apologize for any perceived inconvenience.
 
#11 ·
Just get the motorboat, make the wife happy. Get yourself a fun little dinghy for next to nothing for the sailing fix. If you play it right you could even keep the sailboat on the yacht as one of the tenders or toys.
 
#12 · (Edited)
#13 ·
rwilson,

We have had more than a few spousal venting posts lately and yours just happened to come in at the wrong time.

I'm sorry that you're going away with a bad taste for this forum but I hope you consider the suggestion to keep a dinghy and remain with the forum. Otherwise, once you become a powerboat owner you'll have no need for us and I wish you luck with your new boat and new career.
 
#14 ·
James and rest of you. Get a freak-in life. Why do all have flame anyone here regardless of the post. You guys make me sick, Please keep your freak-in opinions like that to yourself. These bulletins are meant to get answers to questions.
For the poster, I might look at a motorsail boat like an IP SP. There are a few other boats that might fit the bill.
 
#20 ·
In James' defense, his skepticism was justified by the original post. If the original post had not been "written while slightly inebriated," James might not have been led down that path. Whenever you do anything "while slightly inebriated," there's an increased likelihood that you're going to embarrass yourself.

Nevertheless, rwilson37643 shouldn't go away. Most of the participants here have embarrassed themselves in a post at some time or another, and some of us even did it while stone cold sober. He'll fit right in with us. ;)
 
#18 ·
If rwilson is legit and sticks with sailing, I hope he sticks around and contributes. The OP story was out there a bit and I hope he recognizes that posting while drinking will usually get one in trouble. Who here hasn't made that mistake? Brush it off.

However, troll or not, come to a sailing forum and ask about buying a power boat and you should expect some flack. No?

I mean anyone that prefers a powerboat must be an uneducated, unattractive, sickly, unsociable, poor mannered, alcoholic.......... troll. Thats the standard line we all practice on day one at sailing school. Whether anyone means it or not is in the eye of the beholder.

For more practical input, a half million dollar boat can take more than a $300k salary to keep. It depends on your circumstances, but be realistic. Costs go up much faster than boat length. If I didn't do a fair amount of work on ours, we wouldn't be able to afford her. We all kid about boat bucks, but everything on a 50 footer is breathtaking.

I agree that a few sailing vacations on both cats and big monos might help you both settle on a direction and get more experience. Jumping from a 21 footer to a 50 footer is going to be another language.
 
#23 ·
As others have indicated, Catalina built the Victory 21 and marketed it as the Capri Victory (I used to own an early V21). I think it also might have been marketed as the Capri 21 at some point. The Victory was actually the boat that got Frank Butler (the founder of Catalina Yachts, and before that Coronado Yachts, and before that Wesco Marine) into boat building.

 
#24 ·
RWilson,

First of all, as a SailNet Moderator I am sorry about the way you have been treated. This type of personal attack is against forum rules and so I have cleaned out some of the more offensive attacks. Please accept my sincere welcome to SailNet.

Most of the rest of you folks:
Good grief: What the heck is this all about?
Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed and decided to take it out Wilson?

Whatever the excuse, personally attacking another member is not acceptable under forum rules. As I read RWilson's posts, I see nothing that even vaguely resembles a troll. Having seen decades of posts around here, it really is not particularly unusual to see people who are faced with changing sailing circumstances and who are looking for discussion on thier situation. And frankly it is not all that ususual for members to look for people's thoughts on spouses who prefer not to sail, or who perfer to have nothing to do with boats. If you personally do not identify with Wilson's cunundrum, then don't comment. Whatever you personally think about this topic, from a forum policy standpoint, this does not represent an 'open season' on derision.

So please, try to treat each other with civility.

Mom...er....Jeff_H
 
#27 ·
Most of Galveston bay is too shallow for the size of sailboat you are thinking about. A power boat will take you many more places on your weekend outings.
On your two-week excursions you have two choices - inside or outside. If you plan to stay inside, then any eastbound travel will favor a power boat. West bound would be a wash. If you are going outside with only two weeks then a sailboat will not get you very far before you must return, or leave the boat at a distant location while the power boat will get you much further afield for more local excursions.
So, is it about going there or being there? Sailors generally value the going part more than the being there part. This philosophy might be a good conversational tack for you and your wife.
Also, what is it that has your wife in favor of motor over sail? People who don't understand the dynamics and physics of sailing are very frequently ill at ease (scared &#^less) when under sail and sailing is generally more work.
You guys have worked through some tough times to get to this point in your lives so seems you can have a discussion of the pros and cons or motor vs sail and come up with a compromise that satisfies each of you.
But don't drink so much when you get into that discussion and keep it analytic.
Good Luck
John
 
#28 ·
And from the Victory 21 site:
"In fact Catalina ran ads as early as December 1969 with the Catalina Victory 21 as one of their boats. Regardless, at about this time Catalina Yachts acquired the manufacturing right to the Victory 21. I am uncertain if they began production immediately, but they apparently had production through 1973 or early 1974. At this time they ceased production for a period of more than a year with the board of NAVSO (National Association of Victory Sloop Owners) asking Catalina Yachts in December 1974 to make a policy statement concerning the future availability of new Victory 21 sailboats. The company resumed production through the early 1980's. The latest documented information I have shows the boat's standard price was $3,295.00 as of November 15, 1980. The final number of boats produced is about 690. The highest reported hull number is 688, a vessel located in Oklahoma.

Catalina sold the Victory as a Capri Victory 21. They used the "old style" Catalina 22 mast."
 
#29 ·
The way I see it....there's sailing, and there's not sailing. You pick. You could sail or you could get a place in Aspen. You could sail or you could get a Winnebago. You could sail or get yourself a Searay.

I don't really view powerboats as a viable, recreational way to move over the water. The amount of fuel they use is astounding. The argument is that if I can can afford the fuel, why not? I sometimes think that all boaters should be required to fill their vessel's fuel tanks by hand with 5 gallon jerry cans, so as to gain some appreciation of what they're doing.

Here I am going all "green" on you. I say let's build the pipeline from Canada to Texas...to hell with those lizards in Nebraska, or whatever. We need to fuel our lifestyle in a reasonable way. I just don't see using a vessel that measures its fuel consumption in multiple GALLONS PER MILE is a reasonable use of resources. Man up and sail.
 
#31 ·
And you ask why people come on here and leave? Someone here flamed me the first post I ever made, and if it hadn't been for my husband doing a lot of talking and showing me informative posts - basically convincing me this forum really is worth hanging around - I'd have been long gone too. Why don't you get guys get a life and stop attacking others just because they don't look, sound, think, act like you?
 
#32 ·
RWilson--I hope you're still around--has your wife been on a nice 40-50 ft sailboat? What is it about sailing she doesn't like?

I would think that two weeks is plenty of time to cruise from Miami to Bimini, cruise around, and get back. That's essentially a day trip--you could motor it in your sailboat if necessary.
 
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