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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!
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Topic Review (Newest First)
04-02-2012 11:14 PM
MedSailor
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

I also talked with the designer of the electric motor via email. Very pleasant to deal with and very responsive. I would deal with his business in a heartbeat (if I had the coin). Here are the prices for the system as an add on to a beta or any engine of your choice. If you have an existing engine and transmission and can have a bracket fabricated you can save a bundle over the beta pricing.

Still looks cheaper than a separate 5kw generator AND you get a silent, redundant, second method of propulsion.

MedSailor

PRICES ARE IN POUND STERLING:

Section 1 Hybrid Systems and components
EX VAT
HEMP1 Retrofit Parallel hybrid system, 10 kW electric drive, 5kW generation
4,400.00

Bkt-150 Mounting brackets based on a using a PRM 150 gear box
500.00

PRM-150 PRM hydraulic gear box, ratios available 1.53:1, 2.09:1, 2.83:1
900.00

Oil-150 Oil cooler for PRM15, includes pipes and bracket
120.00

SC-01 Shaft clutch to provide optional standalone diesel generator function
1,200.00

SM-01 "Smart" Morse control lever 250.00

Radio-01 Short range radio link for speed control
250.00

MedSailor
04-02-2012 09:19 AM
PCP
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockter View Post
MedSailor :

I called the Beta rep and chatted with him for a bit. Their engines are in the same price range as Westerbeke, Yanmar etc for a new engine. He told me that the hybird option adds 8-9K to the price. But that includes a separate clutch for the shaft, and electronic charging systems, and a smart circuit that cuts out the generating function when you push the engine near max HP thus freeing up the last 7-8HP for the boat. So, it's about the cost of a generator, without all the extra space, extra maintenance and on the plus side you have the electric propulsion.

Adds $9k to the price?????? That's £6,000. Yeeeeeeaaaaaarrrrrgggggghhhhhh!
I can have another engine for that.
Probably but you cannot have an engine and a medium sized alternator installed by that extra 8/9K USD (the installation is expensive and imlpies more through the hull holes.

A Panda 5.5Kw generator costs almost 12K euros plus 23% VAT, no installation comprised on the price. We are talking only about the generator not about the other electronic stuff you would have to buy separately.

Find some detailed information on the Beta system:

http://www.hybrid-marine.co.uk/resou...ybrid-rev8.pdf

Seagoing Hybrids - Hybrid Electric Marine Propulsion

http://www.hybrid-marine.co.uk/resou...e+retrofit.pdf

Downloads - Hybrid Electric Marine Propulsion

Regards

Paulo
04-02-2012 08:43 AM
T37Chef
Cost Cost...

Beta gave me a price quote for a 38 of $12,233 (minus a 15% discoount) and an additional $11,600 to add the hybrid system.

That's a lot of $$, but I would still consider it. I see so many benefits to the system for our boat and how we use it.

It makes for a good debate...but at the end of the day its a personal choice

.
04-02-2012 05:33 AM
Rockter
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

MedSailor :

I called the Beta rep and chatted with him for a bit. Their engines are in the same price range as Westerbeke, Yanmar etc for a new engine. He told me that the hybird option adds 8-9K to the price. But that includes a separate clutch for the shaft, and electronic charging systems, and a smart circuit that cuts out the generating function when you push the engine near max HP thus freeing up the last 7-8HP for the boat. So, it's about the cost of a generator, without all the extra space, extra maintenance and on the plus side you have the electric propulsion.

Adds $9k to the price?????? That's £6,000. Yeeeeeeaaaaaarrrrrgggggghhhhhh!
I can have another engine for that.
04-02-2012 02:04 AM
MedSailor
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertPirate View Post
It would seem that someone who wanted a generator on their boat could no doubt spend a huge chunk of change and get their propulsion AND their generator in one package. I have no idea what the costs are for this Beta Marine Hybrid, so who knows, maybe it might even be cheaper than a new generator and and new engine. If one had a rather large bank of batteries, it would be cool to just run the electric for those times when the diesel would only be on for a short period. Short on and off use is not in a diesel's best interest.
I called the Beta rep and chatted with him for a bit. Their engines are in the same price range as Westerbeke, Yanmar etc for a new engine. He told me that the hybird option adds 8-9K to the price. But that includes a separate clutch for the shaft, and electronic charging systems, and a smart circuit that cuts out the generating function when you push the engine near max HP thus freeing up the last 7-8HP for the boat. So, it's about the cost of a generator, without all the extra space, extra maintenance and on the plus side you have the electric propulsion.

The price is acutally WAY less than I thought it would be. I've been following electric boat motors for years and many are more expensive. One motor that I liked that is also 10KW (same size as this system) is $10,000 for just the motor, without any of the fancy generating or redundancy aspects. Other, cheaper and lower quality systems that would equal 10KW cost around 8K from what I've seen.

A really good price for what you get if you ask me, but it's still more coin than I have laying around....

MedSailor
04-02-2012 12:41 AM
DesertPirate
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

It would seem that someone who wanted a generator on their boat could no doubt spend a huge chunk of change and get their propulsion AND their generator in one package. I have no idea what the costs are for this Beta Marine Hybrid, so who knows, maybe it might even be cheaper than a new generator and and new engine. If one had a rather large bank of batteries, it would be cool to just run the electric for those times when the diesel would only be on for a short period. Short on and off use is not in a diesel's best interest.
03-31-2012 07:21 PM
PCP
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by klem View Post
When I said efficient, I was referring to fuel consumption only, I agree that it is much efficient in terms of cost and maintenance to only run one engine. I still wonder why anyone would choose this option over a very large alternator if the point were only to produce electrical power. ....
Space or the lack of it? A large alternator needs a lot of space (big boat) not to mention that it is more expensive than this option.

Regards

Paulo
03-30-2012 06:33 PM
klem
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PCP View Post
Yes you are right in what concerns free energy but I disagree with the "slightly more efficient than running a separate diesel generator".

You could be right in terms of fuel consumption but in practice it is not slightly but much more efficient and I am not only referring to fuel, but also in what refers maintenance costs and space saving.

Even in what regards fuel efficiency you don't consider a very important point: If I don't have wind and I am motoring or if I am motorsailing, with that set-up, I am charging the batteries almost for free (just a very small increase in consumption) because with a generator, motorsailing or not with a regular engine, I will have to run the generator anyway at the end of the day (assuming a significant electrical consumption, with refrigerator and AC).

Also you don't consider that while sailing the spinning propeller will be charging the batteries. Of course you pay that with some speed, but if the boat is not very light and if the wind is not weak I suspect that would not matter much to most cruises, I mean some less speed.

It is not only the fuel for the generator, but the hours of running time (maintenance) and most of all the noise and the discomfort.

All in all this seems to be a great system for someone that cruises out of marinas and has a significant electrical consumption.

Regards

Paulo
When I said efficient, I was referring to fuel consumption only, I agree that it is much efficient in terms of cost and maintenance to only run one engine. I still wonder why anyone would choose this option over a very large alternator if the point were only to produce electrical power. If you want to run electric only, then it obviously makes sense but if the point is to not need a separate genset, this doesn't seem like the easiest option as most people don't have 48V electric systems and it requires serious changes in the engine compartment. It is possible that some people might have space axially along the propeller shaft but not enough anywhere else for that big alternator but I would doubt that this is the norm.

For people who read the Boat US stuff, they just ran an article in Seaworthy about hybrid systems and their argument was largely based on being able to run silently for some of the time.
03-30-2012 03:10 PM
PCP
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by LauderBoy View Post
... and run a portable Honda 2kw generator up top. That simplifies my engine room immensely and the dino dining gennie would be easy to service and replace. Though I'd be under powered for extended cruising.

Of course when I look at a big engine I immediately think of broken knuckles, tight places, messy fluids and lots of swearing. The Honda at least I could throw over the side and pick up a new one at Home Depot or something if it really pissed me off.
Have a look:

http://newboatbuilders.com/docs/portable.pdf

Regards

Paulo
03-30-2012 03:06 PM
PCP
Re: Beta Marine - New Hybrid System!

Quote:
Originally Posted by klem View Post
Paulo,

I just want to point out that there is no such thing as free electrical energy. If you are charging the batteries, you are putting more load on the engine which means that you need to burn more fuel. This is probably slightly more efficient than running a separate diesel generator but it isn't free.
Yes you are right in what concerns free energy but I disagree with the "slightly more efficient than running a separate diesel generator".

You could be right in terms of fuel consumption but in practice it is not slightly but much more efficient and I am not only referring to fuel, but also in what refers maintenance costs and space saving.

Even in what regards fuel efficiency you don't consider a very important point: If I don't have wind and I am motoring or if I am motorsailing, with that set-up, I am charging the batteries almost for free (just a very small increase in consumption) because with a generator, motorsailing or not with a regular engine, I will have to run the generator anyway at the end of the day (assuming a significant electrical consumption, with refrigerator and AC).

Also you don't consider that while sailing the spinning propeller will be charging the batteries. Of course you pay that with some speed, but if the boat is not very light and if the wind is not weak I suspect that would not matter much to most cruises, I mean some less speed.

It is not only the fuel for the generator, but the hours of running time (maintenance) and most of all the noise and the discomfort.

All in all this seems to be a great system for someone that cruises out of marinas and has a significant electrical consumption.

Regards

Paulo
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