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Go Back   SailNet Community > General Interest > General Discussion (sailing related) > Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question
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Topic Review (Newest First)
06-04-2012 05:19 PM
hellosailor
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

"You ask three CCBA officials and you'l get at least 4 answers."
We have the same problem with agencies in the US. The answer is that you ask in writing, with a letter, and because the agency can still say "well that was only an opinion" you ask for a formal "advisory opinion" or other statement that will be upheld by the entire department.

Taxing is all about venue and jurisdiction. If the tax laws say "any resident" or "any citizen" and any presence within the boundaries...Yes, crossing into home water for ten minutes while in transit could still trigger tax jurisdiction.

If it does, and the formal written statement says it does, and your elected politicians can't get you a more powerful letter saying otherwise...then you either PAY because that's the law, or find another way around it.

Sell the boat to an American for $100. You'll pay some title or registration fee or maybe just a temporary tag fee. Now sail up to Alaska with them and buy it back. Voila, no Canadian tax jurisdiction. Or sail it up the outside. If you can't get a written qualification and don't want to pay the tax, get creative and get the boat outside the tax jurisdiction.

Or just sail up in a hurry on a moonless night, making sure your powder is dry and you shoot first. Stranger things have been known to happen.
06-04-2012 03:43 PM
ykmaggie
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Quote:
YKM, just a word of caution regarding the E99. When we were trying to transit the Welland Canal we were told by one CCBA official we could use the form. Another said no. Another said maybe. Another said something else. CCBA seem to have no idea what they doing. You ask three CCBA officials and you'l get at least 4 answers. So if you can, get the form pre-approved then provide little information unless asked. Good luck, you'll need it
EBS001, that above is exactly what we're worried about, and why we've put off buying this boat until we know what's up. This is also why I asked our MP to look into it. It makes me nervous to get multiple and conflicting answers from different officials. I'll see if we can what you suggest and get it preapproved

We might have to regroup and buy a North American made boat, which solves the duty problem. We just pay the GST and be done with it because the Yukon has no territorial tax. I love the Tashiba boat, but not at any price. We also looked at a Pacific seacraft that was very nice
06-04-2012 03:42 PM
ykmaggie
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

YKM, just a word of caution regarding the E99. When we were trying to transit the Welland Canal we were told by one CCBA official we could use the form. Another said no. Another said maybe. Another said something else. CCBA seem to have no idea what they doing. You ask three CCBA officials and you'l get at least 4 answers. So if you can, get the form pre-approved then provide little information unless asked. Good luck, you'll need it.

EBS001, that above is exactly what we're worried about, and why we've put off buying this boat until we know what's up. This is also why I asked our MP to look into it. It makes me nervous to get multiple and conflicting answers from different officials. I'll see if we can what you suggest and get it preapproved

We might have to regroup and buy a North American made boat, which solves the duty problem. We just pay the GST and be done with it because the Yukon has no territorial tax. I love the Tashiba boat, but not at any price. We also looked at a Pacific seacraft that was very nice
06-03-2012 07:07 PM
killarney_sailor
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebs001 View Post
ykm, so try the "having work done" route. Another way is to hire a US captain, actually any nationality but Canadian and he doesn't have to be a captain, to deliver the boat and don't take ownership until it's delivered to Alaska.
Canada Customs has some strange rules. Another frustrating rule is that, as a Canadian, you cannot rent a car in the US and drive it into Canada. In fact you cannot drive someone elses car.
Not quite true. We were living in the New Jersey (Canadians) and had a car registered in NJ in my wife's name (she was on a work visa). I drove to Niagara Falls on the way to Toronto by myself and was denied entry - which caused a bit of a problem when I went back across the bridge to the US. For awhile I thought I might have become a resident of the Horseshoe Bridge - not able to enter either country. Anyway, I digress. The Canadian customs guys said this problem happens fairly often and said I should go to the US and rent a car to enter Canada. Did this and there was no problem entering Canada - just showed the rental agreement. Left my car in long-term storage at Buffalo airport.
06-03-2012 10:59 AM
Minnewaska
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Quote:
Originally Posted by jentine View Post
....What am I missing?....
Dual citizen who actually lives in Canada and benefits from the stuff that those taxes are supposed to be paying for.

(not that I'm defending Canada's tax system)
06-03-2012 10:17 AM
jentine
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Let me see if I understand the problem correctly: An American citizen wants to take a US flagged vessel from a US port through Canada to a US port and Canada requires import and GS taxes. What am I missing? Where is the need to check into Canada? Proceed through their waters non stop and rest up in Alaska.
Personally, I would sail the boat to Mexico.

Jim
06-02-2012 10:46 PM
boatpoker
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

[QUOTE=ebs001;879552]As far as renting a car is concerned this has not been my experience nor does it agree with the information I have been given by Canada Customs. Rental companies would not rent me a car if I was a Canadian and wanted to bring it into Canada. This was about 6 years ago so maybe things have changed.QUOTE]

I've been doing it at least twice a year since the early 90's. Never had a problem with the rental company or customs.
06-02-2012 10:42 PM
ebs001
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Quote:
Originally Posted by ykmaggie View Post
Thanks guys for all the great responses!

It looks like we have 2 options, one is to try and get the temporary permit. My husband talked to customs, they told him it is called form E99, and is a legitimate way for Canadians to transit their US registered boat through Canadian waters.

We can't register the boat in Canada, it has to be registered in Alaska, because otherwise we would have to move it out of US waters every 90 days. Not an option. It would take us a month to sail to Prince Rupert and back.

The other option is to hire a US captain as you say, and I have one in mind that would do the trip with us

I did hear back from the MP initially, just to say he would get back to me. I emailed him because I was getting conflicting information when I called customs. The issue seems to be somewhat discretionary, and this is a fairly unique situation. Now that seems to be sorted out hopefully but we will never know until we get there with the boat. We have the form printed out

To answer the question about the sailing season here, yeah it is short - April - August. But there's no place in the world I'd rather be than Southeast Alaska on a nice summer day
YKM, just a word of caution regarding the E99. When we were trying to transit the Welland Canal we were told by one CCBA official we could use the form. Another said no. Another said maybe. Another said something else. CCBA seem to have no idea what they doing. You ask three CCBA officials and you'l get at least 4 answers. So if you can, get the form pre-approved then provide little information unless asked. Good luck, you'll need it.
06-02-2012 10:27 PM
ebs001
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatpoker View Post
I am Canadian and have many times rented a car in the US and driven back into Canada with it. Rental companies I have dealt with include a permission letter with the rental contract.

I have also delivered Canadian boats into US waters with the sales contract in my pocket (not a broker, just a messenger), then handed the boat over to the American buyers so they do not have to pay sales taxes here as technically with the hand over of the vessel that completes the sale.
As far as renting a car is concerned this has not been my experience nor does it agree with the information I have been given by Canada Customs. Rental companies would not rent me a car if I was a Canadian and wanted to bring it into Canada. This was about 6 years ago so maybe things have changed.
As far as delivering a boat from Canada to the US that is a completely different scenerio than what we are discussing here. The OP only wants to transit Canadian waters.
06-02-2012 12:49 PM
bljones
Re: Canadian resident registering boat in US. Duty question

Then, OP, I apologize for seeing a "D" that apparently wasn't there.
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