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Interesting Sailboats

3M views 7K replies 205 participants last post by  tdw 
#1 · (Edited)
Sirius 32, Sirius 35

THE OBJECT OF THIS THREAD:

Interesting sailboats in production and available on the new boat market (only boats with modern designs, meaning that the boats still in production but made with old designs are out). Recent designs out of production are also admissible.

Modern boat designs and modern one off, if interesting.

Classical boats and traditional boats.

Small cruisers (less than 35ft)

Seezunge 27ft: PG1-PT9

Hanse 325: PG19-PT185;

Presto 30 : 33-326; 33-327; 34-331; 34-333; 55-543; 55-544;

Tess Yachts: 37-366; 38-373;

Tess 28 Magnum: 37-369; 38-371;

Delphia 28: 38-373;

Vancouver 27/28 : 42-412; 72-717;

Cruisers between 35ft and 49ft


Catalina 355 : 31-306;

RM sailboats: PG5-PT41; 5-42

RM1050: PG5-PT46; 5-47; 5-48;

RM 1060: PG8-PT77; 8-78; 8-79; 8-80; 9-81; 30-295; 40-400; 79-786;

RM 1200: PG9-PT84; 9-85; 19-184; 20-191; 20-192; 41-404; 42-414; 42-418; 43-425; 43-426; 69-688;

RM 1350: PG9-PT82; 55-549; 95-943;

Morris Yachts: PG7-PT61

Bavaria 36: PG19-PT188; 19-190; 20-196;

Bavaria 40: PG10-PT95; 28-278; 29-281; 29-282; 29-283; 29-286; 32-316; 36-356; 51-502; 51-507; 52-518; 53-527; 53-532;

Bavaria 40s: 69-685; 78-775;

Bavaria 45: PG10-PT96; 19-190;

Rustler Yachts: PG11-PT104;

Jeanneau 409: PG11-PT103: 11-106; 30-298; 30-299; 36-356; 51-502; 51-504; 51-505; 51-509; 52-513; 52-514; 52-515; 52-516; 53-527; 54-532; 57-564; 57-570; 58-571; 58-580; 59-581; 59-583; 59-585; 62-614; 74-739; 91-906;

Jeanneau 439: 40-396; 40-397; 59-584; 59-585; 96-956;

Hanse Yachts: 16-154; 16-156; 16-158;

Hanse 400: 81-804;

Bluewater cruising yachts: 21-206

Beneteau Oceanis 37 : 31-306; 31-308; 31-309; 32-314; 55-541;

XC 38: 36-356; 96-954;

Diva 38: 39-386;

Diva 35: 40-391;

Dufour 405: 62-614;

Defline 43: 63-622

Walkabout 43: 93-923; 93-925; 93-927;

Small performance cruisers (less than 35ft)


Performance 32ft test: 29-87;

Sun Fast 3200: PG4-PT33; 4-34; 4-36; 30-293;

Elan 210: 70-691; 70-696; 78-779; 79-781;

Elan 310: PC7-PT64; 7-69; 8-71; 36-356; 41-408;

Quest 33: PG7-PT62

Olea 32: 25-243; 25-245;

First 27.7: 38-373; 38-380; 39-382;

First 30: 30-295; 39-356; 41-408; 55-545; 55-546;

Comet 26: 34-340; 35-345; 35-350; 36-353;

Pacer 30: 36-357;

Django 7.7: 40-399;

Vivace/Evosion 34: 45-442; 45-446; 45-445; 45-446; 45-447; 45-448; 45-449; 45-450; 46-458; 46-460;

Finn Flyer 34: 46-451; 46-453; 60-593;

Salona 34: 46-457;

Heol 7.4: 63-621; 63-622;

Azuree 33: 87-867; 91-902; 91-904;

JPK 10.10: 88-877 ; 88-880; 89-883;

Performance cruisers (between 35ft and 49ft)

Pogo 10.50: PG2-PT20; 3-27; 3-28; 3-30; 4-35; 5-50; 6-51; 6-52; 6-60; 11-101; 11-107; 11-110; 43-425; 44-440; 87-861; 87-867;

Pogo 12.50: PG13-PT125; 20-198; 20-199; 22-214; 27-264; 27-265; 27-269; 32-317; 32-319; 43-425; 43-426; 43-428; 44-432; 44-437; 44-439; 55-546; 55-547; 82-812; 84-831; 87-870;

Este 40: 89-890; 90-893; 90-899;

A35: PG5-PT42; 5-44; 66-660;

A40RC: 92-914;

Hammerhead 35: 64-645

Opium 39: PG5-PT42; 9-85; 9-89; 13-125; 22-220; 22-221; 43-426; 55-547; 86-857;

Aerodyne 35: PG7-PT62

Elan 350: PG7-PT64; 13-24; 13-126; 13-127; 13-128; 14-132; 18-178; 26-255; 36-356; 40-398; 41-405; 57-564; 59-589; 60-591; 72-711; 73-724; 74-738;

Elan 380: 23-223; 25-249; 26-256; 40-398; 59-589; 97-962;

Elan 410: 32-316; 79-784;

JPK 110: PG9-PT85; 10-91

Olea 44: PG10-PT100; 27-268;

Olea Yachts: 25-247;

Dufour 40e: Pg13-Pt125; 32-316; 55-547; 56-558; 56-559; 57-561; 57-562; 57-563; 59-586; 59-588,

Salona 37: 36-359; 41-406;

Salona 41: PG15-PT141; 15-145; 32-316; 36-356; 40-398; 54-538; 57-569; 78-778; 80-796; 80-798; 97-965;

Salona 42: PG15-PT145; 36-359; 40-398; 93-929; 94-932;

Cigale 16: PG15-PT148; 16-152; 17-161; 55-549; 63-625;

Cigale 14: PG17-PT163; 55-549;

Santa Cruz 43: PG17-PT169

Sydney Yachts: PG18-PT171; 18-175;

Sydney GTS 37: 43-423;

Sydney GTS 43: PG18-PT173;

Winner 12.20: PG20-193;

First 40: 31-304; 32-313; 32-316; 35-344; 36-354; 55-546; 55-547;

First 35: 36-356

Dehler 41: 30-296;

Dehler 44: 79-785;

Dehler 45: 36-356; 79-785;

Luffe 40.04: 30-300; 31-301; 31-303;

XP 38: 56-533; 56-544; 56-555; 67-622;

XP 44: 33-325;

Pacer 430: 36-357;

Pacer 376: 36-357; 66-652; 69-683;

Faurby 424: 36-360; 37-361; 37-363; 37-365;

Comfortina 39: 40-395;

J 133: 43-426; 63-620

J 111: 100-993;

Maxi 11: 99-982;

Arcona yachts: 46-456;

Arcona 410: 47-467; 47-468; 47-469; 48-471;

Arcona 430: 48-472;

Arcona 460: 50-495

Finngulf yachts: 46-456;

Varianta 44: 60-594; 60-595; 60-596; 60-597; 60-598; 64-639;

Imagine 53: 63-628;

Zou 40.2: 63-620

Ker 39: 68-676;

Finn-Flyer 42: 77-762;

Azuree 40: 85-842;

Loft 40: 85-848; 85-852;

Vivace 35: 90-895;

Sailing boats over 49ft

Zeydon 60 : PG 12-119;

JP 54: PG18-PT172;

Salona 60: 70-695;

Stadships: PG20-PT193; 20-195;

Pogo 50: 32-318; 32-319;

X-50: 54-537;

Murtic 52: 54-537;

Decksaloons and pilot house sailing boats

Sirius 32: PG1-PT1

Sirius 35: PG1-PT1; 1-10; 2-18; 50-491; 50-492; 60-559; 60-599;

Sirius 31: PG1-PT5; 2-17; 36-356;

Regina 35: 48-478;

Regina 40: PG11-PT104; 49-481; 49-483;

Southerly yachts: PG11-PT104;

Luffe 43DS: PG12-PT111; 12-115; 50-494;

Noordkaper 40: PG14-pt139;

Noordkaper yachts: PG16-PT155

Nordship 36: 30-297; 49-482;

Nordship 38: 49-482; 49-490;

Paulo's pilot house I: 38-376; 39-381; 39-383; 39-384;

Paulo's pilot house II: 69-682

Lyman & Morse 45: 38-379;

CR 38DS: 48-477; 48-478;

CR 40DS: 48-476; 48-478; 48-479; 50-494; 50-496; 50-497; 50-498;

Arcona 40DS: 50-494;

Racers

Figaro 2:pG4-PT36; 4-37; 5-42; 6-52; 6-53; 6-55; 6-56

VOR 70: PG16-PT160; 17-187

Farr 400: 67-661

Soto 40: 96-952;

Lifting keel/centerboarder

Southerly yachts: PG11-PT104;

Allures 45: PG10-PT93; 100-996;

Allures yachts: 25-248;

OVNI 425: 23-228;

OVNI 395 : 68-679; 69-690;

J 108: 67-661

Atlantic 43: 68-67

Boreal 44: 97-970; 98-974;

Multihulls till 34ft

Several Trimarans: 28-273;

Multihulls with 34ft and over

Dragonfly yachts: 26-257;

Dragonfly 35: 26-258; 27-261; 27-262;

Dragonfly 1200: 56-551;

Corsair 37: 28-276;

Farrier 39: 28-277;

Challenge 37: 28-278

Hammerhead 34: 29-385;

Hammerhead 54: 29-288; 30-292;

Trimax 10.80: 29-285;

Sig 45: 54-534; 54-539; 54-540;

Gunboat: 56-551

Fusion: 56-551;

Outremer: 56-551;

Tournier: 56-511;

Classical and Traditional boats

Jclass boats: 54-537;

Tofinou 12: 71-703;

Folck boat: 73-727;

Puffin Yachts: PG14-PT135; 14-138; 16-155;

Bestwind 50: PG12-PT116; 14-123;

Bestevaer 53: PG12-PT116;

Bestevaer yachts: PG16-PT155

Cape George 36: 41-410; 42-412;

Marieholm 33 : 42-412;

This list is not actualized. Please use the advanced search engine of the thread with the name of the model and builder. It works, most of the time.

(actualized till PG100) and it will be no more because that gives a lot of work (500 pages now).

Instead I am actualizing the titles and with the right title the thread search engine (not the one on the top of the page bit the one much below that says search thread) on its advanced option works quite well.

Hello,

Melrna posts on Miami Boat show and the comments of Smackdady about the interest of that thread lead me to think that perhaps I could share more information about sailboats I know and find interesting.

I am interested in boat design (interior and sailing performance) and I go each year at least to one of the main European Boat shows and that means basically Dusseldorf, Paris or Hamburg. On these shows you have the opportunity not only to visit the boats of the main and medium size builders but you have also the opportunity to visit the boats of small and sometime family shipyards.

Normally they build very good sailboats and sometimes they have been doing that for decades. The boats are hugely appreciated by their faithful customers but because they don't advertise their boats and there are very few on the used boat market, they pass unnoticed by the majority of the sail community.

The visit to these boats is a very rewarding experience because they are made with passion by true boat lovers and because when you talk to the guy that is on the boat, you are not talking with a dealer, that many times doesn't know much about boats, but with the builder, or the designer.

Even if you are not a buyer they will have real pleasure in talking with someone that really appreciates and understands their work. Those guys really believe in what they are doing and they do it the best way they can, no matter the cost. In a word, they are in love with what they are doing.
Of course, these boats have to be expensive.

This thread will be mainly about these boats, as a way of letting you know about these gems. Let's see if you are interested. I will not post much. If you want to know more you have just to participate and make questions.

The first one it will be the "Sirius". I have had the pleasure to visit several times their boats and to talk with the builders (father and son).

These boats have the best interiors you can find, or at least that I have seen. Not only the quality, but the design and ergonomy are fantastic. You really won't believe you are in a 32ft boat. Just incredible and amazing; Have a look at it:

Sirius-Werft Plön | Forecabin | 32 DS for 2 forecabin
Sirius-Werft Plön | Owner´s cabin | 32 DS 4-berth comfort owner´s cabin
Sirius-Werft Plön | Workshop | 32 DS for 2 workshop

Now that the son is in charge they have modernized the outside look of the new boats, they look fantastic not only inside but also outside. The boats sail well and they have clients as far as Japan.

Sirius-Werft Plön | Versions of decks house | You have the choice

Another interesting point is the way they develop new boats. They work with the clients to collect suggestions on the shape and design of the boats. A truly interesting affair, between passionate clients and passionate builders.

Sirius-Werft Plön | 35 DS | Philosophy

Take a good look at their interesting site and if you find the boat interesting, please let me know, I can add some information.

Sirius-Werft Plön | english | Welcome at website of Sirius-Werft Plön

Regards

Paulo
 
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#2,848 · (Edited)
Bavaria 40



Well, like on the Hanse I have mixed feelings about the Bavaria 40. As you probably know I have owned a Bavaria 36ft (bought new in 2002) and globally I have only good things to say. Contrary to what most consider I think that it is a good endorsement the fact that Bavaria is probably the brand that sells more boats to charter companies.

Owners of big charter companies are very experienced in what regards boats and boats problems and durability and they know that the boats will experiment a huge amount of abuse. In fact in terms of use a 5 year old charter has the use of the average 20 year old boat. The fact they chose Bavaria means that they consider the boat more strong than the average mass market cruiser boat.

The mixed feelings: regarding 40fts, Bavaria, as Hanse is heavier than the French cruisers but also as Hanse the 40 has unusually big B/D (0.32). While the jeanneau has not a bad one D/B (0.30) but the Oceanis has only 0.27. That gives the Oceanis a low AVS (110º). That could not mean nothing if you sail with good weather but it is not good for an offshore boat.

Anyway to cut it short I think that Bavaria is on the right way in what regards the interior (that is better on the new vision series) but I just don't like the Farr design on the outside. The boat looks fat and old. I don't think that the design is better or more modern than the one from the previous model (till 2009). Take a look:

The 2009 boat





The actual series





If I was interested in a new Bavaria I would wait one or two years till the new series come to the 40ft range. Not only the boats look much better has the interior is not only well designed but very practical.

The 40ft interior



The Vision 42 interior. I think that the boats to come will reflect this style.





The style of the future series: The first boat, the Cruiser 56



But you never know, the new Vision series have a B/D a lot lower than the one on the previous series. If you want to buy an used 40ft Bavaria I would say that the better boat is the previous Vision 40 that is a very good cruising boat and that should be find at a nice price now that they have new models.

Maybe you can even find a new one on stock and in that one you should get a 25 to 30% rebate. Of course that does not mean nothing if you sell the boat in some years but if this is the boat you are going to keep, it will make a big difference. This is a fast boat with a B/D superior to the one you find on the new series of Vision, a stiff boat.

The 40ft Vision







Regards

Paulo
 
#2,849 ·
Giraglia and Midle of the sea race

While you can follow in direct another big race here (Middle of the sea race):

http://www.rolexmiddlesearace.com/tracker/#pt

http://www.rolexmiddlesearace.com/entrants/

Some more interesting Giraglia videos and for the ones that like small performance cruisers, that a look at an relatively inexpensive one doing 22K:D I will let you discover the maker;)



and the overall winner (is also leading the other race):



and the race official report:









 
#2,850 ·
Dehler 38

Well guys, Dehler launches a new 38!







LOA 11,30 m
LWL 10,40 m
Beam 3,75 m

Draft 2,00 m standard - 2,30 m competition
Displacement 7 000 kg standard - 6 600kg competition
Ballast 2 250 kg standard - 2 000 kg competition
Mast length above WL 17,82 standard - 18,20 competition

Total sail area
79,3 m² standard
82,4m² competition

Main sail 43,7/46,0 m²
Furling Jib 35,6/36,4m² (105%)

Only a foot longer than Dufour 36 Performance but 600kg heavier, at least in cruising spec. Hmm...

I like the Dehler 38R that should have been released a couple of years back better :D:





LOA 11,46 m
LWL 10,48 m
Beam 3,75 m

Draft 2,40
Displacement (light) 5 400 kg

Main sail 48,6 m²
Jib 36,0 m²
Code 0 95,0 m²
Spinnaker (mast head) 129 m²
 
#2,906 ·
Re: Dehler 38

Well guys, Dehler launches a new 38!







LOA 11,30 m
LWL 10,40 m
Beam 3,75 m

Draft 2,00 m standard - 2,30 m competition
Displacement 7 000 kg standard - 6 600kg competition
Ballast 2 250 kg standard - 2 000 kg competition
Mast length above WL 17,82 standard - 18,20 competition

Total sail area
79,3 m² standard
82,4m² competition

Main sail 43,7/46,0 m²
Furling Jib 35,6/36,4m² (105%)

Only a foot longer than Dufour 36 Performance but 600kg heavier, at least in cruising spec. Hmm...

I like the Dehler 38R that should have been released a couple of years back better :D:





LOA 11,46 m
LWL 10,48 m
Beam 3,75 m

Draft 2,40
Displacement (light) 5 400 kg

Main sail 48,6 m²
Jib 36,0 m²
Code 0 95,0 m²
Spinnaker (mast head) 129 m²
I was wondering when Dehler was going to address the gaping hole between 35 and 41 ft.. Maybe they will have a finished boat for Duesseldorf. Looks interresting. Hopefully the Dehler interior quality has not downgraded to Hanse standards.
 
#2,851 ·
Dehler 38

The boat is beautiful but the weight:confused:

A Salona 38 has about the same ballast but weights 500kg less on the basic version. The cruiser version from Salona is 100kg lighter than their racing one. The hulls don't seem to be much different, having the Dehler more beam (3.75 to 3.62m). Also regarding sail area, the cruising version of the Salona has more area than the racing version of the Dehler (88.4 to 82.4m2).

I don't know how much the Salona 38 will weight in the racing version (IBC) but I know that the difference in the 41ft is of about 650kg.

Maybe the Dehler race version will do well on compensated time:rolleyes:

But for a cruiser that is not much important even if I hate to be over sailed by another boat:D

The interior seems to be a huge improvement over the Dehler 41.

That is a boat to follow. Thanks for having posted it.

Regards

Paulo
 
#2,852 ·
Dehler 38

Some more information. They say about the boat:

"The new model is a combination of the traditional Dehler values, combined with contemporary features ... The Dehler 38 has an aggressive, timeless exterior and a contemporary designed interior.

The new Dehler 38 is a performance cruiser with a Possibility of upgrading to a more comfortable level or a more competition level.

The yacht is well balanced with emphasis on stability and lightweight, and in consonance with all the latest IRC and ORC rating systems that are representing the dominant rating systems worldwide.

Spacious open cockpit in standard version but possible to be closed with a optional large bathing platform. Dehler 38 has a multifunction bathroom in the 3 cabin layout that in the 2 cabin version is combined with a large luxurious bathroom with separate shower without compromising the space in the saloon."












 
#2,858 · (Edited)
Middle the sea race

After the line honors on Giraglia Esimit Europa has done the same on the Middle the sea race:)

Some images:





Only four boats have finished already the race. You can follow the others here:

Rolex Middle Sea Race

Fantastic race of Kuka Light, a small 42ft boat that is coming on the front pack, close to a very fast Coockson 50 and a Vismara 62 that has also made a great race (that is a performance cruiser among racing boats).



http://www.kuka-light.com/
 
#2,859 · (Edited)
Swan 60

Not to much wind on the Middle sea race. While we wait for some decent footage let's have a look at the relatively new Swan 60. Swan were known by its classical fast boats. Not anymore, I mean not in what regards fast. To be competitive they are not classical anymore.

Look at this Swan 60: It looks more a luxurious TP52 than an older Swan:D



Now have a look at the boat interior:



That's what I call speed with style:D
 
#2,860 ·
Middle sea race

And this are the boats that interest us most: Not racing boats neither big and ugely expensive performance cruisers, but performance cruisers between 30 and 45ft, affordable boats and many that you can find already on the used market:



On this group the one that is leading is a J122 followed by a 40ft ILC racer ahead of an VOR60, a Swan 56, three class40 racers, :eek:

Lisa a 44.7 First is not far away, ahead of another class40 and Elusive a First 45 is very near to that 40class racer.

Libertine a Comet 45 is also close, ahead of another J122.

Further back, in another group, another VOR60:eek: followed by a Comet 51.

Than a Xp44 side by side with a X41 racer, a J111, and another 40class racer.

Just a bit back, another J122.

Then another group, leaded by three boats very close: a Marina carbon 36:eek:, a Comet 45 and a Grand Soleil 43. Not very far away, very close, an Elan 350:eek: and a Salona 44.

and then a lot of more boats behind, some big but not fast, like a Carter55 or a Bavaria 50 vision.

There are here some surprising results only possible because this was a race with weak winds, like it is not unusual on the Med and that does not give a big advantage to the bigger boats.

To register the incredible good performance of the first J122 and globally of all J122, the mediocre performance of the two Vor 60 and of many class40 racers and the good performance of an Elan 350.

That indicates that on these conditions boats with the type of hull based on 40class racers are poor performers while more narrow traditional boats perform better. We can see that the 40class racers, much lighter and built for racing have here a performance similar to a well sailed 40ft performance cruiser. I guess that a boat like the cruising Pogo, more heavier and with a lot less sail would have done a lot worst, I mean in real time.

I hope that J122 win in real time. It seems to me they deserve it;)

....

...
 
#2,861 · (Edited)
Middle the sea race

While that incredibly fast j122 fights with an VOR60 (unimaginable but true Rolex Middle Sea Race ) some more movie, better ones:



These MOVIES are nicer and of better quality but you have to see them from the site:

Grand start for the Rolex Middle Sea Race | VSail.info

Rolex Middle Sea Race: Welcome

Giraglia Rolex Cup | Esimit Europa 2

And we can see that the winner is also a very narrow boat, much more than the VOR boats or RAN. I guess the Med likes less beamier boats:D

....
 
#2,862 ·
Paulo,
Sorry old friend, bit of confusion caused by me re those last posts of mine. Suffice it to say I didn't take in the posts re the Hanse and went straight for the HR. Remember that I am not so concerned with the performance as you are and look more for acceptable comfort levels both inside and out. For that I feel the HR makes most sense, even over the Malo for me. That said, I would also much prefer either the Swede or XC over the Hanse.

If you remember we looked quite seriously at the previous generation Hanse 400 before we bought the Malo and to be frank it was our overall disappointment with the Hanse that pushed us towards Malo. At the time I'd have gone preferably for a Dehler 45, even over the Malo but there were none available even vaguely in our price range. Hanse for me is just too Ikea down below. Really poor quality fitout in every respect though I admit they have a wonderful layout, shame they make it out of papier mache. if all I wanted was a weekend cruiser that would not be embarassed around the buoys then I guess the Hanse would do but that is not my preference.

To clear something up re Malo .... I was referring to the Malo 43 not the 40. The 40 was (I think) the first of the new generation Malos, the successor to our own Malo 39. The Malo 43 is the last of the old school Malos, I guess a replacement must be due very soon. For me I think that a new generation Malo 43 would be a dream boat. everything our 39 has with a bit more performance and a bit more room down below.

As to the transom stern v reverse sheer ..... I confess that with the older boats I like the transom but with the wider backside of the new models it looks clumsy. The transom stern does however offer a lot more in the way of storage capacity in the lazarette.


Cheers

Andrew B
 
#2,873 · (Edited)
Paulo,
Sorry old friend, bit of confusion caused by me re those last posts of mine. Suffice it to say I didn't take in the posts re the Hanse and went straight for the HR. Remember that I am not so concerned with the performance as you are and look more for acceptable comfort levels both inside and out. For that I feel the HR makes most sense, even over the Malo for me. That said, I would also much prefer either the Swede or XC over the Hanse.
Andrews,
Who would not prefer the XC42 over the Hanse:D? Pity it costs almost three times more and that makes all the difference.

Regarding that story anout the HR making more sense than the Malo in what regards comfort I don't agree with you and I think it is a lot of ********:D

Some years ago Voile and Voiliers tested at the same time the XC 42 against the Dufour 425, both boats at the same time in the water. Because the Dufour is a much lighter boat they tried to find a difference in sea motion and comfort between the two boats namely in what regards wave passage. Well they could not find any. That is true that the conditions were pretty much normal, I mean the weather was good and they believe and (I agree) that in rough conditions that should make some difference but.....we all sail pretty much on the test sail conditions and avoid bad weather.

So in what regards to make sense having a more heavier and slow boat on account of comfort, if we are nor talking about extreme boats...well:rolleyes:


Teaser du match XC 42 / Dufour 425 por AgatheArmand

If you remember we looked quite seriously at the previous generation Hanse 400 before we bought the Malo and to be frank it was our overall disappointment with the Hanse that pushed us towards Malo. At the time I'd have gone preferably for a Dehler 45, even over the Malo but there were none available even vaguely in our price range. Hanse for me is just too Ikea down below. Really poor quality fitout in every respect though I admit they have a wonderful layout, shame they make it out of papier mache. if all I wanted was a weekend cruiser that would not be embarassed around the buoys then I guess the Hanse would do but that is not my preference.

Andrew B
I agree about the interior and it is just a shame that they had finished with the epoxy option and that the boat has not a traveler.
The epoxy option made a lot of sense and at 8000 euros it was not expensive for what offered ( a lighter, stronger and waterproof boat).
The Hanse 415 has a lot to offer: the best stability in the class an a boat that is faster than the Oceanis and almost as fast as the Jeanneau.

Regards

Paulo
 
#2,863 · (Edited)
Sail Rocket

Vestas Sailrocket is closing on the Hydropter record



VESTAS Sailrocket 2 posted her personal best time of 50.98 knots over a 500 meter course with a peak speed of 53 knots.

Whilst the team is still dialling in the boat, these times are unofficial (not ratified by the WSSRC who govern the sport). ..

The time puts VSR2 only 0.4 knots behind Hydroptere's best 500 meter time. This means Hydroptere is still the fastest sailing 'boat' in the world... but only just. The Outright record is still over 4.5 knots away. The team are aiming for over 60 knots so are still frustrated by these speeds in the low 50's.


Well I like a lot more the Hydropter that contrary to this sailing machine is an offshore boat with capacity to sail with waves.

Some recent footage of the Hydropter some of it on the S. Francisco Bay:





 
#2,864 ·
Hi all,

I continue to follow this fantastic thread in lurk mode. So much to be gained here. I hope I can contribute some day. Special thanks to Paulo and the other regulars.

Regarding interiors, excuse me if this is a stupid question, but the thought arises.....I assume much of even higher end boats' interior surfaces consist of laminated wood trim on less expensive backing board of some sorts (marine grade plywood, etc.). Of course there's still a need for solid wood in high traffic/impact areas.

If one is ok w/ laminated wood for much of the interior surfaces, why not choose something other than plywood as the backing surface? I mean, why not "laminate" (choose whatever process you wish to affix to surfaces) the same really nice wood trim to something that is lighter and more resistant to water damage vs wood. Why not affix it to fiberglass or some structured, lightweight, impervious to water damage type surface? Of course you'd still likely use solid wood in certain areas, but why not have the best of both worlds: beautiful wood fascia while minimizing weight and avoiding the issues associated w/ wood?

Regards,
 
#2,865 · (Edited)
Hi all,

I continue to follow this fantastic thread in lurk mode. So much to be gained here. I hope I can contribute some day. Special thanks to Paulo and the other regulars.

Regarding interiors, excuse me if this is a stupid question, but the thought arises.....I assume much of even higher end boats' interior surfaces consist of laminated wood trim on less expensive backing board of some sorts (marine grade plywood, etc.). Of course there's still a need for solid wood in high traffic/impact areas.

If one is ok w/ laminated wood for much of the interior surfaces, why not choose something other than plywood as the backing surface? I mean, why not "laminate" (choose whatever process you wish to affix to surfaces) the same really nice wood trim to something that is lighter and more resistant to water damage vs wood. Why not affix it to fiberglass or some structured, lightweight, impervious to water damage type surface? Of course you'd still likely use solid wood in certain areas, but why not have the best of both worlds: beautiful wood fascia while minimizing weight and avoiding the issues associated w/ wood?

Regards,
Thanks, you are welcomed:)

The problem is that people just like the look of those wooden interiors that are reminiscent of old wooden boats. It happens the same with teak decks and even if many Americans and some Europeans will prefer the boats without that, even almost all Americans will prefer teak on the cockpit. Of course it has no advantage and increases weight and maintenance but boats are not only a rational thing;).

Regarding what you say, that is widely used on offshore racing boats, in some performance cruisers and in many fast multihulls.

One of the brands that use it and sells a lot of boats is Pogo. Here the 10.50:



here the 12.50:



Pogo 12.50 , Chantier Naval Structures from Andreas Lindlahr on Vimeo.

Other cruising boats like the RM that is made with Plywood and epoxy use the same material (plywood) on the interior. The RM is also a big sales success for this type of boat.

Have a look of the interior of the RM 1200





Regards

Paulo
 
#2,866 ·
The interiors you posted wasnt the point i was trying to make. I like the interior wood finish much better than the interiors you posted. I was making the point that the more wood one uses the more the boat will weigh. So i was pondering why they dont use a laminate (real) wood finish but laminate it to a lighter material so that you maintain the wood look without the weight and maintenance hassel.

Regards,
 
#2,867 ·
Xp 55



That is expensive and only makes sense in expensive fast boats. X yachts use it and I think not only on its performance line put also on the cruising boats. Off course, X yachts are very expensive boats.

I take the opportunity to post the first images of the new XP 55. That is a very fast performance cruising boat with capability to win regattas....and also to cruise in great comfort and in a beautiful interior.

Regarding that interior it is only possible in a very light and performant boat because all those materials, that look like real wood, are synthetic, strong, durable and very light. Off course, that has a price. I guess that make it like a HR, full of natural wood, would be less expensive:D













Regards

Paulo
 
#2,868 · (Edited)
Marina 36

Regarding the final results of the Middle sea race some comments about the performance of performance cruisers with less ore equal to 50ft (in real time):

As I have posted before, the more impressive results are from J122 (19º, 27º, 34º) . The fastest stayed at only a 13 hours and a bit from the fastest class 40 boat (16º), a Pogo40s2 (5d 0h 59m), that in a 5 days race is not much, considering that one is a racing boat and the other a performance cruising, but most of all he arrived 7 hours before the second 40class racer (23º) boat and left behind 2 other 40class racers (24º, 26º).

And that was not the only one, the second J 122 (27º) arrived only 6m after the last class 40 racer (26º) and the third one come also among the fastest 45fts, between a Comet 51 and a Xp44.

Curiously a J111, a racing boat has done not so good (40º) but I guess that has to do with the crew and not the sailing boat.

Among the other performance production boats that have done great and for this order, a Mylius 14e55 (17º) a Xp 44 (18º) a First 44.7 (32º), a First 45 (35º), a Comet 45.(37º) On the smaller boats two deserve mention, a racing Elan 350 (48º) and a boat that I did not know, a Marina 36 Carbon (44º), a boat made in Croatia (like the Salona) and that seems to be a very fast boat. Take a look:











The boat has 3.45m of beam, 2.45m of draft, 800Kg of ballast and weights 2450kg.

Even the normal cruising version weights less than 3000kg. Well, no wonder it is fast:D

I don't look at this results because I am interested in doing racing myself but just to see how the different boats and hull designs perform. I am interested in that;)

Comparing the result of these boats with a fast old one, a very well sailed Carter 55, the Elan 350 was faster by almost 2 hours and the best J122 by 14 hours.



And I say very well sailed because in compensated time the Carter 55 stayed one place ahead of the Elan 350.

...
 
#2,870 · (Edited)
Sorry mate. After signing that magazine for a long time (since the 80's) I given up about a year back. In my opinion they turned too much to the conservative side of boating. I guess they were going after the readers and sailors that in UK are pretty conservative and has they had on the same group a magazine with more modern views (Yachting world) it would not make sense targeting the same market. Now they seem to have separated the waters. I signed Yacht and Yachting instead. It seems to me that one is improving a lot.

For many months Yachting monthly did not test a single new boat. It seems that they went to far and that is changing but even on the last edition: A test on the Vancouver 27? A boat that Northshore stopped to build years ago because didn't sold a single boat for years? A boat designed 30 or 40 years ago?

Regarding cockpits I don't know what they say about it but cockpits are a function of the hull shape or the type of the boat and the interior options. Center cockpit boats don't have that cockpit because it is best (it is not) but because that's one of the ways to manage to put inside a big aft cabin.

Old boats had tiny cockpits because they used much narrow hulls and that's the space they got for it, boats based on solo racers have huge cockpits because the boats have an huge beam and all the beam brought aft.

Its the type of boat that is important, the cockpit comes with the territory and that is not an independent choice.

Regards

Paulo
 
#2,871 · (Edited)
Self sufficient energy

For a complete circumnavigation non stop and all of it from renewable sources:


Energy on board ACCIONA 100% EcoPowered por VendeeGlobeTV

I hope that on the next Vendee globe they will make this a mandatory rule. There are talks about that and the sailors are favorable to the idea.

What can be learned and the improvements will be huge and the use on cruising boats will be just a step away;)

By the way, the batteries are the same I have in my boat, I don't mean the brand, they are the same model and capacity...well I have two of those for the house service and a smaller one for the engine. I guess they have chosen well:D

...
 
#2,875 ·
Amazing footage that ranks up there with some of the Volvo video. But I have to say that I'm a bit surprised by the general absence of PFDs, harnesses and tethers. I realize it's a "coastal" race, but in those conditions it's easy to get swept over the side, and at those speeds it would take quite some time to turn around and recover a MOB. Just saying.
 
#2,884 ·
Hi,..

the conditions are not that bad. For that wind there is not a lot of sea. But you are right, the speeds are amazing and it would take a lot of time to recover a guy overboard. Maybe a cultural thing? I guess in Europe people are more concerned about safety. All those rules and regulations for more inconvenient they are have the advantage to create a mentality where safety is a real concern.

Regards

Paulo
 
#2,899 ·
Now they both look way to big for anything I'd want or need and they are by no means classically beautiful but I like the look of both of them. Certainly they both look to be of great character, not to mention individual.

Presumably very modern below the waterline, though hopefully not equipped with one of those awful torpedo keels.
 
#2,877 ·
Fox 10.20

We have been following the voyage of Adrien and Capucine on a small light and fast modern boat, a Fox 10.20.

Contrary to many people that have very little experience before normally bought an heavy boat to circumnavigate, these two were very experienced sailors and new exactly what type of boat they wanted. The hull was made professionally and they finished and mount all the rest.

They have passed New Zeeland and are now on the Indian Ocean:



 
#2,878 · (Edited)
Speed Dream

For years I have been seeing designs from Vlad Murnikov about his vision of the fastest monohull, a boat that could be as faster as a multihull, a huge boat (100ft) with the looks of a space ship. Well the designs were nice but the guy is not a leading NA and I guess it was just some dreamer with interesting ideas:





]

















Then, some time a go I heard that Roger Martin (a leading American NA) was involved in hull and deck shaping, general layout and detail design, that Hugh Welbourn (the one from DSS technologie) was part of the team and that Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) and sails was been developed by Tyler Doyle from Doyle Sails while SP-High Modulus was taking care of the structural engeniere. I thought to myself, jesus this is for real now.:D

When I heard that Lyman Morse was making a small prototype with 27ft I got really excited about it. After all they are promising the fastest monohull ever built, a boat with:

Delta-shaped hull, almost triangular in plan view, with a very narrow, wave-piercing bow to reduce resistance and improve seaworthiness.

Maximum stability and sail carrying capacity due to the innovative Ultimate Canting Keel with a bulb that comes out of water to provide the highest possible Righting Moment while completely eliminating drag.

Telescoping keel that retracts to reduce draft while in harbor and extends while sailing to maximize Righting Moment.

Stabilizing foils to further improve stability and reduce drag by partially offsetting boat weight. Similar to the DSS foils pioneered by Hugh Welbourn, SpeedDream wings are used in combination with canting keel and, in addition to lift, provide lateral resistance.

The resulting stability is far superior to all current keel boats while requiring only fraction of the ballast, thereby significantly reducing the total boat displacement.

The innovative and practical deck layout and superstructure styling that keeps crew safe and deck free of excess water even at high speed.


Well, the prototype is on the water;). The images are not spectacular and I start to have some doubts. I truly hope they will be soon posting more spectacular movies and that this one is just not showing the full boat potential.

To follow closely:cool:







 
#2,880 ·
Circumnavigation without stop on an A35

Alain Delors, if he kept its timetable, sailed away for a circumnavigation. One more you say. Not this one. This one is a sportive one. Non Stop, on a small fast boat (A35), kind of a personal low budget Vendee Globe, with a low budget cost (140 000 euros).

Is this guy crazy? Well, he is a very good sailor, the A35 is a very seaworthy boat. He is not one of those that sail away without knowing almost anything about sailing, but he is 63 years old and want to make a record time so he plans to go higher than 50º. Scary, at least for me:eek:

I wish him god luck, he is going to need it;)

You can follow the voyage here:

Le Tour du Monde d'Alain Delord | Carnet de voyage d'Alain Delord lors de son tour du monde en solitaire sans assistance







 
#2,881 ·
Haber 34

One of the boats that is going to be present at Dusseldorf is the Haber 34. It is not my kind of sailboat but it makes sense for those that want a small Motor-sailor that maximizes interior space and living quality. The boat is made in Poland and has been raising interest in Germany. they have a version that can lower easily the mast.

 
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