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Go Back   SailNet Community > Out There > Cruising & Liveaboard Forum > Second boat suggestions?
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Topic Review (Newest First)
11-26-2012 12:37 PM
Alex W
Re: Second boat suggestions?

The weird thing with the S2 center cockpit is that you give up all exterior storage space. There are no cockpit lockers at all. The freeboard also scared me away. The 28-2 has a lot of freeboard as well, but it feels like it gets blown around about as much or a little less than the C-25 (probably due to the extra weight). It is hard for me to make a direct comparison though, our new slip is a lot more sheltered than the one where we kept the C-25.

The P28-2 has a huge cockpit locker that is a lot like the dumpster on the C-25. Our's has more "systems" in it though, the hot water heater, cabin heater, holding tank, and shore power charger are all in there. There is still plenty of room for 6 fenders, mooring lines, a toolbox, deck brush, and the normal locker things.

Islander makes really nice boats, although the fabric headliner makes it harder to inspect them for leaks. I don't know how common they are on the east coast, but they are very common over here. Another 28 footer that often has a wheel here is the San Juan 28, but I don't think those are on the east coast much at all. It is also an IOR design, something that I was personally avoiding.
11-26-2012 12:30 PM
jimgo
Re: Second boat suggestions?

When searching for our first boat, I saw an S2 6.8 22' and LOVED that boat. I couldn't get the seller down to my price, so I had to walk away. I also saw a 9.8A that was for sale in the early part of the season, and it was BEAUTIFUL. I've thought those would be great boats for us. The 9.8C, and the Seidelman 28, are both interesting and tempting. There's one for sale in central NJ that I've been tempted to go see. I like the idea of a center cockpit for a lot of reasons, though I'm not sure I want that much freeboard when trying to dock in wind (our C25 got blown around a bit, and this seems like it would be worse). But the cabin looks like it would be a lot of fun for my family.

I'll have to keep an eye out for the Islanders; I haven't given them much thought.

Thanks for the great feedback!
11-26-2012 11:58 AM
Alex W
Re: Second boat suggestions?

I'm not sure that you'll find too many other Pearson sailboats in the 27-30 foot range that have the features that you are looking for. In particular the earlier 28' models (the 28-1 made in the mid 70s to around 82, and the Triton made before that) were both tiller boats. The 28-2 (1985 until 1989) is a wheel boat. They are all pretty different boats, the Triton is a very stout full keel boat that is one of the most common small across ocean vessels. The 28-1 and 28-2 are coastal cruisers, but the 28-2 is a more modern design with the types of features that you were looking for.

Islander 28 shoal draft is another boat that I'd keep an eye out for. Wheels were common (if not the default) and the layout will feel familiar yet more spacious compared to the Catalina 25. An Islander 30 was one of our top choices and I'm moored next to one right now. They are very nice boats, and the Islander 28 looks very similar if not better.

Another interesting boat to look at if you get the chance is a S2 9.2C. I didn't really care for it myself, but it is an interesting and fairly successful attempt to put 2 cabins into a 30' boat. They all have wheels and are pretty common so it should be easy to find one to view.

I looked at a lot of boats in the 28-32' size late summer and early fall this year when we were shopping. I mentioned the 28-2 not only because we bought one, but because it is one of the few 28' boats that I know of that has all of your requirements (except for catbird seats, and they are easy to add).
11-26-2012 10:38 AM
jimgo
Re: Second boat suggestions?

Thanks Alex. I've seen a few Pearsons listed in my price range. Most have been deeper draft, though. I'll have to keep this in mind.

I've seen a Allmand 31 and a Contest 31 which both look nice, too, and are in my range. The Contest has a deeper draft (4'10") while the Contest has a 3'9" draft. They are both tempting, but I'll also have crossed the "magic" 30' threshold, when docking/mooring becomes more expensive.

As you can see, I've got a lot to consider. It's nice to be in a position where I don't HAVE to buy anything, and don't have anything (major) to sell, either.
11-26-2012 10:25 AM
Alex W
Re: Second boat suggestions?

1986 Pearson 28-2 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

I recently moved up from a fin keel/tall rig Catalina 25 to a fin keel Pearson 28-2. It has most of the features that you are looking for (everything except for price). I don't know anything about this boat listed for sale, but it does have the shoal keel that you desire and is close enough for you to check out.

I'm loving the Pearson 28-2. Build and fit and finish quality are quite a bit nicer than the Catalina. The sailing performance also seems to be better (it points higher, but has similar performance in light air to my C-25 tall mast). The amount of storage and open space in the cabin is incredible and it is really nice having standing room. It feels huge because the main cabin is forward with a double sized quarterberth and head aft. The forward cabin is open to the V-berth.

Being under 30' long keeps my moorage lower. Ours has nice creature comfort systems including a heater and hot water. Motor access is pretty good.

The only downside that I can think of compared to the C-25 is that there are really only two double berths, although kids could sleep on the 5' long settes. There is a lot of freeboard which makes it get blown around quite a bit in high winds even with sails down, but the same is true of the C-25. The P28-2 feels a lot more stable in rough water though. Our fin keel heals quickly, but then stiffens up a lot and provides a nice ride.
11-26-2012 10:05 AM
jimgo
Re: Second boat suggestions?

Thanks guys. I've looked at the C30's but they seemed to have a deeper keel, and finding a wing/shoal draft in my price range had been tough. It really seemed the perfect boat otherwise!

I don't NEED to move up in size; but most boats in the < 30 foot range, especially the older boats in my price range, seem to be tiller steered. That's why I looked the O'Day 272LE's.

I have basically come to the same conclusion regarding the size/depth trade-off, and that is really making me question whether a sailboat is practical for us at this point. I can always rent a power boat a few weekends during the summer if I want to, and that will get me out on the water, too. I have a 15' Albacore that I can keep close to home and sail on for low cost, so that should help satisfy my sailing bug. I just worry that it won't be as comfortable or fun for my kids.

Oh we'll....decisions, decisions...
11-26-2012 09:48 AM
JimMcGee
Re: Second boat suggestions?

Jim,
We sail a Catalina 30 wing keel on Barnegat Bay. From your post I'd guess that last season you were sailing on Little Egg Bay or somewhere south of Barnegat Bay. We started out down there and the difference is depth is significant.

First if you sail in the bay you WILL bump bottom no matter what you sail and TowBoat US is a good idea. The good news it's a soft sand bottom and so far we've had no problem getting off on those rare occasions we've found an uncharted sand bar. A lot of people make it sound like grounding with a wing is the end of the world. It's not, at least in soft sand.

With kids Barnegat Bay offers more options for swimming and dock and dine stops. Tides on the Delaware are 6 to 8 feet with very strong currents. Not the place for kids to jump in the water. We've looked hard at the Chesapeake more than once. For us it's about an hour to the Barnegat from home (near the Betsy Ross bridge). It's two and a half hours to the northern marinas on the Chesapeake. That's a big deal if you're driving it every weekend.

As for wing keels going to windward you'll never notice the difference cruising. The reality is your sailing skills have more effect on your windward performance than your keel; and with a couple of kids on board you and your wife aren't going to be tweaking sails with every puff for maximum speed. BTW, all "shoal draft" Catalina's are wing keels.

You should be able to find a 27-28 in your price range with most of those features. What you will find is that stretching a little on price will get you a LOT more boat. For example check out this Catalina 30. Assuming it survived the storm it will give you double the living space below deck of a 27 and it will probably sell for around $13-14k. Just something to think about.

Best of luck in your search,
Jim
11-26-2012 07:42 AM
seaojoe
Re: Second boat suggestions?

hi Jimgo: its great that you've got your needs identified. Sorry it took the loss of your boat to define them.

I'm not sure how many of your boat needs will change if you change your sailing location.

Lets look at 'quality' boats under 10K, that could fit.
Sabre, Cape Dory, Alberg to name a few. Problem with them is their shoal draft version, isnt very shoal. I find the less I draw, the more chances I take, ergo touch bottom more often than I did when I had a big boat with more keel. My present boat draws 2'11" and I take advantage of that by sailing in places I've never been. Rivers and back bay sailing with the tide have opened up a new pallet on which to paint my daysails.

In looking at your price point, you'll be testing your skills to 'fix' things that will be wrong. While the boats I mentioned will have a big boat feel, they'll be older than catalina/o'day/hunter's.

As to where, which should be on the top of the list, then the boat type should follow. I'd pick Cape May or something near, on the Ocean or the Bay side of it. Mooring in Cape May harbor is a hoot. Lots of transients, lots of locals. A good blend of providers of local knowledge and possible future destinations. Cape May is a good jumping point to LIS, Block Island, Newport.

Caleb said it best 'its all about compromises'. There's no perfect boat and no perfect home port.
11-20-2012 08:42 PM
CalebD
Re: Second boat suggestions?

Jimgo,
I hear you on the calculus of what boat to buy for wherever you choose to sail. At least you have some options: Chessy, Delaware, Jersey shore.
You are also correct about boats in the 27 - 30' range in that usually they are deeper keeled, for good reason.

I happen to love sailing on salty water, like the LI Sound. The salt gets on you even if you don't go swimming if you are out there long enough. I have had to compromise and we moved our boat from the Sound to 30 miles up the Hudson, which is brackish and tidal like the lower Delaware. The Hudson is also pretty deep compared to the Jersey shore. There is also a nearly 2 knot current in the Hudson that comes and goes with the tides, like the Delaware. The current only adds to the challenge especially when racing. All locations are compromises just as each boat is a compromise.

The Chessy can be a great place to sail as well but is fairly shallow, but not quite as shallow as the Jersey shore. The summer traffic getting to and from there could add a hassle factor, just as keeping our boat on the LI Sound was a traffic nightmare sometimes. I assume that there can be some traffic getting to the Jersey shore on weekends as well.

If you really like the salty Jersey shore you might consider staying at 25 - 26 feet in boat length. Have you looked at any O'Day 25's? There are 2 at our club. Yes, these are center board boats but that makes them easier to get off any grounding. I was impressed with the size of the cabin on the O'Day 25' I looked at. The cabin on the O 25 might be bigger than my old Tartan 27' (shoal keel of 3'6" - but yes, center board). The O 25 cabin might not be much bigger than your C 25 though.

The Catalina 30' cabin will seem immense though compared to the above boats. Finding a C30 for < 10K in good working order will be a trick though. There may be several at rock bottom prices after Sandy but they may need a lot of work. Choosing a boat like this would likely rule out sailing on the Jersey shore where you were though.

It's all about compromises.

Good luck.
11-20-2012 05:16 PM
tomperanteau
Re: Second boat suggestions?

Have you considered a Catalina 30 with a fin keel? 3'10" draft and they are really beamy/roomy. If we had not needed a bit more boat, we would most certainly have ended up in one.
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